PDA

View Full Version : Pure Stock Drags



Chicken Hawk
09-20-2008, 06:00 PM
Sorry for so long in posting this but when we got home from the drags we were getting ready to leave for the International meet in Pennsylvania the next day. Since the drags were rained out, I didn't think it was too important to post but here it is now.

When we arrived at the track Friday morning it was raining and rained off and on most of the day. In between showers the track personnel worked at drying the track. We were called into the staging lanes twice but about the time the track was dry enough to run it started raining again.

Finally about 5:30 the track was dry enough to do some running but a Vette, one of the first or second cars that went down the track, dumped antifreeze about half way down the track and that took almost another hour to clean that up.

Some of the cars seem to get decent traction but most found the track was far worse than the traction on the road. I know it was that way for us.

Most of the Stude guys were quite a bit off their normal times and many others seemed to be in the same situation. I think Richard Poe's best was in the 14.50 range and Peter Sant had a best in the 14.90's I believe but he found a bad rotor in the distributor later. Chuck Kerns with his '63 R 2 Avanti ran in the 14.70's. I don't think Doug Tjapkes or John Raab made any runs although I know they were there but must have gone home before this.

George Krem's R 3 Challenger now has a Powershift instead of the four speed and at home on the road we could come off at an idle and the tires would spin about two revolutions and go. I thought at the track we could torque it up some and leave the same way. WRONG!

The first run, we torqued it up to about 1500 and had a 2.491 sixty foot time and when going to second it started to go sideways. That run was 15.265 @ 101.28 mph. That run was against Peter Sant and he turned 15.331 on that run.

The second run we come off just above idle and was not much better. Sixty foot was 2.430 but at least it didn't feel as "loose" going to second and got a 13.736 @ 104.67. This run was against a 427 Vette four speed. I think he must have missed a gear as he only went 15.494 @ 90.08 mph.

By the third run the traction was getting better so we came off around 1800 and fethering the accelerator, was able to get a 2.121 sixty foot with a 13.132 @ 106.32 mph. The other car was a 442 Olds that turned 14.267 @ 95.79 mph.

After making the three runs in the R 2 we went to the Tomato. The first run was a 2.281 sixty foot with 13.664 @ 106.29. This was against a '69 Pontiac Firebird 400/325/ four speed. I don't know what happened to him but he only went 18.912 @ 71.46 mph.

The second run had a 2.245 sixty foot with a 13.433 @ 106.79 mph. This was against a '72 GTO 455HO automatic that went 13.455 @ 101.91 mph.

That was it for the runs we made. When we showed up Saturday morning it was raining and the forecast was 90% chance of rain all day so it was cancelled and we headed home.

Larry Mitchell from Missouri was there and took some video of what little we got to run. Mary Ann recorded it on a DVD. The DVD runs about 15 minutes and it is almost all Stude runs. If any one wants a copy, send $5 to us and we will mail you one. It is not real good but all we could get in the limited time. If I knew how, I would post it on here but I'm computer ignorant.

Ted

Roscomacaw
09-20-2008, 06:06 PM
Woooo baby! Sounds like there's some potential to be discovered in that Powershift yet![:p]

Miscreant Studebaker nut in California's central valley.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President two door

Chicken Hawk
09-20-2008, 06:08 PM
A correction: In the fourth paragraph from the bottom, it should read, "After making three runs in the R 3", not the R 2. Also our address is 18994N 125E, Summitville, IN 46070.

Ted


quote:Originally posted by Chicken Hawk

Sorry for so long in posting this but when we got home from the drags we were getting ready to leave for the International meet in Pennsylvania the next day. Since the drags were rained out, I didn't think it was too important to post but here it is now.

When we arrived at the track Friday morning it was raining and rained off and on most of the day. In between showers the track personnel worked at drying the track. We were called into the staging lanes twice but about the time the track was dry enough to run it started raining again.

Finally about 5:30 the track was dry enough to do some running but a Vette, one of the first or second cars that went down the track, dumped antifreeze about half way down the track and that took almost another hour to clean that up.

Some of the cars seem to get decent traction but most found the track was far worse than the traction on the road. I know it was that way for us.

Most of the Stude guys were quite a bit off their normal times and many others seemed to be in the same situation. I think Richard Poe's best was in the 14.50 range and Peter Sant had a best in the 14.90's I believe but he found a bad rotor in the distributor later. Chuck Kerns with his '63 R 2 Avanti ran in the 14.70's. I don't think Doug Tjapkes or John Raab made any runs although I know they were there but must have gone home before this.

