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  • Hey guys [8D]

    Well, I figured I'd introduce myself since I think I will be spending a lot of time here in this very near future.

    My name is Faris (Like a Ferris wheel), I'm 18 years old, and I'm from Toronto, Canada, and about 6 months ago I purchased a 62 Studebaker Lark SY4. Black on red, in decent shape, needs minor body work and a respray, interior has to be re-upholstered, frame is solid, mechanically it's decent as well. Just some background info - I'm fairly mechanically inclined. All my life cars are what I've been doing, and I have no intentions of changing that. I actually build/ maintain/ drive Shelby Cobra & Daytona Coupe replicas for a living, some of you may have heard of us, www.superformance.ca, and most of my spare time is spent working on my cars and those that belong to friends. I've gone through about 8-9 cars in the past 1.5-2 years (Dailys, beaters, cruisers, toys), and once I heard the beautiful exhaust note of this glasspacked small block V8, I bought it.

    A few days ago I finally got around to towing it home (Had other cars in my driveway, but I sold off just about all of them except for this one), and now I'm ready to do some work to it. Over the winter the interior will probably get done, all the mechanics, and hopefully the body as well, just in time for next summer.

    My first question to you all is, I really don't know what's under the hood. It's a V8, small block, the rocker cover bolts go right through the covers, so I'm assuming it's a Studebaker V8. Now my question is, what's the displacement? You guys probably have more of a clue than I do, but I guess the choices are either a 289, or a 259? Or is there any other option/ popular swap I should be aware of?

    Right now the only thing it really needs to get back on the road is either some adjustment to the clutch (or throw out bearing), or I have to replace the whole clutch. I haven't had the time just yet to look everything over, but I believe it's having trouble going into gear when it's started. When you try to shift into 1st (It's a 3 on the tree), all it gives you is some grinding. I'm not about to force/ power shift the beast, as 43 years of climate take a toll on the frame and all the other components, so I figured I'd come here to ask you guys first.

    Plans in the long run after cleaning the whole thing up and restoring it, are to basically turn it into a street rod. I don't street race like most kids my age do, but I just wanted a change from my usual rides, so I figured I'd invest my time and money into this one. It's here to stay, and I'll be doing as much work on it as I can.

    So, yep, that's basically it. Just wanted to say hi and introduce myself, now off to read as much as I can [8D]

    Take care.

    - Faris.

  • #2
    Welcome to the forum, Faris.

    I'd be willing to lay odds you have a 259 in that Lark, as in my experience most Canadian Larks got that engine. Look at the top front of the engine block, just forward of the valley cover, towards the driver's side of center. You will find a machined pad on the same plane as the surface the valley cover seals against, and the engine number should be stamped into that pad. If it begins with a "V", it's a 259; should it begin with a "P", it's a 289, assuming you have a '63 engine, or one from a year fairly close.

    Late '62s got a full-flow oil filter which lives on an adaptor bolted to the lower rear of the block on the passenger side, and if so equipped, the valve covers will each have a filler/vent cap. If you an early '62 or older engine, it will have a bypass filter attached to the crankcase fill stack on the top front of the block near the serial number pad, and no caps on the valve covers.

    By the way, "small block" really doesn't mean anything in Studebaker land. All Stude V8 blocks are the same physical size, and they are actually sort of intermediate in size between Brand X big and small blocks. Stude engine displacement certainly falls into small-block Brand X territory, though.

    People swap Brand X engines into Studes all the time, but if you have a good running Stude V8, there is really not much percentage in swapping to a 350 Chev or whatever. You will lose that unique exhaust note, to be sure.

    As to your clutch problems; the first question I'd ask is: has the car been sitting a long time? Could be simply that the the clutch disc has become bonded to the pressure plate or flywheel by rust. Try shutting off the engine, and then shift into high gear. Depress the clutch, and try starting the engine. If you CAN start the engine (keeping one foot on the brake for safety's sake), then the clutch is MOSTLY released. If the starter won't even turn the engine in that attempt, then shift to reverse, and have two husky friends push the car to and fro while you keep the clutch depressed (engine off). If the disc is simply stuck, that usually will free it.

