Motor Trend - Letters to the Editor, March, 1964

[2R2]

From the March ,1964 issue of Motor Trend. This would be the first issue people would have had time to comment on the closing of South Bend. First letter is from Bill Dredge, Public Relations Director for Studebaker. Anyone have any idea how long he worked for Studebaker?

[BobPalma]

'Not too long, Eric; perhaps 3 or 4 years.

Here are two personal letters from Bill Dredge that demonstrate how dramatically things changed from November 1963 to February 1964.

Note the first letter; probably an IBM Selectric typewriter with a sharp, one-time carbon ribbon, typed by a Secretary:




And then, after he lost his Secretary and his nice IBM Selectric, he was reduced to typing his own letters on an old fabric-ribbon Royal or Underwood:



My, how times changed quickly, eh? BP

[2R2]

Bob,

I have seen the first letter you posted before, but never the second...and I admit (and I think I know Stude history pretty good) it is the first time I have ever heard of them casting AMC engine parts. That is an interesting letter. By chance, any idea what article in Car Life he is referencing? At first I thought maybe the "Build Your Own Stude (R4)" but right now I am to lazy to dig it out.
He had to have a tough job, trying to keep some positive news flowing at the time. I would guess people were leaving, both on their own or due to downsizing, and the morale had to be pretty bad for not only Bill Dredge, but anybody still there. I have often wondered what it was like for the people who worked in the administration building after the factory shut down, especially those associated with the auto division. Had to be tough driving by all of the empty factories, a reminder of what once was. But then, I guess they should have been thankful they were still working...at least for a little bit longer.

[BobPalma]

Bob,

I have seen the first letter you posted before, but never the second...and I admit (and I think I know Stude history pretty good) it is the first time I have ever heard of them casting AMC engine parts. That is an interesting letter. By chance, any idea what article in Car Life he is referencing? At first I thought maybe the "Build Your Own Stude (R4)" but right now I am to lazy to dig it out.
He had to have a tough job, trying to keep some positive news flowing at the time. I would guess people were leaving, both on their own or due to downsizing, and the morale had to be pretty bad for not only Bill Dredge, but anybody still there. I have often wondered what it was like for the people who worked in the administration building after the factory shut down, especially those associated with the auto division. Had to be tough driving by all of the empty factories, a reminder of what once was. But then, I guess they should have been thankful they were still working...at least for a little bit longer.

Eric, I think it was the Car Life R4 Build article but, ironically (and I know you won't believe this), I don't think I have a copy of that article to reference! (But I might; if so, I haven't seen it for so long I don't remember where it is.)

Anyway, yes; I've always thought those two letters, the professional nature of the first one and the downright crude nature of the second, pretty much told the story of what happened after Janaury 1, 1964 in South Bend.

'Had to be sad and trying times for those folks, for sure. BP

[Milaca]

Bob Palina???
I believe that this is also the first time that I have heard of Studebaker using it's foundary for casting American Motors engine blocks. Did they do castings for other companies too? Who cast the engine blocks for AMC after Studebaker quit? Did the new owner of the Studebaker foundary continue the contract?

[8E45E]

Studebaker doing contract work for AMC engines was mentioned here: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...motors+foundry

Craig

[Milaca]

Studebaker doing contract work for AMC engines was mentioned here: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...motors+foundry

Craig

The Lamberti files that Mr. Quinn shared with us are great. So much information. With all of the work Studebaker had for the military and other automobile manufacturers, seems to me that they would have been more profitable doing this type of work than manufacturing automobiles in Canada. Perhaps the profit margins were too small?

[8E45E]

Perhaps the profit margins were too small?

Or the facilities too old to be viable for the long term?

Craig

[BobPalma]

Bob Palina???
I believe that this is also the first time that I have heard of Studebaker using it's foundary for casting American Motors engine blocks. Did they do castings for other companies too? Who cast the engine blocks for AMC after Studebaker quit? Did the new owner of the Studebaker foundary continue the contract?

The Bob Palina thing is a running joke, Brent; a Secretary once misspelled my name when replying to a joint letter cousin George Krem and I had sent. It only appeared a couple times. Today, with computers, it might have taken root forever!