George Krem's R 3 Challenger now has a Powershift instead of the four speed and at home on the road we could come off at an idle and the tires would spin about two revolutions and go. I thought at the track we could torque it up some and leave the same way. WRONG!

The first run, we torqued it up to about 1500 and had a 2.491 sixty foot time and when going to second it started to go sideways. That run was 15.265 @ 101.28 mph. That run was against Peter Sant and he turned 15.331 on that run.

The second run we come off just above idle and was not much better. Sixty foot was 2.430 but at least it didn't feel as "loose" going to second and got a 13.736 @ 104.67. This run was against a 427 Vette four speed. I think he must have missed a gear as he only went 15.494 @ 90.08 mph.

By the third run the traction was getting better so we came off around 1800 and fethering the accelerator, was able to get a 2.121 sixty foot with a 13.132 @ 106.32 mph. The other car was a 442 Olds that turned 14.267 @ 95.79 mph.

After making the three runs in the R 2 we went to the Tomato. The first run was a 2.281 sixty foot with 13.664 @ 106.29. This was against a '69 Pontiac Firebird 400/325/ four speed. I don't know what happened to him but he only went 18.912 @ 71.46 mph.

The second run had a 2.245 sixty foot with a 13.433 @ 106.79 mph. This was against a '72 GTO 455HO automatic that went 13.455 @ 101.91 mph.

That was it for the runs we made. When we showed up Saturday morning it was raining and the forecast was 90% chance of rain all day so it was cancelled and we headed home.

Larry Mitchell from Missouri was there and took some video of what little we got to run. Mary Ann recorded it on a DVD. The DVD runs about 15 minutes and it is almost all Stude runs. If any one wants a copy, send $5 to us and we will mail you one. It is not real good but all we could get in the limited time. If I knew how, I would post it on here but I'm computer ignorant.

Ted

bams50
09-20-2008, 06:16 PM
Ted, it was good to finally meet you. Hopefully next time it'll be more than 30 seconds[:I]

If you want you can post the video on YouTube. You'd probably have to split it since I believe they limit it to 10 minutes. I did an hour's worth of video at Lancaster and posted it in several segments. You can see them here if you like:

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22475

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

BobPalma
09-21-2008, 02:07 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

Woooo baby! Sounds like there's some potential to be discovered in that Powershift yet![:p]

Miscreant Studebaker nut in California's central valley.



:) Possibly, Bob, but it might not be realized. An unfortunate incident at the end of the day Friday, about 8:30PM just as the strip was closing practice, caused Cousin George to seriously entertain retiring The Plain Brown Wrapper from Pure Stock Drag Racing, "quitting while we're ahead," so to speak.

Said incident was my brother Stanley's 1967 427 Fairlane trying to destroy itself just as it cleared the traps at well over 100 MPH. It was nighttime and hard to see, even though the strip had good lights, but shortly after tripping the 1320 counter, Stan's Fairlane disappeared in an enormous cloud of steamy smoke, so much so that I thought the engine had blown.

You could no longer see the car's tailights for all the smoke. I was seriously concerned that oil or anti-freeze under the rear tires at that speed in the night air on a dew-drenched race track might have caused Stan to lose control and roll or damage the car at over 100 MPH. Gulp.

We quickly unhooked The Plain Brown Wrapper's trailer from my Dakota and took off for the far end of the track. The car was there, intact, with the whole engine compartment and undercarriage bathed in coolant; dripping everywhere and a real mess. :( A track worker had already arrived and was taking the driver back. It turned out that it wasn't Brother Stan after all, but hot-shoe Pure Stock Ford driver ????? (can't think of his first name) Artes, who Stan had encouraged to see what it would do! I guess they found out....[xx(]

Anyway, at this writing, they have determined it either blew a head gasket or, more possibly per Ford counsellors, split the block open at the top of one side (not good). Stan is removing the engine as I speak, to be returned to the high-dollar Ford Race Engine Master Builder in Michigan where it was built, who asked that Stan not dismantle it until it was back up there. Now, obviously, my brother has well into five figures in that engine alone....[8]:([V]

The whole incident got Cousin George's attention, now more seriously considering something he's thought about for a couple years; retiring "The Wrapper" while we are ahead of the game. That R3, in true Studebaker V-8 fashion, has now been running hard over 10 years up there without as much as a head gasket change. In fact, the engine is still running all eight original ForgedTrue pistons[:0] that were installed at Paxton in Santa Monica in 1963!

