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**Dick Steinkamp** · 05-10-2007, 08:03 AM

quote:Originally posted by bondobilly

A) does it make a difference which way the car is facing on the trailer. I was informed to place the front end (back car onto trailer) over the trailers wheels.

Hmmm...I do the opposite. I find it easier to "dial in" the proper tongue weight with the car on the trailer front end first (front engined cars). I think it might be difficult to get tongue weight with the car on backwards...especially a long car on a short trailer.

You'll want some tongue weight to insure it pulls straight...maybe 4-500 pounds. Too little and the trailer will have a mind of it's own. Too much and the steering becomes light and unsafe.

quote:
B) I have a 2007 leased Navigator, rated at 9000 lbs or more for towing, expert tells me to have or he will upgrade Navigators suspension.

The MAX a Navigator is rated for is 9,000 for towing. I would guess that would be with a tow package, low ratio rear end, trans cooler, etc. Check your specific vehicle to make sure it is rated properly for what you will be towing. (it probably will be...your Hawk on a typical trailer should be 5,500 pounds or so and I would think most Navigators would be rated to tow that without suspension upgrades)

quote:
D) Do I need a winch?

No...drive the car on the trailer.

Make sure you have installed a class 3 hitch designed for your truck if not already equipped. Also, make sure you have a good electronic brake controller installed like the Prodigy...

TEKONSHA | Error

http://www.tekonsha.com/prodig.html

Tekonsha | Brake Controllers

Make sure it is wired correctly including the 12v wire to keep the breakaway battery charged.

Get some good tie downs. I use these from Mac's...

http://www.macscustomtiedowns.com/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=25

If you haven't towed before, practice, practice, practice with the trailer empty first. Learn how to turn with the trailer attached. Practicing backing...straight, into a right angle, etc. Get a good feel for the rig. Try different brake settings until you have that dialed in for an empty trailer. With the Prodigy, it will probably be something like no initial boost and maybe 5 volts max. You don't want the trailer wheels to slide, but you want them to at least be stopping the trailer weight.

Load the car and get some experienced help putting it on the right position on the trailer and tieing it down the first time. Practice driving with the load. Dial in the brake controller with the load (maybe 1-2 on the initial boost setting and 6-8 volts). See how the load effects acceleration and braking. Drive accordingly.

**Dick Steinkamp** · 05-10-2007, 08:03 AM

quote:Originally posted by bondobilly

A) does it make a difference which way the car is facing on the trailer. I was informed to place the front end (back car onto trailer) over the trailers wheels.

Hmmm...I do the opposite. I find it easier to "dial in" the proper tongue weight with the car on the trailer front end first (front engined cars). I think it might be difficult to get tongue weight with the car on backwards...especially a long car on a short trailer.

You'll want some tongue weight to insure it pulls straight...maybe 4-500 pounds. Too little and the trailer will have a mind of it's own. Too much and the steering becomes light and unsafe.

quote:
B) I have a 2007 leased Navigator, rated at 9000 lbs or more for towing, expert tells me to have or he will upgrade Navigators suspension.

The MAX a Navigator is rated for is 9,000 for towing. I would guess that would be with a tow package, low ratio rear end, trans cooler, etc. Check your specific vehicle to make sure it is rated properly for what you will be towing. (it probably will be...your Hawk on a typical trailer should be 5,500 pounds or so and I would think most Navigators would be rated to tow that without suspension upgrades)

quote:
D) Do I need a winch?

No...drive the car on the trailer.

Make sure you have installed a class 3 hitch designed for your truck if not already equipped. Also, make sure you have a good electronic brake controller installed like the Prodigy...

TEKONSHA | Error

http://www.tekonsha.com/prodig.html

Tekonsha | Brake Controllers

Make sure it is wired correctly including the 12v wire to keep the breakaway battery charged.

Get some good tie downs. I use these from Mac's...

http://www.macscustomtiedowns.com/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=25

If you haven't towed before, practice, practice, practice with the trailer empty first. Learn how to turn with the trailer attached. Practicing backing...straight, into a right angle, etc. Get a good feel for the rig. Try different brake settings until you have that dialed in for an empty trailer. With the Prodigy, it will probably be something like no initial boost and maybe 5 volts max. You don't want the trailer wheels to slide, but you want them to at least be stopping the trailer weight.

