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**DEEPNHOCK** · 10-17-2005, 02:34 PM

Asking questions is a good thing...
From your other questions, I am curious about the trans in your GT Hawk.
'If' the trans in your GT is an automatic, and it has a floor shift, then it should be a Powershift transmission. That's a pretty good auto transmission. Changing a Hawk over to a 4 speed will be a bit of work, as you will have to get all the clutch linkage pieces, including the pedal. Then there's the bellhousing that will need dialing in (which can't be realistically done in the car), as well as having the crank bolts changed (which requires removal of the oil pan and the rear main bearing cap)... You'll still need the shifter linkage pieces and the riser pad for the floor board.
After all that you need to remember that both the 4 speed and the auto trans still have 1:1 ratios in drive and 4th gear, so you won't gain any advantage mileage wise..... Now an overdrive 5 speed would gain you some mpg, depending on your rear end gear, but the custom fab work that a 5 speed will require will just be added on top of all the 4 speed stuff, but now you'll have to add a rear crossmember needing to be built up and a shortened and balanced driveshaft.
Anything can be done with enough time and money...
In My opinion, you should join the SDC and your local chapter of the SDC. Lot's of help available locally... Betcha a windshield could be scrounged up easy enough without a big freight bill.. And a local member may even show you how to do the R&R yourself.
Get the Hawk home, clean it up real well, do the basic lube oil and filter... By all means, do the brakes first, before you drive it anywhere...
Have fun with it!
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by dallastx75208

Just bought a 62 Stude Hawk. Going to have a lot of questions. The car is at my brothers right now and will be delivered to me at Christmas when he gets to town.
It has a three speed on the floor. I was told this could be changed to a 4 speed or even a borg warner 5 speed. Has anyone done this?
I am also looking for a windshield. Any ideas?

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

**dallastx75208** · 10-17-2005, 02:39 PM

I did join. I am sorry If I missled you. It is a three speed manual on the floor.

quote:Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK

Asking questions is a good thing...
From your other questions, I am curious about the trans in your GT Hawk.
'If' the trans in your GT is an automatic, and it has a floor shift, then it should be a Powershift transmission. That's a pretty good auto transmission. Changing a Hawk over to a 4 speed will be a bit of work, as you will have to get all the clutch linkage pieces, including the pedal. Then there's the bellhousing that will need dialing in (which can't be realistically done in the car), as well as having the crank bolts changed (which requires removal of the oil pan and the rear main bearing cap)... You'll still need the shifter linkage pieces and the riser pad for the floor board.
After all that you need to remember that both the 4 speed and the auto trans still have 1:1 ratios in drive and 4th gear, so you won't gain any advantage mileage wise..... Now an overdrive 5 speed would gain you some mpg, depending on your rear end gear, but the custom fab work that a 5 speed will require will just be added on top of all the 4 speed stuff, but now you'll have to add a rear crossmember needing to be built up and a shortened and balanced driveshaft.
Anything can be done with enough time and money...
In My opinion, you should join the SDC and your local chapter of the SDC. Lot's of help available locally... Betcha a windshield could be scrounged up easy enough without a big freight bill.. And a local member may even show you how to do the R&R yourself.
Get the Hawk home, clean it up real well, do the basic lube oil and filter... By all means, do the brakes first, before you drive it anywhere...
Have fun with it!
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by dallastx75208

Just bought a 62 Stude Hawk. Going to have a lot of questions. The car is at my brothers right now and will be delivered to me at Christmas when he gets to town.
It has a three speed on the floor. I was told this could be changed to a 4 speed or even a borg warner 5 speed. Has anyone done this?
I am also looking for a windshield. Any ideas?

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

**N8N** · 10-17-2005, 02:49 PM

As you probably guessed from Jeff's reply, a 3-speed floor shift wasn't a factory option on a '62 Hawk. Only vehicles off the top of my head that I can think had them from the factory would have been fleet vehicles (Lark chassis) or a base model Avanti. So I guess you will have to crawl under there and find out what you have and report back. If it is a stock, unmodified Stude tranny, the good news is that a 4 or 5 speed swap just became that much easier as you already have the clutch linkage and bellhousing in place, you just need to worry about sourcing the actual tranny, shifter, and driveshaft (and modifying whatever needs to be modified if you go with a 5-speed)

good luck

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop

http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

**Roscomacaw** · 10-17-2005, 04:17 PM

Well Nate, the bellhousing wouldn't be the same for a 4-spd (assuming this IS a T-86 3spd). And some of the clutch linkage pieces are different too.
Dallas, does it have overdrive? Man, it's tought to beat the versatility of a 3spd O/D setup![}

] If you drive it right, it's like having a 5-spd!

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

**N8N** · 10-17-2005, 04:28 PM

I thought that if we were talking about a V-8 a bellhousing was a bellhousing unless it was a 61-62 4-speed...? I thought the later, 63-64 4-speeds used the same bellhousing as the other Stude stickshifts...

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop

http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

**Transtar60** · 10-17-2005, 06:08 PM

You are correct Nate, 1539373, 59-64 V8 cars except the 4spds of 61-62(early 4spds, Part# 1552737)and the Y1 fleet cars(1548859). I dont why the Y1's bellhousing would be different except maybe it was drilled for variety of trannies??? The 63-64 4spds use the 1539373 bellhousing.