While The 'Wrapper might be good for another tenth or a couple MPH in the quarter-mile, the reality is that the car and engine have already proven that an R3 Studebaker at Ted Harbit's hand can do everything we thought they could, and more. What it's done up there has now been written up in every major enthusiast magazine. So the honest question, "Why risk blowing up that good R3 engine to pile even a thicker layer of frosting on the cake?" is being considered.

George came up with this on his own, but I'll confess to having endorsed it when he ran it past me on the way back from Stanton ten days ago. Rare, broken, expensive pieces [V] have little appeal to most of us, especially when the point has already been made many times over...and Ted Harbit needs the time to finish and run his

Roscomacaw
09-21-2008, 02:23 PM
"That R3, in true Studebaker V-8 fashion, has now been running hard over 10 years up there without as much as a head gasket change. In fact, the engine is still running all eight original ForgedTrue pistons that were installed at Paxton in Santa Monica in 1963!"

Those are simply amazing facts, Bob. And it just proves what I've said (and been roasted for) in the past.
We went to pick up my Cruiser this AM and my neighbor spots a '70 Malibu next door to where the Cruiser was. He let out a long whistle and opined that there was a car with super driveability and power potential. I was gonna light into a lecture about the Tomato and Poe's R1, but I held my breath. I know he wouldn't believe me or if he did he'd chalk it up to some anomaly or the right weather or whatever. That's the sad thing.
Ted & the rest have PROVEN the superiority of our cars, but the die's so long cast that most who HEAR the facts, don't really make much (if anything) of them. They just go back to thinking like they always have that Studebaker's are some quirky thing's that crazy ol' Uncle Juster used to own. Anything but a seriously competitive piece of American iron. You know what I mean.[B)]

No, I understand George's thinking. I think he deserves a medal for letting us believers revel in the magic reality that we've seen in the past decade - thanks to his daring and outlay. Hats off to George and Ted.[^]


Miscreant Studebaker nut in California's central valley.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President two door

StudeRich
09-21-2008, 02:50 PM
Yep, I totally agree with George's decision and Bob P and Biggs' thoughts as well. [^]

I think what needs to be done is for someone to replace the Brown Wrapper with an R3 Lark type clone at drag strips that is not so perfect and original that some fun cannot be had without worries! [:0]

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

BobPalma
09-21-2008, 03:13 PM
quote:Originally posted by StudeRich

Yep, I totally agree with George's decision and Bob P and Biggs' thoughts as well. [^]

I think what needs to be done is for someone to replace the Brown Wrapper with an R3 Lark type clone at drag strips that is not so perfect and original that some fun cannot be had without worries! [:0]

StudeRich


;);) Don't get too far ahead of us, Rich....!;);) :DBP

StudeDave57
09-21-2008, 04:13 PM
I've been thinking it, typing it here, and saying it out loud for many years now. If I had to guess I'd say I fist got the idea back in 2001- after attending the PSMCDrags. My thought was that maybe a slightly heavier car and the slightly longer wheelbase might get it hook up a bit better. Could I be right? Let's build one, and find out!!! :D

An R3/4speed Super Cruiser would fit the bill real nice, I think. ;)
Make it a green car- just for kicks... [:0] [:p] [^] :)

StudeDave '57 [8D]
San Diego, Ca.
San Diego County SDC
www.studebakersandiego.com

'54 Commander Regal 4dr 'Ruby'
'57 Parkview 'Betsy' (she's a 2dr wagon...)
'57 Commander DeLuxe 2dr 'Baby'
'57 Champion Custom 2dr 'Jewel'
'58 Packard sedan 'Cleo'
'65 Cruiser 'Sweet Pea'

Part owner of the one and only
'55 PROTOTYPE panel van

StudeDave '57 [8D]
San Diego, Ca.
San Diego County SDC
www.studebakersandiego.com

'54 Commander Regal 4dr 'Ruby'
'57 Parkview 'Betsy' (she's a 2dr wagon...)
'57 Commander DeLuxe 2dr 'Baby'
'57 Champion Custom 2dr 'Jewel'
'58 Packard sedan 'Cleo'
'65 Cruiser 'Sweet Pea'

Part owner of the one and only
'55 PROTOTYPE panel van

63larkr1
09-21-2008, 07:41 PM
Biggs, you are right, we are either too fast or too slow, and everyone knows a Studebaker canít run like that. We have made some good progress over the past ten years. Seems like some of the young guys are becoming convinced as to Studebaker performance. It may be that the experience they have is what they have seen at the Pure Stock Drags, and coverage in national magazines.
Richard

BobPalma
09-21-2008, 08:01 PM
quote:Originally posted by Studedude

From a purely selfish perspective, I'd hate to see George or Ted retire anything.

