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Tennessee hillbilly
08-26-2008, 04:29 PM
I do not put many posts on the Forum, maybe 5 over the last few years, but I read it every day and it really bugs me to see someone called a ''Moron''because someone does not like the asking price of an item. No matter if the advertizer is a member of the S.D.C. or not. If you need the item and don't like the price don't buy it. If you don't need it then the price is none of your business. please don't call the advertizer a name. I can see by the responses no one is sure of what the price should be anyway. Don't be beating the guy up.

Mark57
08-26-2008, 04:33 PM
TH - to be fair, if you are referencing the post from this morning:

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=21798

then the term "moron" was being applied to the bidder who was willing to pay $200 or so for a body panel that was available NOS from SASCO for about $75.

I agree with many others that have replied that use of that term is too strong of a moniker and it would have been much better to have directed the discussion as to how we could better educate Studebaker owners about where to find needed parts at the most reasonable prices. :)
The seller is obviously no moron if they can sell a $75 panel for $200 - he/she is a shrewd business person! ;)

<h5>[b]Mark
'57 Transtar Deluxe
Vancouver Island

Are you planning to attend the NW Overdrive Tour in Parksville, BC
May 23 & 24, 2009?</h5>
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x153/MarkH57/57TranstarSM.jpg

54-61-62
08-26-2008, 05:13 PM
You know, I really try to interact and be a productive member of the forum society. Being politically correct and socially correct does not come as first nature for me. I grew up in a independent,poor, rough, farming area where social correctness was considered a luxury at best. I'm sorry at times I am not politically correct or the most eloquent at treading lightly not to offend anybody.

However.... Honestly, I think it is stupid and/or ignorant that ebay bidders get caught up in way over bidding on a part that SASCO has in stock, part # 1338128, for $89.90 I just checked to back up my previous statement. Its sad that while Dennis will be sitting in South Bend freezing his ass off this winter trying to save and sell the world's biggest OEM parts supply, that there are some folks out there that don't know or care to know about the SDC and rather pay almost 3 times for a part from the contemporary anti-human interface called ebay.

I am really tired of the mob mentality here and an attack from some unknown perhaps troller with 3 posts. What in the hell happened to the Studebaker family of enthusiasts that interacted with each other so well? Is it because the forum has grown outside of the die-hard core group and now is drawing others who are not familiar with Studebakers, CASO's or the price of parts? I sure don't want the Studebaker forum to end up like a stereotypical Corvette group, but it looks like its going that way. I guess the hard-core geasy-fingernailed group of guys who still drive a rusty hawk or lark daily as a way of life is getting replaced with a new sort of contemporary urban collector with attributes parallel to the stereotypical corvette collector.

BobGlasscock
08-26-2008, 05:32 PM
54-61-62, I agree with you on the "auction" topic. But I would spread that out to include any and all auctions. At some point in every auction, some bidder exceeds the reasonable price available elsewhere, and then brags about how MUCH (quantity) they paid for an item. It's stupid and a$$inine. Why not just throw that money into a bonfire. And Ebay is built upon that premise. Even the company words encourage bidding more, "winning" items, and more. Just plain stupid.
Let me go to a used merchandise store for good used things or a retail outlet for new good things. Won't find me buying at an auction. And yes, I certainly do sell on Ebay! Those buyers are stupid with money!!

'50 Champion, 1 family owner
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff019.jpghttp://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff018.jpg

Guido
08-26-2008, 06:49 PM
quote:Originally posted by BobGlasscock
Won't find me buying at an auction. Over the past 35+ years I have bough numerous items at auction, from $.25 trinkets to tools, furniture, farm equipment, memorabilia, tractors, trucks, trailers, etc. (even Studebakers and parts). I must admit, I have gotten some good deals and have made money on some of it flipping it at a later date. Of course, I still have a lot of the stuff much to my wife's chagrin.

The secret is knowing what an item is worth (market value if reselling, sentimental/collector value if keeping) and not exceeding that limit. As Bob says, i have seen many people bid up a used item to more than a new item (with a warranty) would cost.

Often the best deals come at the end of an auction (unfortunately much of may be junk). People just wear out and give up and go home. At some sales I have actually been allowed to take away stuff for free that no one would bid on.

