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View Full Version : Frantz Oil Cleaner on a Studebaker engine; If you haven't ever seen one, you have now!



PlainBrownR2
07-23-2013, 01:14 AM
While we were at the International Meet in Colorado Springs, we bought, well bought and removed, a set of truck engine and transmission mounts, and a truck water pump manifold assembly that was on a passenger car 259. While I was removing the water pump manifold, I happened to look at the nice polished oil cartridge assembly and broke out in the giggles. It was a partial flow block, but the oil filter assembly was a Frantz oil cleaner. So, out of pity for the aftermarket oil cleaner, I removed it too, along with the oil fill. What am I gonna do with it? I have yet to figure it out, other than I'm hanging onto it, and relegating its current state to a conversation piece! So, if you haven't seen one, well, you have now! :p

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080464_zps40722131.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080464_zps40722131.jpg.html)

The "media" was still in the cartridge, and it was well used too. Installing the "filter" is easy; Undo the strap, pull up the housing, pull out the wire holding it in the housing, and pull out the wire holding the center in the housing. Just reverse the order when you're ready for the new "media".

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080465_zps01b188dd.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080465_zps01b188dd.jpg.html)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080466_zpsa3460834.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080466_zpsa3460834.jpg.html)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080467_zpsc03712ab.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080467_zpsc03712ab.jpg.html)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080468_zps1c78c07d.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080468_zps1c78c07d.jpg.html)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080469_zps3aeeac42.jpg (http://s158.photobucket.com/user/PlainBrownR2/media/Frantz%20Oil%20Cleaner/P1080469_zps3aeeac42.jpg.html)

StudeRich
07-23-2013, 01:43 AM
That probably is genuine Chiffon 2 Ply... ah bathroom Tissue! When it is tightly packed with two layers of crisscrossed fine screen in the bottom and the outer "seal" ring, no paper will ever get loose in the engine and the Oil will be ultra finely filtered, slowly to remove moisture, carbon sludge etc. down to way lower micron size than any other Filter, which will prevent acid buildup in the Oil.
They work even better with a Full Flow Filter also.

Frantz Filters were certified for Aircraft use after they changed that clamp type lock to an Aeroquip positive Clamp.
They also made a 3 stacker for Diesels in Trucks, Busses RV's, Boats etc. That's right, 3 Rolls of TP.

Bi-pass Type Filters are making a comeback, they are now used on Diesels to supplement the Full Flow Filter to do a finer job of filtration to extend the life of a very large and expensive crankcase full of Oil.

One of the main reasons for their decline in the 70's and 80's was the way too diversified types of Engines and lack of under hood space. In the 50's and '60's it used to take 2 sides of one 8 1/2 X11 Instruction sheet to cover all American Make Engine installations, plus one "intruder", Volkswagen. There is now no way to do that with hundreds and now thousands of different engine compartments and Oil pickup and return locations and space to deal with.

I believe the Manufacturer, Sky Corp. has moved on to other products now.

E. Davis
07-23-2013, 12:33 PM
I knew a guy that used those on his Checker Taxi Cabs in the late 50's. He swore by them and claimed they saved him big bucks on oil changes.

PackardV8
07-23-2013, 12:50 PM
We have a forum member here who is an oil filtration expert. I'm waiting for him to weigh in on the Franz.

JMHO, but I put the Franz in the category with Marvel Mystery Oil, Sea Foam and STP. Those who use them are true believers. Then there are those who never buy or use them.

jack vines

(S)
07-23-2013, 01:02 PM
I use one of these, the oil stays nice looking all the way to the next oil change and rarely even gets to shades of black unless I stretch it out to 4K miles. I have it on a partial flow block, it has got to be better than nothing.........and is always a conversation starter when the hood is up.

Mike Van Veghten
07-23-2013, 01:50 PM
""I have it on a partial flow block, it has got to be better than nothing.........and is always a conversation starter when the hood is up.""


Maybe not... My 259 Larks engine has no filter (hasn't since shortly after I bought it just over 95k miles ago)...and it stays "visually" clean between changes...in the 2500 to 3000 mile range..!?

Despite the experts, I seriously doubt that much oil is "actually" filtered thru a .04" to .06" restrictor hole thru a 4000 mile change interval.

Mike

Alan
07-23-2013, 02:06 PM
I use Stilko's. Bought about 10 of them at $80 apiece in the mid 70's.

http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g171/artcloud/image05.jpg[/URL]

StudeRich
07-23-2013, 02:19 PM
Stilko's are a bit scary, wouldn't that have the ability to STOP ALL of the Full Flow to the bearings when clogged?
I always wondered if they have built in bypass circuits to make it a Partial Flow Filter to prevent this.
If that is the case you are better off without it or with a stock full flow AND a Frantz bi-pass type.

The Studebaker adapter/Mount, built in bi-pass may be dumping Oil most of the time because of the slow limited flow of the fine filtering TP as opposed to the coarse particle fast flow design of the stock setup.