**Roscomacaw** · 10-17-2005, 06:31 PM

Yes, Nate's correct alright, but this fella says his Hawk IS a '62. So given that, if it sports a stock 3-spd now (T-86), a 4-speed won't bolt up to it.

Certainly, if it's a T-86, it's gonna be an aftermarket shifter on it.

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

**dallastx75208** · 10-17-2005, 07:03 PM

How can I tell if it is a three speed with OD? I do not have the car at my house. It is at my brothers place in St Louis. Are there any numbers on the car that would tell me what the tranny is?

quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

Yes, Nate's correct alright, but this fella says his Hawk IS a '62. So given that, if it sports a stock 3-spd now (T-86), a 4-speed won't bolt up to it.

Certainly, if it's a T-86, it's gonna be an aftermarket shifter on it.

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

**gordr** · 10-17-2005, 10:51 PM

OK,

I'll ask the question that nobody's asked.

Just how sure are you that the tranny is in fact a 3 speed? Could it be that your brother or a 3rd party just made the assumption that it's a 3 speed? If you bought it off a dealer, well, there's lots of dealers out there that haven't a clue.

Look at the steering column. Any evidence of the top collar having been changed, or does it still sport the stump where the column shifter would have been?

If the car has overdrive, it should have a chrome "T" handle beneath the dash on the left side of the steering column, with "OD" engraved in it.

Another tip-off to overdrive would be the presence of a 4-terminal switch on the top of the throttle bellcrank assembly at the rear of the left head.

If you can get under the car, you can recognize a 4-speed manual by reason of it having 3 shift levers on the side, all connected to the shifter. The OD tranny would have a couple of large "cans" protruding from the rear portion, and a third shift lever operated by a Bowden wire cable.

If it is a 4-speed, and the stock one for '62, it should have a Chevy-style case, with prominent "ears" for the bolts that hold it to the bellhousing. If it is a later 4-speed, the mounting ears on the front are more recessed.

You need to have a knowledgeable Stude person take a look at it. You could also send the serial number to the Studebaker National Museum and order a copy of the build sheet, but that will only tell you how it left the factory, not what may have been done to it since. Still worth having.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

**DEEPNHOCK** · 10-18-2005, 03:15 AM

No sweat at all! Welcome to the club
If you can have your brother look under the car to see if there is a big round metal can sticking out a bit crooked out of the driver's side of the transmission, it will tell you if you have an overdrive trans or not.
The can looks like a little heater motor, but actually is a solenoid. It will be right behind the shift rod arms on the side of the trans case. Having that type of trans is a bit unusual. Have you thought about getting a copy of the production order for this car? It will tell you how it came off the assembly line, so you would have a real good idea of how it was built and what may have been changed up to now. Might be a fun thing to help you do research while you are awaiting delivery of your new baby[:0]
Jeff[8D][quote]Originally posted by dallastx75208

I did join. I am sorry If I missled you. It is a three speed manual on the floor.

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

**dallastx75208** · 10-18-2005, 04:03 AM

I will have my brother check that out. He has driven it and it is a three speed. I will have him check out so see if it has been changed from the tree to the floor. He does not much about these, about as little as I do. He does have a guy who is into these tings and he can talk to him also.
I will order that infor from Studebaker, will be fun to have. I do know the color has been changed.
Thanks for all the info so far. I will have more questions and watch what is going on here also. Enjoy reading the stuff.
I am going to also check into joining a local club here in Dallas.[quote]quote:Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK

No sweat at all! Welcome to the club
If you can have your brother look under the car to see if there is a big round metal can sticking out a bit crooked out of the driver's side of the transmission, it will tell you if you have an overdrive trans or not.
The can looks like a little heater motor, but actually is a solenoid. It will be right behind the shift rod arms on the side of the trans case. Having that type of trans is a bit unusual. Have you thought about getting a copy of the production order for this car? It will tell you how it came off the assembly line, so you would have a real good idea of how it was built and what may have been changed up to now. Might be a fun thing to help you do research while you are awaiting delivery of your new baby[:0]
Jeff[8D]

Originally posted by dallastx75208

I did join. I am sorry If I missled you. It is a three speed manual on the floor.

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

**dallastx75208** · 10-19-2005, 07:43 PM

Has anyone ever swaped out for a 5 speed? Mine is a three speed on the floor and I am told it does not have overdrive at this point. I am making a daily driver and would like the five speed only for MPG's.

quote:Originally posted by N8N

As you probably guessed from Jeff's reply, a 3-speed floor shift wasn't a factory option on a '62 Hawk. Only vehicles off the top of my head that I can think had them from the factory would have been fleet vehicles (Lark chassis) or a base model Avanti. So I guess you will have to crawl under there and find out what you have and report back. If it is a stock, unmodified Stude tranny, the good news is that a 4 or 5 speed swap just became that much easier as you already have the clutch linkage and bellhousing in place, you just need to worry about sourcing the actual tranny, shifter, and driveshaft (and modifying whatever needs to be modified if you go with a 5-speed)

good luck

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop

http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

**GTtim** · 10-21-2005, 06:46 PM

Start here: http://www.studebakerdriversclub.com/tech_5speed.asp

Tim K.

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