I used to go every year to a 2 day sale about 10 miles from where the meet is being held in Lancaster. The sale would attract about 3000 bidders and they would have as many as 5 rings going at once. On more than one occasion I would buy something and sell it at a significant markup to someone who saw it in my pile and just had to have it.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/63/663/9/36/86/2567936860097493054TXiheL_th.jpgGuido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful" and real Studebaker horsepower lives

See pictures here: http://community.webshots.com/user/GuidoSalvage

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

Jimmie
08-26-2008, 07:05 PM
I have been on the forum a short time compared to most so I am wrestling a little about whether I should even comment. But it really bothers me when others on the forum or anywhere in life do not get along. I have become so attached to this forum that I find myself talking to others about it almost daily. I tell them how helpful it is and how the people work together to help each other out with solutions and suggestions etc.

I could be critized for my poor use of the English language, especially with my background. But, even though I try to not come across as someone totally uneducated, I really do not worry about it too much because I have found this forum to be such a forgiving group of men and women. I can let my hair down as people used to say. I certainly hope that no one stops being a part of the group. Some of the questions that I ask might qualify me for having my ignorance pointed out, but so far just the opposite has been happening. This is coming from someone who has always had a hard time with keeping his heart where it should be rather than out on his sleeve, so I have spent a lot of time feeling offended, but I sure hope this thing can pass quickly and quietly.

Jimmie



quote:Originally posted by 54-61-62

You know, I really try to interact and be a productive member of the forum society. Being politically correct and socially correct does not come as first nature for me. I grew up in a independent,poor, rough, farming area where social correctness was considered a luxury at best. I'm sorry at times I am not politically correct or the most eloquent at treading lightly not to offend anybody.

However.... Honestly, I think it is stupid and/or ignorant that ebay bidders get caught up in way over bidding on a part that SASCO has in stock, part # 1338128, for $89.90 I just checked to back up my previous statement. Its sad that while Dennis will be sitting in South Bend freezing his ass off this winter trying to save and sell the world's biggest OEM parts supply, that there are some folks out there that don't know or care to know about the SDC and rather pay almost 3 times for a part from the contemporary anti-human interface called ebay.

I am really tired of the mob mentality here and an attack from some unknown perhaps troller with 3 posts. What in the hell happened to the Studebaker family of enthusiasts that interacted with each other so well? Is it because the forum has grown outside of the die-hard core group and now is drawing others who are not familiar with Studebakers, CASO's or the price of parts? I sure don't want the Studebaker forum to end up like a stereotypical Corvette group, but it looks like its going that way. I guess the hard-core geasy-fingernailed group of guys who still drive a rusty hawk or lark daily as a way of life is getting replaced with a new sort of contemporary urban collector with attributes parallel to the stereotypical corvette collector.


http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa221/studerich/Jim%20Judy/Picture1.jpg
1950 CHAMPION -ORANGE COUNTY, INDIANA
I'VE SAVED SO MUCH DAYLIGHT THAT THERE'S NO DARK TO SLEEP IN ANYMORE!

bams50
08-26-2008, 07:11 PM
????

Bob and Guido, what does that have to do with the subject?[:o)]

As Jeff said and deleted, it's really a manners issue. TH's point is well-taken. It's like posting about somebody's work and making fun of it- the only thing it's good for is taking a shot at a stranger.

Kent, the bidder(s) on that panel may very well be somebody that knows nothing about our resources, and is just trying to fix up an old car they found that they've never seen before but think is pretty neat. The vast majority of non-Stude folks I talk to say, "Wow, where'd you ever get parts for one of those??" They just don't know.

It was just 5 or 6 years ago I was going to fix up a very rusty 64 Commander 4dr. 6 banger because I thought it might be worth the effort. I went to the 'net to search for any info I could find; and the search turned up this site. Luckily I found out that if I put a few thousand dollars and a couple hundred hours into it I'd have a nice $700 car- before I did so[:o)] Whew!

The "moron" moniker wasn't a really big deal; but probably wasn't fair, is all. No offense.