Selfishness aside, I certainly could respect the decision to do so!

If it ain't broke, why break it?

(Might that be an original quote?) [?];)

DAVE, THE EVIL TWIN FROM OKLAHOMA


:) Yeah; I think that's an original quote, Dave! :DBP

Chicken Hawk
09-22-2008, 08:45 AM
With talk of retiring the PBW I think it should be noted that the car is capable of more than it has shown. As most know, the R 3's are engineered to run at least 7000 rpm and we never ran it past 6000 through the gears nor shifted as hard as it could have been.

With the 4.89 gears we tried once, it did go to about 6400 at the finish line. With the 4.55 gears it finished at about 6100.

If it had been driven as if it were stolen (or if I owned it), there is no doubt it would have gone quite a few tenths quicker but as has been noted here, this is a "one of a kind" and a too valuable automobile to try to wring every last ounce out of it. I think it would have handled more rpm's fine but since it was being run over a 10 year period the chances go up drastically of something negatively happening.

I just want to thank George for trusting me to drive it and providing the non Stude people a chance to see some of its potential. Also, thanks to all the support the Stude people provided and to Bob P. for donating his time, trailer, and vehicle hauling it to and from the PSMCDR.

Ted

PackardV8
09-22-2008, 10:00 AM
This has always been the dichotomy of The Studebaker Drivers Club. Harry Barnes was adamant Studebakers were for driving. As a result, over the years, the SDC did not have as many jewel-like restorations as most other marque clubs. That trend has been reversed and at International Meets, the number of show restorations and trailered cars goes up every year. Yes the PBW is an irreplaceable survivor car, but we'll be losing one of the irreplaceable touchstones of SDC pride when it is no longer racing in the PSMCD.

thnx, jack vines

PackardV8

Dick Steinkamp
09-22-2008, 10:16 AM
quote:Originally posted by PackardV8
Yes the PBW is an irreplaceable survivor car, but we'll be losing one of the irreplaceable touchstones of SDC pride when it is no longer racing in the PSMCD.



So true...but it opens the door for another to build an R3 car and campaign it. Ted says..."the car is capable of more than it has shown." This should be a good incentive for some one else to keep the ball rolling. Ted should know [^].

I fully support George's decision. I would agonize about it but then most likely do the same for the same reasons.

Thanks, George, for letting ALL of us enjoy your special car for these years [8D] :D.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s66/ddstnkmp/Stude-a-mino%20old%20pics/oldpics6asmall.jpg

52-fan
09-22-2008, 12:17 PM
My thanks also. I remember how hard it was to believe that you where willing to risk the car in the first place. Although I have never seen the PBW run, it has been encouraging to hear of the results. I am sure that you guys have saved a lot of Studebaker engines from the scrap heap by proving to the larger automotive world their real potential.
Do what you feel. It's your car and you don't owe anybody a say in the decision.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s186/52-fan/StudebakersofArkansas2-1.jpg
1952 Champion Starlight, 1962 Daytona, both w/overdrive.Searcy,Arkansas
"I may be lazy, but I'm not shiftless."

R3 challenger
09-23-2008, 10:15 PM
Hi, guys. As the owner of the Plain Brown Wrapper, I want to thank everyone for their support and kind comments for the ten years we've been running the car at the Pure Stock Drags. As Bob mentioned, we are retiring the Wrapper with many great memories. All this wouldn't have been possible without the great driving of Ted Harbit, the trailering and skilled help of Bob Palma, and assistance from many others.

The Wrapper's best time ever was 12.71 in cool evening air at Muncie Dragway. That's on skinny street tires with full exhaust and original ForgedTrue pistons. And it was at Muncie two or three years ago that Ted and the Wrapper beat a new Corvette Z 06, thanks in part to Ted's driving. In fact, the Wrapper beat that same Corvette twice in the same evening. Spending over $50,000 for a new Corvette and getting beat by a 40+ year old Studebaker might be a bit disheartening!

The Wrapper's all-time best results at the Pure Stock Drags were 12.84 and 111.64 mph. On a different (12.85) run, we beat a 1969 big-block Nova (396/375 HP, aluminum heads, 4-speed, 4.10 Posi).

Personally, the run I enjoyed the most was several years ago at the Pure Stock Drags when Ted & the Wrapper beat a 1969 Road Runner 440 6 Barrel. Thanks to Ted's great reaction time, he got ahead immediately and the RR driver got further behind by lighting up his tires in an effort to catch up. The following April, Hot Rod Magazine featured the same Road Runner, listing the fact that it had 505 CID, ported & polished heads, 2.25" intake valves, etc., etc. Fun.