They always advertised their cooler LOOK and actually COOLING ability, but beyond that I think they are useless. If ALL of the Oil is actually going through it, with more flow there is a much greater chance of Paper coming loose and getting into the Engine.

rusty nut garage
07-23-2013, 02:43 PM
Disconnect your hose and leave it disconnected. Start up the engine, and start you stop watch. Make a time stamp of when the rods start rattling. This should give you a good idea of how long it takes for 5-6 quarts of oil to filter thru a bypass filter............just to make it interesting do it at full rpm.
""I have it on a partial flow block, it has got to be better than nothing.........and is always a conversation starter when the hood is up.""


Maybe not... My 259 Larks engine has no filter (hasn't since shortly after I bought it just over 95k miles ago)...and it stays "visually" clean between changes...in the 2500 to 3000 mile range..!?

Despite the experts, I seriously doubt that much oil is "actually" filtered thru a .04" to .06" restrictor hole thru a 4000 mile change interval.

Mike

Alan
07-23-2013, 03:18 PM
Yes Rich; The Stilko's have a spring with an aluminum spacer at the top of the center tube, that has holes. When the pressure backs up it pushes the spacer away from the holes and it by passes the toilet paper. But it still goes through a 100 micron stainless steel filter screen that is both on top and on the bottom of the paper. That engine in the pic is B 48 and had over 275,000 miles on it.

garyash
07-23-2013, 03:24 PM
Just clean it up and mount it on the wall in the bathroom. Put it to use!

http://www.studegarage.com/images/other/frantz_filter_paperholder.jpg

rusty nut garage
07-23-2013, 03:46 PM
great idea I've got an old one I'm going to add this to the shop bathroom :D
Just clean it up and mount it on the wall in the bathroom. Put it to use!

http://www.studegarage.com/images/other/frantz_filter_paperholder.jpg

PlainBrownR2
07-23-2013, 04:08 PM
If yours is anything like mine though, unless you're into toilet paper rolls with the old engine oil scent in it, just remember to take the old one out! :lol:

All funnies aside, it is an interesting piece! It might end up someplace, whether bathroom fixture, kitchen towel dispenser, or engine block! :D

GThawkwind
07-23-2013, 05:01 PM
I use Stilko's. Bought about 10 of them at $80 apiece in the mid 70's.

http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g171/artcloud/image05.jpg[/URL]
Hey that's pretty sweet looking! Could you enlighten me a little? Is it as cool as it looks?

PlainBrownR2
07-23-2013, 05:06 PM
Just remember guys, and my '50 2R5 falls into this camp too, the partial flow filters were optional on the engines. My pickup, which has a 170 cid six, didn't have one when I got it, and it spent a great many years in a traditional farm truck role without one. The thinking was to change the oil every 5000 miles, and you were set.

Now, would I go these days without any sort of filter? Oh Lord no! It has the add on, drop in cartridge setup as cheap insurance!! :ohmy:

studerex
07-23-2013, 10:29 PM
I bought a couple cases of these at a yard sale in South bend. I given some to the club auctions so I could donate something I cared nothing about. I still have some new in the unopened boxes. With the paper rolls. Might try one someday but not with tolet paper.

SilverHawkDan
07-24-2013, 12:50 AM
For the record we loved the Frantz oil filters. The "we" I am referring to was all the employees of Valley Ring and Rebore. Our experience showed that the oil was like any other fluid. It would make it's own path of least resistance. When you remove the cartrdige "TP roll" there will be a path that has been cut through the paper. That is why real oil filters have a paper that has been chemically treated to resist that breakdown. I say "use at your own risk" as there are better filters out there. With the current cost of rebuilding or even fixing a Studebaker, or for that matter just about any engine, I would think it foolish to gamble when there is a proven alternative available. TMTC.
Dan
P.S. We loved STP too. If used once a year it works like it was designed. If you use it every oil change it can cause problems especially if you have a 160 thermostat and don't drive long distances. I saw the evidence every summer. I could spot a Frantz or an over jealous STP engine in the first five minutes of tear down. See I spent my Summers tearing down engines that were brought in for rebuilds.
P.S.S. As for Marvel Mystery oil. I still use it today. My 289 in the camper gets 4oz. added to the gas tank every fill up. I do not have hardened seats so I use it instead. How does it work? I have driven the engine over 5000 miles and most of that towing the Avanti on a two axle trailer. I checked the valve adjustment after the trip to Bonneville (1600 miles) and they were spot on. I rechecked them at 4000 miles and they needed very little adjustment (.001 to .002). So I will continue to use it. Besides it's a great conversation starter at the gas station. LOL.

wittsend
07-24-2013, 02:10 PM
In today's "environmentally friendly" world there is probably some law that requires a "septic safe" roll made from recycled fibers. If you want to replicate a Fram filter simple removed half the paper before installing.