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

50Champ
08-26-2008, 07:54 PM
As I've said before, I'm a full time Ebay Power Seller with over 21,000 transactions since 1999 and I could tell you a lot of stories about people overbidding on items. Should I feel bad if someone pays $125 for an owner's manual for a '65 Riviera when the opening bid was $9.99? Hell no, because I didn't hold a gun to their head and force them to bid that much. There have been dozens of times where an item didn't sell so I relisted it and the second time it ran it sold for several times the amount they could have paid for it the previous week. Does that make me a moron? I don't think so. Nobody is forcing these people to bid these amounts so why do some of you guys let it bother you so much?

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1188/4526177/20234971/329233113.jpg

1950 Champion 2 Dr. Sedan

BobGlasscock
08-26-2008, 08:01 PM
Whew! I think I just figured out what Bams50 meant. I think Tennessee Hillbilly was reviewing the opinions expressed on the forum about a seller being called a name by an SDC member due to a difference in knowledge (or opinion) between the seller and SDCer. I get it now!! :) I think Guido and I (ok, absolutely me) were talking about the buyers only.

Now that I think I have it figured out, Bams50 is right, what the heck are we talking about. Sellers can ask whatever they want, and buyers can be stupid.

'50 Champion, 1 family owner
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff019.jpghttp://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff018.jpg

Guido
08-26-2008, 08:11 PM
quote:Originally posted by bams50
Bob and Guido, what does that have to do with the subject?[:o)] I just tangeticized Bob's tangent ( I think creating an arc in a plane).

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/63/663/9/36/86/2567936860097493054TXiheL_th.jpgGuido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful" and real Studebaker horsepower lives

See pictures here: http://community.webshots.com/user/GuidoSalvage

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

bams50
08-26-2008, 08:14 PM
I'm just saying that there's no reason to call a buyer- or seller, for that matter- a moron. They very well could be- but they may just be uninformed.

That was me not all that long ago;)

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

41 Frank
08-26-2008, 08:24 PM
What? :D



quote:Originally posted by Guido


quote:Originally posted by bams50
Bob and Guido, what does that have to do with the subject?[:o)] I just tangeticized Bob's tangent ( I think creating an arc in a plane).

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/63/663/9/36/86/2567936860097493054TXiheL_th.jpgGuido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful" and real Studebaker horsepower lives

See pictures here: http://community.webshots.com/user/GuidoSalvage

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

jbwhttail
08-26-2008, 09:24 PM
Bams is correct, who are we to critize a person for his/her willingness to purchase a car or part for any dollar amount? Ebay is a great resource for those connected to the internet, does not the internet also afford EACH of the buyers and sellers research capabilities?

Who are we to chastise a buyer or seller for what the free market determines a "fair" price.

Moron.......... A person who displays the mildest form of mental deficiency (Webster). I'd suggest a better word is "un-informed".

We need to let the free market work and not critique only those ebay items not listed or purchased by CASO's. Be fair,treat others as you would like to be treated.

It is an addiction!

torker
08-26-2008, 11:07 PM
When I saw the topic heading, I just knew it was a subject I could relate to, and I went for the Bait. No shock that my little buddy has already been here. Chuckle. Anyway, I got burned on an EBay item (or two) in the manner previously described until I bid on a factory chassis parts catalog and a body parts catalog for my car. Got both of them for below new vendor prices,BTW. Plus, picked up an SI Catalogue, which is a very good reference work as well. Then, I can do my homework and research the availability of nos/repro parts for my project, and not pay too much if and when I bid on EBay. Studebaker-only swap meets usualy have informed buyers/sellers and lower prices and hard-to-find items that vendors don't catalog, but you still have to factor in the transportation and time cost and divide it by the Fun Factor. That is all I wanted to say.

Andy R.
08-26-2008, 11:21 PM
quote:bams50 Posted - 08/26/2008 : 8:14:08 PM

I'm just saying that there's no reason to call a buyer- or seller, for that matter- a moron. They very well could be- but they may just be uninformed.