Load the car and get some experienced help putting it on the right position on the trailer and tieing it down the first time. Practice driving with the load. Dial in the brake controller with the load (maybe 1-2 on the initial boost setting and 6-8 volts). See how the load effects acceleration and braking. Drive accordingly.

**BShaw** · 05-10-2007, 08:22 AM

Just my opinion...

A. I prefer going on the trailer car-forward. Backing up on ramps (for me) is a recipe for disaster! The key is to balance the weight as much as is possible to avoid having too much weight on the tail of the trailer. You need to have weight on the tongue for safe and proper towing without exceeding the tongue weight capacity of your hitch/vehicle.

B. I'd think that a vehicle rated for 9000 lb towing would already have enough suspension muscle to handle the typical tongue weight for that kind of capacity. If not, perhaps a load-leveler hitch instead of permantly beefing up the rear suspension?

C. You CAN do it that simply, Bill... IF you literally want to "drag" said car!

D. A winch is nice if your car decides not to run/drive. But you don't need a monster winch for a car that rolls and just occassional use. I have one of those $79.99 specials (see pic) that comes with a plate that slips over a hitch ball.

Then, I made a bracket on the front of the trailer to hold a hitch ball. Then, IF i need to winch the car on I simply get out the portable winch, slip in over the ball, hook up to 12 volts and go to town. Of course, if you are given to dragging Stude projects out of the pasture, a permanent HD winch is best.

E. Don't we all need to do that? Maybe we can arrange to get an SDC therapy discount?

EDIT: Plus, what Dick says above.

BShaw,Webmaster

60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

**BShaw** · 05-10-2007, 08:22 AM

Just my opinion...

A. I prefer going on the trailer car-forward. Backing up on ramps (for me) is a recipe for disaster! The key is to balance the weight as much as is possible to avoid having too much weight on the tail of the trailer. You need to have weight on the tongue for safe and proper towing without exceeding the tongue weight capacity of your hitch/vehicle.

B. I'd think that a vehicle rated for 9000 lb towing would already have enough suspension muscle to handle the typical tongue weight for that kind of capacity. If not, perhaps a load-leveler hitch instead of permantly beefing up the rear suspension?

C. You CAN do it that simply, Bill... IF you literally want to "drag" said car!

D. A winch is nice if your car decides not to run/drive. But you don't need a monster winch for a car that rolls and just occassional use. I have one of those $79.99 specials (see pic) that comes with a plate that slips over a hitch ball.

Then, I made a bracket on the front of the trailer to hold a hitch ball. Then, IF i need to winch the car on I simply get out the portable winch, slip in over the ball, hook up to 12 volts and go to town. Of course, if you are given to dragging Stude projects out of the pasture, a permanent HD winch is best.

E. Don't we all need to do that? Maybe we can arrange to get an SDC therapy discount?

EDIT: Plus, what Dick says above.

BShaw,Webmaster

60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

**JBOYLE** · 05-10-2007, 09:10 AM

I think all Navigators have the tow package...

And check the owners manual....on my V-10 Excursion it tells me to switch off the overdrive while towing.

63 Avanti R1 2788
1914 Stutz Bearcat
(George Barris replica)

Washington State

**JBOYLE** · 05-10-2007, 09:10 AM

I think all Navigators have the tow package...

And check the owners manual....on my V-10 Excursion it tells me to switch off the overdrive while towing.

63 Avanti R1 2788
1914 Stutz Bearcat
(George Barris replica)

Washington State

**glen** · 05-10-2007, 09:36 AM

Ditto on all the above, though when I drove a F*#d F350 diesel
dually and its cousin a F250 with a V-10, I alway had a class 4
hitch then I could pull anything upto and including 6 horses
at once, in a very long trailer. From what I remembered it was
wasn't that much difference in cost, between a 3 and a 4 hitch.
Yes by all means turn off the O/D, then you will be in what
we loving call "hauling mode", letting the gears work manually.
Your Navigator should be just find, as it's really a truck under-
neath with some more creature comforts, in the cabin.