Tom

PlainBrownR2
07-24-2013, 02:30 PM
Regarding the septic safe roll aspect of it, we have our own septic system. We're in a rural area and not on any sort of city sewer, thank goodness. But, because of it, we have to be careful about what we flush down our toilet. If it's septic safe, and most rolls are these days, that's great. If it's environmentally friendly, and can break down in our septic system, that's even better. In either case, anything not septic safe can become a real problem for us, because then it plugs up our septic system, and then we have to dig up the septic system to fish it out! :(

StudeRich
07-24-2013, 02:44 PM
/ Cut/I saw the evidence every summer. I could spot a Frantz or an over (Z) jealous STP engine in the first five minutes of tear down. See I spent my Summers tearing down engines that were brought in for rebuilds.

Interesting Dan, just exactly what did you find that led you to believe a Frantz Filter was used?

The "Story" about the "Oil trail through the Paper" only happens if you unwind too much paper and fit it too loosely.
I have removed plenty of used TP and never seen that, just super fine bearing particles that would be missed in a Fram, also water that cannot be removed by a Standard "Cartridge".

SilverHawkDan
07-24-2013, 05:09 PM
Good question Rich. There would be a fine layer of paper pulp. Sometimes 1/2" thick and sometimes up to an inch thick laying in the oil pan. Think fine looking dust. The only place that could come from was a toilet paper filter or a really cheap oil filter which in the day just wasn't available like today. I am not sure that the paper dust in the pan did any harm except it seemed to help create sludge. But we all know that sludge is also formed when the engine fails to get all the way warmed up, as in short drives to the store and back. Back then is was also common for people to remove the thermostat which was the kiss of death for many an engine. Back then Pennzoil was a sludge builder too. How could you tell the difference from and STP sludged engine form a Pennzoil one? You cannot remove STP in a hot tank. Caustic soda wouldn't even faze it. We would buy a core engine from the bone yard rather than rebuild an STP sludged engine to avoid the labor costs. So not sure if the paper dust was harmful or not as it would get pulverized in the oil pump and bearings but why introduce it if you don't have to? TMTC
Dan

GThawkwind
07-25-2013, 01:20 AM
What the hell does TMTC mean?! I just can't keep up with you guys on your internet slang......

PlainBrownR2
07-25-2013, 02:11 AM
I can't say much about whether or not there was sludge in the pan of the engine that this oil cleaner came from. The engine was fairly well used, and from the condition of the block, apparently was sitting in either a truck that was well used, or a pretty dusty barn. The TP roll that was in it did smell of old oil(I thought it was gas at first). In short, the engine it came from appeared to come from an operating truck at one time, but beyond that, I have no idea. So if I want to find out anything on what the paper dust will do, if it becomes an issue, I'll have to figure it out for myself, which is not much of a shocker. :rolleyes: I will say that I've cleaned out worse from a engine pan. The 259 six quart pan that I have on the 289 on my '55, had the former remains of the grey sludge and old oil from the many years of leaded fuel when it was driven in the 60's. :rolleyes:

There's a little bit of additional information on that engine block from where this unit came from, in that it was a partial flow block, but did not have a separate oil cartridge. The Frantz oil cleaner was the cartridge, where it was added to the block, or it replaced the drop in cartridge.

SilverHawkDan
07-25-2013, 11:13 AM
Sorry about the net slang. TMTC That's My Two Cents as in that's my two cents worth of knowledge/experience/opinion

JoeHall
07-25-2013, 12:54 PM
My experience has been that the STP shows up in the bottom of the oil pan. It looks and feels kinda like super slick, sludge, that is not dirty.

Sludge from non-detergent oil and/or leaded gas also winds up in the bottom of the pan, but is super thick, not so slick, and gray/black colored.

I once removed the drain plug from a 1960 Lark VI, and nothing came out till I stuck a large screwdriver through the 1/2" of sludge. The car only had 40,000 miles on it. With the pan off, it took a putty knife to scrape it out. That engine had sludge everywhere, throughout the block.

The STP I have encountered was in oil pans, and came out when wiped aggressively with rags. I don't recall encountering STP elsewhere besides the pans.

SilverHawkDan
07-25-2013, 09:40 PM
STP also builds up in the lifter galley area. All the low spots will have a layer of it. But I don't consider it a bad thing as the positive effects of running it outweigh a little build up. Again it doesn't all drain out when you change the oil, so there is no need to add it every oil change. Used correctly it does prolong engine life and lowers operating temperatures. Also when I was a fleet mechanic we got free oil analysis on three samples per month. For an experiment I sent samples form three police cars two months in a row. The first month the oil was warm. The second month the oil was hot, so hot I had to wear rubber solvent type gloves. The hot sample showed more impurities and foreign matter than the warm samples. Since then I try to drain my oil when hot but usually not super hot like the samples I sent in. No sense getting burned. I figure the more impurities I remove from the by products of combustion the better.
Dan