Champion-powered TROG racer build

[SouthBendShaker]

Well since the TROG Rail Class car I discussed garnered a little interest, I figured I would start a build thread here for anyone who cares to follow along.

At at this point we have completely broken down the Model A chassis, drilled and modified the rails to sit completely parallel the entire length (similar to a Model T), then narrowed it 8 inches to keep it as skinny as possible. This will be a single seat, center-steer setup.

The Champion six will be a perfect fit, and isn’t physically much larger than the Ford 4 cylinder. It will be sitting just ahead of the chassis centerline to keep the weight distributed as evenly as possible. This should help with traction on the loose sand with skinny tires.

So here’s our mock-up with the engine/trans in the chassis. Lots of work to go, but so far we’re having a blast!

[Dick Steinkamp]

Great start! Keep the progress reports coming. I assume you are doing New Jersey and not Santa Barbara?

You are probably deep into this already, but if not, there was a 185 CID version of this engine. Lots of speed parts available (new and used). Bill Cathcart is (was?) the guru on building these engines for performance... http://www.studebaker-info.org/Cathcart/bc.html

[BobPalma]

Sadly, Bill Cathcart passed away almost a year ago:

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?107745-Bill-Cathcart&highlight=cathcart

He was indeed "the man" on those engines.

Best wishes on the TROG project; 'way cool! BP

[PackardV8]

Lots of speed parts available (new and used).

Dick, we agree on most things Studebaker, but in my experience, Champion speed parts were and are hen's teeth. The only new part I'm aware of still produced is the Offenhauser intake manifold. The last two used aluminum heads brought to me were so corroded they couldn't be cost-effectively saved. Even necessary rebuild parts, such as .005" oversize lifters are NLA. We still do the occasional hot rod Champion build, but they're always a challenge.

If any here know of lots of new and used Champion speed parts, I'll buy some.

jack vines

[Dick Steinkamp]

Dick, we agree on most things Studebaker, but in my experience, Champion speed parts were and are hen's teeth. The only new part I'm aware of still produced is the Offenhauser intake manifold. The last two used aluminum heads brought to me were so corroded they couldn't be cost-effectively saved. Even necessary rebuild parts, such as .005" oversize lifters are NLA. We still do the occasional hot rod Champion build, but they're always a challenge.

If any here know of lots of new and used Champion speed parts, I'll buy some.

jack vines

Jack,
I am likely living in the past (again )

[Chris Pile]

Stude power at TROG! That's awesome. Keep us informed, I think your car will fit right in.

[(S)]

Jack, can you just drop in oversized ones or is machining required?. I was thinking if you can't find + .010 maybe a +005 or .003 would be better than a 'smoker'?

[PackardV8]

Jack, can you just drop in oversized ones or is machining required?. I was thinking if you can't find + .010 maybe a +005 or .003 would be better than a 'smoker'?

From the 1940s on, Studebaker Engineering was aware the Champion lifter bore wear was a problem. Instead of fixing the problem, they just had the Parts Department stock .001" and .005" oversize valve lifters. The .001"s would usually drop in at the first rebuild. By the time .005" are needed, the bores are hourglass shaped. This requires a special reamer and then honing to final fit.

We bought the tooling and got pretty good at using the .005", about the time the supply of NOS was used up.

We're looking at two options; one is hard chroming and centerless grinding used lifters .005" oversize and the other option is to make special tooling to oversize the lifter bores to take bronze bushings to use new standard lifters.

jack vines

[what huh]

Yes please keep us informed! If you go to Jersey I would love to be part of your pit crew lol

[Pancho]

Good luck on your build. Mel is a nice guy. I’m sure you’ll have a good time. I made it to the one and only event at Pismo Beach in the rain. Look forward to following your progress.

[tsenecal]

I really enjoy TROG, and it will be great to see a team with Stude power. Good luck with your build, and also out there on the sand. It's on my bucket list to go and see a live race.

[SouthBendShaker]

Good luck on your build. Mel is a nice guy. I’m sure you’ll have a good time. I made it to the one and only event at Pismo Beach in the rain. Look forward to following your progress.

Thank you! I had my first conversation with Mel on Saturday and yes, he was very nice to some stranger calling him from Ohio with intentions of running this weird Studebaker engine. He was actually pretty pumped about it, so that's a good start. I am sure it'll be a hoot! I have two friends who ran at Pismo. What a time that was! Haha.

[SouthBendShaker]

Dick, we agree on most things Studebaker, but in my experience, Champion speed parts were and are hen's teeth. The only new part I'm aware of still produced is the Offenhauser intake manifold. The last two used aluminum heads brought to me were so corroded they couldn't be cost-effectively saved. Even necessary rebuild parts, such as .005" oversize lifters are NLA. We still do the occasional hot rod Champion build, but they're always a challenge.

Thank you for the Reply Jack. I can see me having some questions for you in the future! Haha.

And yes, we would LOVE to find an aluminum head for this engine, but I know of the scarcity. I actually had a friend from CA send me a Edmunds finned head in good condition, but it turned out to be for the bigger Stude six. Pretty disappointing, but what can ya do?

[rkapteyn]

Jack
Do you know a Mike Forrest , who rebuilds Studebaker engines in the state of Washington?
Is he connected with your engine shop?

[PackardV8]

Jack
Do you know a Mike Forrest , who rebuilds Studebaker engines in the state of Washington?
Is he connected with your engine shop?

Hi, Bob,

No, we're not acquainted with Mr. Forrest. Where is he located?

jack