glen Brose
Tumbleweed Flats, AZ

**glen** · 05-10-2007, 09:36 AM

Ditto on all the above, though when I drove a F*#d F350 diesel
dually and its cousin a F250 with a V-10, I alway had a class 4
hitch then I could pull anything upto and including 6 horses
at once, in a very long trailer. From what I remembered it was
wasn't that much difference in cost, between a 3 and a 4 hitch.
Yes by all means turn off the O/D, then you will be in what
we loving call "hauling mode", letting the gears work manually.
Your Navigator should be just find, as it's really a truck under-
neath with some more creature comforts, in the cabin.

glen Brose
Tumbleweed Flats, AZ

**stude freak** · 05-10-2007, 01:25 PM

The only way i would halfway think of towing a vehichle rear end first is one with out a engine or tranny.Then it would have to be only way i could get it on trailer.Just remember you dont need to put car all the way to the front rail on trailer.Find the 'sweetspot' the position where trailer has enought weight on hitch to provide towing with out fishtailing all over the road.Even with less weight due to no engine the front to rear balance in weight due to wheel location would still make more weight on rear of trailer.And always make sure the hitch is securely locked on ball,I use a master lock on mine but a bolt with nut screwed on will work. Oh yes be sure and check to see if ball is secure each time you hook up or stop for gas.Nothing is more heart stopping than seeing your tailer pass you at intersection,believe me i know.

David Baggett '53 coupe

**stude freak** · 05-10-2007, 01:25 PM

The only way i would halfway think of towing a vehichle rear end first is one with out a engine or tranny.Then it would have to be only way i could get it on trailer.Just remember you dont need to put car all the way to the front rail on trailer.Find the 'sweetspot' the position where trailer has enought weight on hitch to provide towing with out fishtailing all over the road.Even with less weight due to no engine the front to rear balance in weight due to wheel location would still make more weight on rear of trailer.And always make sure the hitch is securely locked on ball,I use a master lock on mine but a bolt with nut screwed on will work. Oh yes be sure and check to see if ball is secure each time you hook up or stop for gas.Nothing is more heart stopping than seeing your tailer pass you at intersection,believe me i know.

David Baggett '53 coupe

**61hawk** · 05-10-2007, 02:08 PM

Also remember to "tie down" the suspension and allow the body to float/bounce/flex. I was taught to use at least one chain with the straps. It's "okay" if the car comes lose, you just don't want it coming off of the trailer or rolling into the tow vehicle. Well not "okay", but with a chain as a backup, you know it's not going too far. Tie a knot in the chain and insert a bolt through the two ends near the knot. Then drive a few miles, check the straps, drive a little further, check the straps, and as you feel comfortable... pit stops, gas, etc. Being a pilot, you know the walk around checklist.

Lee

**bondobilly** · 05-10-2007, 02:08 PM

quote: I was informed to place the front end (back car onto trailer) over the trailers wheels.

[u]NO!!!!</u> I can't imagine anybody telling anybody to do that!

[/quote]

The person who offered that suggestion was Max Corkins. Infact all the suggestions were offered by him. Maybe I should stop listening to him as he sold me the 56J that I restored, which Ebon described as less than a parts car.

Happy Trails to you, Happy Trails to you.

Bill......why is there a Golden Hawk following me so closely....Glass

**61hawk** · 05-10-2007, 02:08 PM

Also remember to "tie down" the suspension and allow the body to float/bounce/flex. I was taught to use at least one chain with the straps. It's "okay" if the car comes lose, you just don't want it coming off of the trailer or rolling into the tow vehicle. Well not "okay", but with a chain as a backup, you know it's not going too far. Tie a knot in the chain and insert a bolt through the two ends near the knot. Then drive a few miles, check the straps, drive a little further, check the straps, and as you feel comfortable... pit stops, gas, etc. Being a pilot, you know the walk around checklist.

Lee

**bondobilly** · 05-10-2007, 02:08 PM

quote: I was informed to place the front end (back car onto trailer) over the trailers wheels.

[u]NO!!!!</u> I can't imagine anybody telling anybody to do that!

[/quote]

The person who offered that suggestion was Max Corkins. Infact all the suggestions were offered by him. Maybe I should stop listening to him as he sold me the 56J that I restored, which Ebon described as less than a parts car.

Happy Trails to you, Happy Trails to you.

Bill......why is there a Golden Hawk following me so closely....Glass

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