We certainly don't win all the time, but the Wrapper has won about 80% of its races and it's given all of us a great ride.

Thanks again, Ted and Bob.

George

george krem

barnlark
09-23-2008, 10:28 PM
Smart decision. Wish I had the opportunity to see it run in person before it had been retired.
Good luck with any future project. [^]

bams50
09-24-2008, 04:37 AM
Wow... great history! It would be great to see someone pick up where the PBW left off with a new car[8D]

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

BobPalma
09-24-2008, 06:30 AM
quote:Originally posted by bams50

Wow... great history! It would be great to see someone pick up where the PBW left off with a new car[8D]

Robert (Bob) Andrews

;) Go back to my second post in this thread, Bob...;) :DBP

64 Stude
09-24-2008, 05:31 PM
Thats to bad to hear but fully understand aswell, its deffinitly a rare peice of art. I hope it is brough to some of the studebaker shows as iv never seen it in person!

MARCHOBBS
09-24-2008, 07:23 PM
In 1972, as an 18 year old, my buddy & I went to the Int'l Meet in South Bend in my modified 66 Daytona, and I have always talked about a "street sleeper" 64 Lark that was dark brown, had stock wheels & the small hubcaps & sounded very healthy!..... doing some street racing with the locals during that meet. I have always wondered if that car was the PBW? any confirmation George?

fastfritz
09-24-2008, 09:35 PM
Probably one of the worst things about the weather cutting the event short was the loss of a full day of catching up with old (and new) friends!:(

My hard drive crashed and burned two week's ago and I have lost 10 years worth of photos, reference photos, and 8 year's worth of PSMCDR photos. [V][V]:(:( I had about 10 photos of the SDC Studebakers racing that are now lost for eternity. No PSMCDR webpage this year.:(:(
And, YES, I read the post in the Hugger's forum about backing up our data. I hope to have a external hard drive in a week or two to perform WEEKLY back-ups..............

Frank Remlinger
SDC# A004602R
http://automotivemachine.net/smleftsdcaps.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
09-24-2008, 09:41 PM
quote:Originally posted by fastfritz


My hard drive crashed and burned two week's ago and I have lost 10 years worth of photos, reference photos, and 8 year's worth of PSMCDR photos.


Frank,
There are services in most metros that can restore data on most crashed/inop hard drives.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s66/ddstnkmp/Stude-a-mino%20old%20pics/oldpics6asmall.jpg

PlainBrownR2
09-25-2008, 01:46 AM
I just read on the retirement and about spit out my Pepsi Max [:o)]!! I remember when the PBW first appeared in TW. It had gotten into the 15's(correct me on this, but I know it was down there), and at the time the Studebaker was a punchline rather than a competitor. We were the farmer's car, the fuddy duddy guys, the guys who belonged in with the Metropolitans, and so on and so forth. From the article, by the end of the race, that punchline wasn't so funny no more [}:)]. Well that quarter mile ticked down over the years, and thanks in part to the PBW, that stigma started to disappear. In the last couple of years we even began getting a following from the Big 3 fans on this car, as to whether it would appear at the strip or not. This car even had some other cars show up with it as a group to lend support in the traditional Studebaker fashion, as well as make some figurative automotive noise of their own on the track, such as one well known White R1 4 speed [}:)]. We even got some insight into some of the issues that made things interesting in getting the numbers down. I remember some problems that involved that God aweful wheel hop from the getgo, and that equally God aweful belt slip at the upper end of the rpm band [:o)]. Needless to say though, this little vehicle is a milestone for SDC, as it's proven that yes, we can be equally as nasty as our big block brethren(I've brought that on a few of the modern cars around here, heh heh heh).

Just like the retirement of Jordan here when he left the Bulls, I can honestly say that the PBW will be going out on a pretty high note. I can understand what a loss it would be if one of those original R3 pistons let loose in the chamber at the end of the strip, which is also why I understand why it is leaving at this stage of the game(and boy has it ever been long in the game, lol). I only hope that it will make some cameo appearances at the Intl' Meets(I think I may have pictures, lol), that would be great [^]. That would be just as good if another R3 could be built to fill the already large shoes of the PBW. Just remember the mantra of the CS category and what's involved there, as well as what went into the construction of the PBW. Now before I ramble too much more, I would like to say it was a great run with the PBW, and best of luck with the next project. I never saw it race, but with TW covering it, I got a pretty good idea of the reputation it had over there over years. Anyway, better hurry with the next project before the other Big 3 competitors get too complacent now that there biggest opponent is gone!! [:o)] ;)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/My%201950%202r5%20Studebaker%20Pickup%20with%20turbocharger/P1000145-1.jpg
[img=left]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/My%201950%202r5%20Studebaker%20Pickup%20with%20turbocharger/P1000137-1.jpg[/img=left]
[img=right]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/DSC00005.jpg?t=1171153370[/img=right]
[IMG=left]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Ex%20Studebaker%20Plant%20Locomotive/P1000578-1.jpg[/IMG=left]