    If you have determined that the clutch is ALMOST disengaging, then it needs adjustment, which is accomplished by lengthening the little threaded linkage rod between the clutch pedal bellcrank and the lever on the bellhousing. There is only one such such rod which has a sliding clevis pin caught between two nuts. You want about 3/4" free travel of the pedal at the top before it starts to act on the clutch pressure plate.

    Having said that, I'll warn you that Studes are notorious for having the lever on the bellhousing cross-shaft SLIP on its spline, and the release forks inside can do likewise, especially if some previous owner installed a heavy-duty clutch with strong springs. If you do an adjustment, and it goes bad again in a very short time, suspect that this has happened. In that case, you will have to remove the transmission from the bellhousing (not real hard), then remove the cross-shaft, and have the lever and release forks welded. And the tricky part here is getting the parts correctly registered before welding. It would be best to hook up with a local Stude mentor (there's got to be some in T.O.), and compare your cross-shaft with one from a used parts stash. (And I would recommend that you do weld yours; sticking in an apparently good one may just get you the same problem again down the road. A good weld repair is permanent.)

    Does your Lark have overdrive? Very nice feature if it does. Look for a T-handle below the dash to left of the steering wheel marked "OD", and look for a 4-terminal switch on the top of the throttle linkage at the rear of the left cylinder head.

    BTW, I just noticed that you say it is a 62SY4. That should be a long-wheelbase Lark with a six cylinder engine. You may want to check that whoever swapped the engine also swapped the brakes, springs, and rear axle. The six-cylinder brakes are just not up to the job of stopping a Lark with V8 weight and horsepower. Look for 11" drums on the fro
    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

    Comment


    • #3
      Well Faris , sounds like you need to join the Ontario chapter of SDC for starters. You are lucky because our annual generl membership meeting is going to be held at the swiss chalet in Milton on Oct 23rd ....come on out and meet some of the members and join up . Its on hyway 25 just off the 401 , not hard to find. the meeting starts at 1) pm but most of us go around 12 and have lunch 1st. if its a decent day there will definitely be some studes there for sure , mine included .
      Not much more to say , seems like Gord pretty well hit everything you need to look for in your car for starters ....hope to see you on the 23rd.....Bob
      sigpic

      Home of the Fried Green Tomato

      "IF YOU WANT THE SMILES YOU NEED TO DO THE MILES "

      1960 Champ , 1966 Daytona , 1965 Daytona Wagonaire

      Comment


      • #4
        Welcome aboard Faris! Hope these here Studes grow on you to where you bring home a few more. Nobody wants just ONE!

        Miscreant at large.

        1957 Transtar 1/2ton
        1960 Larkvertible V8
        1958 Provincial wagon
        1953 Commander coupe
        1957 President 2-dr
        1955 President State
        1951 Champion Biz cpe
        1963 Daytona project FS
        No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

        Comment


        • #5
          Welcome Faris. Another Ontario Stude owner!

          Todd
          63 Lark 2dr Sedan

          Comment


          • #6
            Wow, thanks to everyone, especially gordr for all that info.

            I just came back from Canadian Tire, just looked around if they have anything in particular. Got a feel for the prices of jacks and whatnot, just to know.

            Judging by your descriptions, I'm running an early 62 or older 259. Do you have an apporximation on the horsepower/ torque figures for that engine? From what I was told by the owner before me, the water pump is new, the carb has been rebuilt just needs to be tuned. New exhaust starting at the headers, but not including them, the brake system was flushed and I believe new lines were put in place, however I'm not sure about that. Haven't had a chance to measure the drums just yet.