That was me not all that long ago

Hear, hear. Compared to the experience and resourcefulness on this forum, it could STILL be me.
Driving with 215s on my stock rims (came with 'em) it IS me![:0]

It's all relative.;)


Andy
62 GT
http://a6.vox.com/6a00cdf7ec2443094f00e398c6501e0004-pi

studeclunker
08-27-2008, 12:19 AM
My, my, my, no one can say that things don't get exciting around here.[:0]:D It's almost been as entertaining as.. oh, the Clinton presidency, today.;) Calm down Kent. We are all entitled to our opinion, and it's okay for the braver members, like you, and the foolish ones, like me, to express theirs as well.[8)] If anyone is offended by an opinion, well... Other's opinions give us an insight to where we need to improve, and sometimes can lead to a thoughtful introspection. Sometimes we need to grow just a wee bit and thicken our skins so that we can see clearer a larger picture.;)

Well... I kinda have to weigh in on Kent's side of this issue. There are a lot of cars and parts on e-bay that go for stupid-high prices because of ignorance and pride. I got a message from a winner of a carb I'd been bidding on and he won with some kind of sniping software. He paid a fair price and crowed about his 'victory' over me. Whatever, it takes all kinds. On the other hand, these artificially high prices encourage sellers to place items on the 'bay at unreasonable prices. There are two side-draft carbs on the 'bay that have been there for months with no takers. I've made reasonable offers to both sellers and they think they'll eventually get buyers at their asking price. They probably will. So, I go on searching for a carb for Bess.

Some things on the 'bay go for inflated prices because they photograph well. For instance, there's a '57 wagon on there that I'd never pay more than seven or eight hundred for. It's way past that. People have ID'd it here and stated that it has serious problems that are hidden. The photographs by the seller carefully hide those flaws. Hopefully, the buyer doesn't get too bitter by their experiance. These things happen. On the other hand, Bess was photographed in a way that didn't hide anything. The seller was up front about all her warts. She went for a fair price and I've been very pleased with her so far. I just hope everyone who uses the 'bay keeps their head and comes out with as good experiances as I have.

As to this forum? The members are just as helpful and frendly as they always have been. One just has to remember that everyone has an opinion and a right to express it.:D Everyone else has the perfect right to ignore that opinion as well.;)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/december%2006/HPIM0234.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Home of the famous Mr. Ed!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

DEEPNHOCK
08-27-2008, 08:25 AM
Sometimes I am so glad that we have the 'delete' feature.
I did a little self control on that reply and thought it sounded a bit preachy, which it wasn't meant to do...
Our participation in this forum is voluntary and related to our passion about Studebaker's.
I like to think our passion should be positively directed.
Applying labels to others, and name calling just isn't positive in my book.
And it won't get new people and outsiders to participate.
Jeff[8D]




quote:Originally posted by bams50

????
&lt;snip&gt;
As Jeff said and deleted, it's really a manners issue. TH's point is well-taken. It's like posting about somebody's work and making fun of it- the only thing it's good for is taking a shot at a stranger.
&lt;snip&gt;

65cruiser
08-27-2008, 09:47 AM
And....we didn't have to call in the CLIQUE MOB![8D]

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j137/wilson_tarbuckles/cole/3.jpg
[quote]Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK

Sometimes I am so glad that we have the 'delete' feature.
I did a little self control on that reply and thought it sounded a bit preachy, which it wasn't meant to do...
Our participation in this forum is voluntary and related to our passion about Studebaker's.
I like to think our passion should be positively directed.
Applying labels to others, and name calling just isn't positive in my book.
And it won't get new people and outsiders to participate.
Jeff[8D]

Mark Anderson
Member SDC and FMCA
Keeper of the Studebaker Cruiser Registry
www.65cruiser.com


http://www.65cruiser.com/images/studewordy.jpg

JDP
08-27-2008, 10:17 AM
It's funny how it works. We want to encourage the lurkers to post, and when one does post a mild critique, he's labeled as a troll with but a few posts. I think the regulars with 100's and 1000's of posts need to be specially careful about the tone they use.
I think it's all about tone. Had the post header have been "ebay prices" or even "WTF", and discussed how sad it is that some don't have a good handle on vendor prices, we would not be having this discussion.