PlainBrownR2
09-25-2008, 01:46 AM
I just read on the retirement and about spit out my Pepsi Max [:o)]!! I remember when the PBW first appeared in TW. It had gotten into the 15's(correct me on this, but I know it was down there), and at the time the Studebaker was a punchline rather than a competitor. We were the farmer's car, the fuddy duddy guys, the guys who belonged in with the Metropolitans, and so on and so forth. From the article, by the end of the race, that punchline wasn't so funny no more [}:)]. Well that quarter mile ticked down over the years, and thanks in part to the PBW, that stigma started to disappear. In the last couple of years we even began getting a following from the Big 3 fans on this car, as to whether it would appear at the strip or not. This car even had some other cars show up with it as a group to lend support in the traditional Studebaker fashion, as well as make some figurative automotive noise of their own on the track, such as one well known White R1 4 speed [}:)]. We even got some insight into some of the issues that made things interesting in getting the numbers down. I remember some problems that involved that God aweful wheel hop from the getgo, and that equally God aweful belt slip at the upper end of the rpm band [:o)]. Needless to say though, this little vehicle is a milestone for SDC, as it's proven that yes, we can be equally as nasty as our big block brethren(I've brought that on a few of the modern cars around here, heh heh heh).

Just like the retirement of Jordan here when he left the Bulls, I can honestly say that the PBW will be going out on a pretty high note. I can understand what a loss it would be if one of those original R3 pistons let loose in the chamber at the end of the strip, which is also why I understand why it is leaving at this stage of the game(and boy has it ever been long in the game, lol). I only hope that it will make some cameo appearances at the Intl' Meets(I think I may have pictures, lol), that would be great [^]. That would be just as good if another R3 could be built to fill the already large shoes of the PBW. Just remember the mantra of the CS category and what's involved there, as well as what went into the construction of the PBW. Now before I ramble too much more, I would like to say it was a great run with the PBW, and best of luck with the next project. I never saw it race, but with TW covering it, I got a pretty good idea of the reputation it had over there over years. Anyway, better hurry with the next project before the other Big 3 competitors get too complacent now that there biggest opponent is gone!! [:o)] ;)

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/My%201950%202r5%20Studebaker%20Pickup%20with%20turbocharger/P1000145-1.jpg
[img=left]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/My%201950%202r5%20Studebaker%20Pickup%20with%20turbocharger/P1000137-1.jpg[/img=left]
[img=right]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/DSC00005.jpg?t=1171153370[/img=right]
[IMG=left]http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t102/PlainBrownR2/Ex%20Studebaker%20Plant%20Locomotive/P1000578-1.jpg[/IMG=left]

BobPalma
09-25-2008, 07:48 AM
quote:Originally posted by PlainBrownR2

I just read on the retirement and about spit out my Pepsi Max [:o)]!! I remember when the PBW first appeared in TW. It had gotten into the 15's(correct me on this, but I know it was down there), and at the time the Studebaker was a punchline rather than a competitor. We were the farmer's car, the fuddy duddy guys, the guys who belonged in with the Metropolitans, and so on and so forth. From the article, by the end of the race, that punchline wasn't so funny no more [}:)]. Well that quarter mile ticked down over the years, and thanks in part to the PBW, that stigma started to disappear. In the last couple of years we even began getting a following from the Big 3 fans on this car, as to whether it would appear at the strip or not. This car even had some other cars show up with it as a group to lend support in the traditional Studebaker fashion, as well as make some figurative automotive noise of their own on the track, such as one well known White R1 4 speed [}:)]. We even got some insight into some of the issues that made things interesting in getting the numbers down. I remember some problems that involved that God aweful wheel hop from the getgo, and that equally God aweful belt slip at the upper end of the rpm band [:o)]. Needless to say though, this little vehicle is a milestone for SDC, as it's proven that yes, we can be equally as nasty as our big block brethren(I've brought that on a few of the modern cars around here, heh heh heh).