            Yes you are correct it did come with the flat 6 originally, even the ownership still says its a 6 cylinder. I'll see what this beast is like with the current 259, I'm more of a numbers freak though, as I drive 430-600hp track eaters daily, and always feel the need for more power, haha. I'll assume the 350/351 swap is one of the more popular ones? I can probably get a used 351 Windsor stroker for fairly cheap, and mate it to a Tremec 5 speed. Much rather keep it carburated vs. FI'ing for the whole "all American" concept. The 3 on the tree is pretty different for me, and I'll try to master that as much as I can, however this will be the first car I own that's not synchro-meshed. Guess it'll be a good learning experience.

            Now I have a few more questions. Are there any good parts suppliers I should be aware of? Both new and used parts? I'm going to start looking around for all the weather stripping, as the ones on the Stude right now are pretty worn out and leaking. Also, is there any sort of aftermarket for the 259? Any headers/ carbs/ etc that will just bolt right on? I have tons more questions that I can't remember right now.

            2R5 - I'll try to make it there, Sunday is actually my only day off so it fits the bill [8D] I doubt I'm going to bring the Stude though, I don't think it will be safe enough just yet. However I'll try to bring lots and lots of pictures What are the fees/ requirements to join the club? I wouldn't mind at all.

            tstclr - Where abouts are you? I'm in the Richmond Hill area, and frequent North York, Markham, Aurora, Scarborough, and Mississagua.

            Thanks again to everyone [8D]

            Comment


            • #7
              62stud ...go to http://www.ontariosdc.ca/


              this will tell you just about all you need right now about the Ontario chapter
              sigpic

              Home of the Fried Green Tomato

              "IF YOU WANT THE SMILES YOU NEED TO DO THE MILES "

              1960 Champ , 1966 Daytona , 1965 Daytona Wagonaire

              Comment


              • #8
                Awesome, thanks.

                Do they hold meets anywhere other than Milton?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Before you're so quick to swap engines, take a look at the recent topic thread here that's titled, Ted and Tomato break their own record. This car (dubbed the Stude Tomatocause it's RED) is running the stock Studebaker 289 with the factory Paxton blower on it. In fact, the whole car is stock. No aftermarket this or that to it to "improve" it.



                  That 259 can be made to lift the front wheels off the ground with virtually NO hopping up of the lower end. None. Only improved breathing of the stock heads and a 4bbl.
                  Studes all came with forged cranks - even the little 6s. BTW, you're would not have been a "flat" 6 as they went to an OHV 6 in 1961. The NEW factory crankshafts are available for under $100 bucks still. Not that you NEED one but if you did.......
                  We'll help you any way we can, but there's a feeling here that the Stude engine is as much a part of a Studebaker as the different sheet metal.


                  No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    yeah, what Biggs said.

                    Have you determined if you have the right brakes or not?

                    I'd consider keeping the 259, it will motivate that car quite well with just a little warm up. Might get a good honest 200 HP with a 4bbl and an Avanti cam (Ted H. has an "R2+" grind that's supposed to be a little better than the factory grind) and they wind up real nice. If you can get some head work done you might be surprised at how that little engine will rev.

                    Of course, you will probably *have* to swap engines if you want to keep up with one of your replicas, or else look into forced induction. You can get an honest 600HP out of a Stude engine with twin turbos, just ask Ted.

                    All that said, if you are *really* going to wind the engine out, you may want to look into either swapping to a full flow (63-64) block or else mimicking the improved oil drainback provisions that were introduced with the full flow engine. Also windage tray, extra breathers, etc. a la R-series engines would not be a bad idea. In fact, I would suggest deciding just how far you want to go with this engine... if you really want to go for the big HP numbers with a blower or turbos, it might be to your advantage to find a thrashed R-2 to rebuild just to get all the goodies like the pan, valve covers, windage tray, etc. etc. etc. and as a bonus you would get the full flow block and 289 crank you probably wanted anyhow.

                    Also nothing sounds quite like a Stude, you said you heard that "beautiful exhaust note" do you really want to lose that?

                    good luck and welcome,

                    nate

                    --
                    55 Commander Starlight
                    62 Daytona hardtop
                    --
                    55 Commander Starlight
                    http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks for all the messages everyone, it's quite interesting to read all your feedback.