Mr. Dredge's February letter says they "are running out their contract" with AMC, so there is reason to believe it didn't continue much longer. AMC was developing their own new family of engines at the time; first, the all-new 232 six for the mid-year 1964 Rambler [Classic] Typhoon and, then, the all-new V8 that was introduced mid-year 1966 as a 290 in the Rambler American series.

(Interestingly, The Standard Catalog of American Cars 1946-1975 reports that only 623 1966 Americans were equipped with the new 290 V8. I remember seeing a plain, cheapie little dark blue 1966 American 220 series 2-door with 290 and 4-speed at Northside Rambler in Indianapolis shortly after they came out with the new 290, and thinking how much the little car had the same character as a 1964 Studebaker Commander or Challenger V8 2-door.)

I believe (but have no documentation offhand) that AMC was using Studebaker to "build out" their old engines while they configured their own foundry, or made other arrangements, to cast their all-new six and eight engine blocks.

For the 1967 model year, production of which would have begun late summer 1966, AMC was using their new engines exclusively in different displacements; 199 and 232 for the six, and 290 and 343 for the V8. The V8 would later be enlarged to 390 in mid-year 1968 for the new AMX...and, in the 1970s, 401. BP

[studegary]

'Not too long, Eric; perhaps 3 or 4 years.

Here are two personal letters from Bill Dredge that demonstrate how dramatically things changed from November 1963 to February 1964.

[I]Note the first letter; probably an IBM Selectric typewriter with a sharp, one-time carbon ribbon, typed by a Secretary:


]BP[/B]

I disagree with your assumption. The Selectric was introduced in 1961. It originally only came with a fabric ribbon. I do not remember the carbon ribbon Selectrics as coming out until after this letter. The alignment does not look good enough to have come from a typeball Selectric. I believe that the letter was typed by a good typist, the secretary "dm", on a good typebar typewriter, perhaps an IBM Model B or C. Carbon Ribbons were available on IBM typebar machines at that time (and long before). It was typed on a Standard model, not an Executive model with proportional spacing. [This is one of the areas that I have years of experience on.]

[BobPalma]

I disagree with your assumption. The Selectric was introduced in 1961. It originally only came with a fabric ribbon. I do not remember the carbon ribbon Selectrics as coming out until after this letter. The alignment does not look good enough to have come from a typeball Selectric. I believe that the letter was typed by a good typist, the secretary "dm", on a good typebar typewriter, perhaps an IBM Model B or C. Carbon Ribbons were available on IBM typebar machines at that time (and long before). It was typed on a Standard model, not an Executive model with proportional spacing. [This is one of the areas that I have years of experience on.]

I'll certainly defer to your experience on this one, Gary! BP

[kurtruk]

Can you imagine..."the ultra-modern Ford lightweight 289 engine," if that had gone into our Studes! Oh the confusion with the know-it-alls at car shows!

[BobPalma]

Can you imagine..."the ultra-modern Ford lightweight 289 engine," if that had gone into our Studes! Oh the confusion with the know-it-alls at car shows!

So true, Kurt, but it was never a real possibility.

At the time, Ford was having trouble producing enough 289 V8s for their own lines, especially in light of the new Mustang's phenominal success, and people preferring V8 Mustangs. Well into the 1966 model year, Ford still had a 289 V8 bottleneck, so they undoubtedly expressed zero interest in selling those engines to anyone outside FoMoCo.

In fact, the shortage of V8s was responsible for their producing the cheeky, risque ad campaign, "Six and the Single Girl," advertisements during the 1966 model year encouraging young women customers (and anyone else attracted to the ad) of buying a Mustang Six, rather than a V8! BP

[8E45E]

At the time, Ford was having trouble producing enough 289 V8s for their own lines, especially in light of the new Mustang's phenominal success, and people preferring V8 Mustangs. Well into the 1966 model year, Ford still had a 289 V8 bottleneck, so they undoubtedly expressed zero interest in selling those engines to anyone outside FoMoCo.

Well, they WERE burdened with a contract that was inked before the Mustang came into existence which they had to honor; even after the competition bought Rootes Group!! http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...hlight=sunbeam

Craig

[BobPalma]

Well, they WERE burdened with a contract that was inked before the Mustang came into existence which they had to honor; even after the competition bought Rootes Group!! http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...hlight=sunbeam Craig

Good reminder, Craig. Do you know how many Rootes Group was actually buying? BP