Just like the retirement of Jordan here when he left the Bulls, I can honestly say that the PBW will be going out on a pretty high note. I can understand what a loss it would be if one of those original R3 pistons let loose in the chamber at the end of the strip, which is also why I understand why it is leaving at this stage of the game(and boy has it ever been long in the game, lol). I only hope that it will make some cameo appearances at the Intl' Meets(I think I may have pictures, lol), that would be great [^]. That would be just as good if another R3 could be built to fill the already large shoes of the PBW. Just remember the mantra of the CS category and what's involved there, as well as what went into the construction of the PBW. Now before I ramble too much more, I would like to say it was a great run with the PBW, and best of luck with the next project. I never saw it race, but with TW covering it, I got a pretty good idea of the reputation it had over there over years. Anyway, better hurry with the next project before the other Big 3 competitors get too complacent now that there biggest opponent is gone!! [:o)] ;)



:) Thanks, John; much appreciated.

You asked to be corrected as to The PBW's original times, so here goes. You'll want to reference the January 1999 Turning Wheels; the issue in which we reported our initial (September, 1998) outing to The Pure Stock Muscle Car Drag Race. The PBW ran ten practice races and won all ten of them that year, but only the first two ETs were in the 14s (not 15s)...and after that, all runs were in the 13s.

Yes, it promptly got everyone's attention, including that of then-Muscle Car Review Editor Tom Shaw, on location with feature writer Dale Amy. They immediately button-holed us for a photo shoot the very next day (Saturday, Sept 12, 1998). The article from Dale's pen appearing in the May 1999 Muscle Car Review christened it The Plain Brown Wrapper. It was Dale Amy who named the car, no

63larkr1
09-25-2008, 09:06 AM
I posted the last run by the PBW on youtube. You can see it here. Thanks to Ted and Mary Ann.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_aoyow4GjM
See more Studebaker drag videos.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=richpoe50&search_type=&aq=f
Richard

Dick Steinkamp
09-25-2008, 09:14 AM
quote:Originally posted by 63larkr1

I posted the last run by the PBW on youtube. You can see it here. Thanks to Ted and Mary Ann.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_aoyow4GjM
See more Studebaker drag videos.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=richpoe50&search_type=&aq=f
Richard


Great videos, Richard...Thanks!

In the first one, I originally thought the Olds driver put a hole shot on Ted, but in looking at it again, I see the red light came on in his lane. I'm sure the Olds knew he had to cut an excellent light to have a chance against Ted and the Wrapper...a little TOO close, however.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s66/ddstnkmp/Stude-a-mino%20old%20pics/oldpics6asmall.jpg

BobPalma
09-25-2008, 09:57 AM
quote:Originally posted by 63larkr1

I posted the last run by the PBW on youtube. You can see it here. Thanks to Ted and Mary Ann.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_aoyow4GjM
See more Studebaker drag videos.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=richpoe50&search_type=&aq=f
Richard


[:0] Sorry, Richard; I started a new thread when this came through our regular e-mail, before checking here. Oh, well; I'm sure folks will want to see it since it was the last run ever, and it might get lost this deep in the orignal topic.

Thanks again for the link(s). :DBP

mbstude
09-25-2008, 12:06 PM
I agree with all that's been said here, and I like the idea of retiring the car before something bad happens. I sure would've like to have seen it run at least once, though.

TEN YEARS. That's one heck of a good run, for sure. Well done guys. [8D][^]

Matthew Burnette

ddub
09-25-2008, 12:37 PM
I agree with all the others, there is not much left to prove. What a thrill it has been for those of us who grew up driving Studes to have this fabulous little car be our Champion! Well done. As some one once said,"If it ain't broke, why break it."

Don Wilson
53 Commander Hardtop
64 Champ 1/2 ton
Centralia, WA

63larkr1
09-25-2008, 03:17 PM
Just in case there is confusion, the rest of us will still be racing our Studebakers at future Pure Stock events, and more will join us. George and Ted started this out. Well deserved congratulations to them for all they have done, what a great accomplishment.
Richard

Warren Webb
09-25-2008, 06:08 PM
Hats off to George & Ted!! Thanks for giving us all what we have known for years & proving to the world the potential that our brand had & backing it up with such overwhelming proof. Lets celebrate the fact of PBR's longevity & its "Endurance Built" legecy!

60 Lark convertible
61 Champ
62 Daytona convertible
63 G.T. R-2,4 speed
63 Avanti (2)
66 Daytona Sport Sedan

BobPalma
09-25-2008, 08:39 PM
:) And to back up what Richard Poe just said: We will continue to campaign The Stude Tomato at future Pure Stock Muscle Car Drag Races every fall.