JDP/Maryland
"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson

Mark57
08-27-2008, 10:28 AM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

It's funny how it works. We want to encourage the lurkers to post, and when one does post a mild critique, he's labeled as a troll with but a few posts. I think the regulars with 100's and 1000's of posts need to be specially careful about the tone they use.
I think it's all about tone. Had the post header have been "ebay prices" or even "WTF", and discussed how sad it is that some don't have a good handle on vendor prices, we would not be having this discussion.

JDP/Maryland



John - I think you have hit the nail square on the head with your observation. Hence I have modified my earlier response accordingly. [:I]

<h5>Mark
'57 Transtar Deluxe
Vancouver Island

Are you planning to attend the NW Overdrive Tour in Parksville, BC
May 23 & 24, 2009?</h5>
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x153/MarkH57/57TranstarSM.jpg

buddymander
08-28-2008, 09:53 AM
Whenever I hear the word "moron" it reminds me of a new indian casino called MORONGO. Get it? MORON-GO?

4961Studebaker
08-28-2008, 01:10 PM
well the panel that started this whole thread sold for $200. I feel for the person who finds out they could have purchased it new from sasco for 89.90 like I did.

OH: I sent the buyer an email through the bay, which I don't do unless I'm bidding on an item, and I passed along some sasco information. I hope the buyer was an individual looking to restore his/her stude and just didn't know the vast parts rescources that are out there. I do find that a bit hard to comprehend, they obviously have internet to find ebay....so is google not there friend when it comes to searches? Either way. I tried to help. Disclaimer: I didn't call them a moron in the friendly email.
ChopStu
http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q14/kkad0711/IMG_5406-1.jpg

JDP
08-28-2008, 01:31 PM
Be careful e-mailing a bidder' especially if you point out another source for the item up for bid. Ebay could nail you for auction interference by so doing. If you just gave him a hint as to general Studebaker parts sources, you're cool.

JDP/Maryland
"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson

4961Studebaker
08-28-2008, 01:33 PM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

Be careful e-mailing a bidder' especially if you point out another source for the item up for bid. Ebay could nail you for auction interference by so doing. If you just gave him a hint as to general Studebaker parts sources, you're cool.


Duely noted,;) however in this case the items auction had concluded.

ChopStu
http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q14/kkad0711/IMG_5406-1.jpg

JDP
08-28-2008, 02:28 PM
True, but what happens if the bidder decides to back out or give the seller a negative because he perceives he was`ripped off.

JDP/Maryland
"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson

4961Studebaker
08-28-2008, 04:12 PM
Just as I suspected, just got an email back, the nice man had no idea that some of the vendors existed. :(

I think after another personal email there could be a new member.:D

Just trying to do my part. (within the rules[B)])


ChopStu
http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q14/kkad0711/IMG_5406-1.jpg

BobGlasscock
08-28-2008, 04:18 PM
Sounds to me like you're doing a mighty fine job there ChopStu! One more member, one less ....

'50 Champion, 1 family owner
http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff019.jpghttp://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg316/studebakerbob/SDC%20avatar/Studebakerstuff018.jpg

ChampTrucking
08-28-2008, 10:22 PM
LOL @ The Clique mob-now that defines MORON!!
(silly how Clique Mob references continue to crack me up)

JRoberts
08-29-2008, 09:39 AM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

It's funny how it works. We want to encourage the lurkers to post, and when one does post a mild critique, he's labeled as a troll with but a few posts. I think the regulars with 100's and 1000's of posts need to be specially careful about the tone they use.

JDP/Maryland
"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson



Amen!

Joe Roberts
'61 R1 Champ
'65 Cruiser
Editor of "The Down Easterner"
Eastern North Carolina Chapter

JDP
09-02-2008, 12:21 AM
Looks like the high bidder did in fact back out.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ10076QQihZ018QQitemZ280261671916

JDP/Maryland
"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson

Mark57
09-02-2008, 12:29 AM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

Looks like the high bidder did in fact back out.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ10076QQihZ018QQitemZ280261671916

JDP/Maryland


Wonder if he/she read this thread?? ;)

<h5>Mark
'57 Transtar Deluxe
Vancouver Island

Are you planning to attend the NW Overdrive Tour in Parksville, BC
May 23 & 24, 2009?</h5>
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x153/MarkH57/CandyStoreThumb.jpg