                      Mr.Biggs - You've got me convinced, I'll stick to Studebaker blocks. However I will opt for the 289 whenever I have a chance to pick one up. You said the Tomato is running those numbers STOCK? You're saying it's able to break into the 12s right from the factory? Or by stock do you mean either nothing major, or a stock bottom end? Or something else? I'm not doubting you, but WOW, a family sedans breaking into the 12s in the early 60's?

                      And my bad about the flat 6 comment, I read it somewhere, and that's all I can base my knowledge on for now, reading, as previous to this, I've never even so much as looked into Studes.

                      N8N - Nope, haven't had the chance to have a look at the brakes yet. But I will try to do that tomorrow, I'm curious myself.

                      lol, I in no way expect this Studebaker to keep up with any of the replicas. Weighing 2500lbs, with up to 600hp, is a totally different class. Out of curiousity, how much DO these Larks weigh in at? Maybe I'll go the FI route after I take apart the block and see what condition it's actually in. If it's too worn out, I'll just go for the 289, if it's fine, I'll consider doing what you mentioned.

                      And like you mentioned yourself again, the exhaust note. I sat in my driveway today after I got home from work, and started her up. Started up like a dream, sounded like a charm, and I just couldn't get enough of that exhaust note. 3rd day in a row that I'm pissing off the neighbours [8D]

                      Anyways, let me see if I can put a pic up...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        You do know that the 259 and 289 use the same block right? only the crank and pistons are different. So if you end up rebuilding just get a 289 crank and pistons and you are good to go.

                        Personally I would like to drive a 259 for a while. I like little revvy sports car engines but all the Studes I've had have had 289s (or a 352)

                        nate

                        --
                        55 Commander Starlight
                        62 Daytona hardtop
                        --
                        55 Commander Starlight
                        http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Welcome! I'm 15 and own a 63 Lark two door HT. It's just a little six banger though. No big V8 here. (Sorry N8N, I'm no V8 snob . Like Mr. Biggs said, you can't own just one, as we have close to 60 if you count the parts cars.
                          Happy Motoring!

                          Matthew Burnette; the world's most
                          dedicated 15 year old Stude nut!
                          [img] http://jnautoair.com/images/yelstude2.jpg [/img]
                          1963 Daytona HT
                          lots more Studes
                          and a few parts cars

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            As nate says, a 259 & 289 only differ in their crankshaft and pistons. All else is the same. Even the bore. The extra 30 cubes are achieved thru stroke.
                            When I said "stock", that's what I meant. Only the tires differ from what you could have bought in '63
                            Into the 12s IS astonishing, alright - but consider that the guy driving this car has been racing Studes since 1961. Experience counts as much as anything!
                            There WERE even hotter power options available at the time. There were 304cu.in. versions of the same engine available with a blower or dual carbs and different head/cam arrangements. While you can duplicate those engines using a stock V8 block, it's not cheap to duplicate the heads.[}]
                            There was also a 224cu.in. variant of this same V8. It's use was restricted to a two-year span (55 & 56). Theoretically, the lower end of that engine could really spin if you can keep the valve train from floating. Again "theoretically" - like 9000RPM![:0] This based on the short stroke and the resultant strength of the crankshaft.
                            Oh! And Studes are still setting records (with Stude power no less) at Bonneville.[^]

                            Miscreant at large.

                            1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                            1960 Larkvertible V8
                            1958 Provincial wagon
                            1953 Commander coupe
                            1957 President 2-dr
                            1955 President State
                            1951 Champion Biz cpe
                            1963 Daytona project FS
                            No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Welcome! Join SDC (this site). You have a nice looking car. Do you know that it has a 1963 model grille? If the car still has the six cylinder car brakes, you can upgrade to either V8 car brakes or use an aftermarket disc brake conversion made for your car (a couple of vendors).
                              Gary L.
                              Wappinger, NY

                              SDC member since 1968
                              Studebaker enthusiast much longer

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