Part of the reason for retiring The Plain Brown Wrapper was so I could haul The Tomato up on my trailer and Ted wouldn't have to get beat to death on the rough Michigan stretch of I-69 in his 1961 Stude Hauler Truck. Ted and Mary Ann will be able to ride up comfortably in a car and still have The Tomato there for competition. :DBP

41 Frank
09-25-2008, 10:07 PM
I'm glad now that we were able to make it to the PSMCD in time to see the wrapper make its last runs on Friday considering we had not planned to be there until Saturday. Having stayed in touch with BP while heading there it became apparent there may not be any races on Saturday, so we forged ahead and got there in time to watch them finish drying the track and get the cars out to make at least some runs, albeit it was not in actual competition.

Frank van Doorn
1962 GT Hawk 4 speed
1963 Daytona Conv
1941 Champion R-2 Rod

R3 challenger
09-25-2008, 11:30 PM
Bob is right--it would be fun to get the Wrapper to the 2009 Cedar Rapids meet. Hope we can do it.

Someone asked if the Wrapper was at the 1972 international meet in South Bend. The answer is yes! I'm always amazed when people remember things about the car from that long ago. In fact, those were the years when there were only two "Best of Show" tropies--one pre-war and one post-war; the Wrapper won best of show for post-war cars in 1972. Bob and I were sitting at the same table when trophy announcements were made. When the Wrapper (it wasn't called the Wrapper then) did not win any award in its class, I felt kind of discouraged because I had done a lot of engine and chassis detailling. A few minutes later, the best of show awards were announced, the Wrapper having competed with maybe 150+ other cars. That was almost as good a feeling as beating a GTO at the strip! I still have the trophy.

George

george krem

studegary
10-11-2008, 02:24 PM
I certainly can understand George's decision. It is his car and he should do as he sees fit.
I remember the car from the early '70s when it was making a great deal of noise in a motel parking lot in South Bend one evening.
People should keep in mind that this not a super rare car in that Studebaker did not build the car as an R-3.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

BobPalma
10-11-2008, 10:13 PM
Originally posted by studegary
People should keep in mind that this not a super rare car in that Studebaker did not build the car as an R-3.
Gary L.


[}:)] True, Gary, BUT:

1. It's never, ever, to anyone, anywhere, been represented as anything other than a clone.

This adventure began in April 1998 when I was reading the current Muscle Car Review. Under "Coming Attractions" was a note about an event called The Pure Stock Muscle Car Drag Race in September. I didn't know any more about the event than what little was printed there.

There was a phone number to call for more information. I called the number and a stranger by the name of Bob Boden, who turned out to be one of the event's two promoters (Dan Jensen being the other one) answered.

I introduced myself and asked if we could bring an R3-powered 1964 Studebaker to the event and run it, explaining in that initial call that the car was not assembled with an R3 engine, but was a car Studebaker would have built if someone had ordered it, and we had period documentation to prove that.

Bob Boden could not have been more enthusiastic about our bringing the car. That initial conversation lasted over an hour and resulted in our taking the car to the 1998 event that September.

Editor Tom Shaw of Muscle Car Review saw the car and watched it perform. He immediately called Writer Dale Amy over and got us to stay for a photo shoot and feed information about the car to Dale for a feature article. That article appeared in the May 1999 Muscle Car Review. At that time, we stressed to Dale that the car was a clone and that only one such car had been factory-assembled; the Strato Blue Commander 2-door owned by Nelson Bove.

2. If George had enough money in 1963 (factory-assembled R3 "Larks" weren't available in calendar year 1964) to order this car factory equipped with an R3 engine, we would never have raced it in the first place due to its rarity.

So the fact that it is a clone is an advantage to the Studebaker hobby. It has demonstrated 'way better than all the bench racing in the world, what Studebaker was capable of in 1963/1964...which was the original idea. :DBP

STEWDI
10-12-2008, 12:16 AM
Thank you Ted and George. I can't say it any better than Warren Webb's post.
In September of 1998, the whole family went to Saginaw, MI. where we dropped off the females for shopping. The guys - ours son, plus a good friend of his (both about 18 years old at the time) and myself - took a side trip to witness the fisrt appearance of George's '64 at the PSMCD. I bought the shirt to prove it. We had a great time and took some video. I was in the stands when the X-brand fans couldn't believe their eyes. Imagine - a Studebaker beating a W31 Olds!!??
A great memory. Thanks again.

Roger "153624" Hill

55 Champion
47 M-5
Izzer Buggy
Junior Wagon