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Thread: Operating B.W. T86E 3-speed O.D.

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    Operating B.W. T86E 3-speed O.D.

    OK... as I've been posting, I'm helping my buddy Bob restore his dad's '49 Studey truck, and I've rebuilt a T86E 3-speed O.D. trans for his truck. It's going behind a Stude 259 V8 that we're rebuilding this summer.

    So you'll have to pardon my ignorance, but I've never messed with an O.D. trans before.

    Bob wants a floor shift, and so I came up with a T-90 floor shifter and am in the process of mating it to the T-86 trans. Now in stock configuration on this O.D. trans, the 1st/Rev shift arm, when rotating into the Rev position also pushes a little plunger that... does something...maybe disabling the O.D?

    My question is this: Now that I'm putting a floor shift on the trans, do I also have to rig up some sort of extra lever or cable for Bob to pull out to move the Rev shift arm when he wants to back up? Or can he just push in the O.D. cable and accomplish the same thing?
    Thanks for any help on this.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member r1lark's Avatar
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    Well..........you could pull the OD cable everytime you need to backup, but IIMO that would get really old after a while.

    Usually there is a tab welded to the rear shift fork to contact the OD lockout rail. I've got pictures somewhere of at least one, but would need to find them. Others have left the original side shift mechanism in place (I belive they have to be somewhat modified though) so as the top shift moves the gears, the original side shift mechanism moves also. Thus the OD lockout rail gets pushed back when shifted into reverse.
    Paul
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    Welding a tab to the rear shift fork is a good idea if it can work. A picture would be great if you could find one. Thanks.

    The original 1st/Rev side-shift lever is intact on this trans.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member Ron Dame's Avatar
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    The overdrive engages at ..what....24-27 MPH? If you are backing up that fast, you deserve to blow up your overdrive.
    Later on, that whole rail and switch was eliminated when they realized the rediculousiness of it all.


    Quote Originally Posted by rrausch View Post
    OK... as I've been posting, I'm helping my buddy Bob restore his dad's '49 Studey truck, and I've rebuilt a T86E 3-speed O.D. trans for his truck. It's going behind a Stude 259 V8 that we're rebuilding this summer.

    So you'll have to pardon my ignorance, but I've never messed with an O.D. trans before.

    Bob wants a floor shift, and so I came up with a T-90 floor shifter and am in the process of mating it to the T-86 trans. Now in stock configuration on this O.D. trans, the 1st/Rev shift arm, when rotating into the Rev position also pushes a little plunger that... does something...maybe disabling the O.D?

    My question is this: Now that I'm putting a floor shift on the trans, do I also have to rig up some sort of extra lever or cable for Bob to pull out to move the Rev shift arm when he wants to back up? Or can he just push in the O.D. cable and accomplish the same thing?
    Thanks for any help on this.
    Ron Dame
    '63 Champ

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    Thank you Ron Dame--it's things like this that I need to learn. It makes sense, I'm just very inexperienced with O.D. units. Anybody else have any feedback on whether I need to consider that Rev. shift arm when I hook everything up?
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member r1lark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Dame View Post
    The overdrive engages at ..what....24-27 MPH? If you are backing up that fast, you deserve to blow up your overdrive.
    Later on, that whole rail and switch was eliminated when they realized the rediculousiness of it all.
    Ron, the OD lockout rail (actually called the OD shift rail) disengages the OD so you can back up. Without doing that, youi won't back up at all, much less get up any speed <G>. What you are thinking about is the lockout switch which was dropped in the mid-'50s IIRC.
    Paul
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    Visit The Studebaker Skytop Registry website at: www.studebakerskytop.com

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    So I guess it's back to making the shift rail disengage the O.D.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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    Thanks Gordr. That's the same top-loader shifter I have--a T90-148. It's good to hear from someone who has done this! Thanks.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Gordr, what did you do to move the 1st/Rev shift fork?

    The fork itself appears to be forged, and the shaft it slides on is hardened--I couldn't do anything but scratch the shaft with a file. The fork is positioned on the shaft with what looks like a 1/8th inch pin. I'm thinking about pulling the shaft out, annealing it and drilling it in order to relocate the shift fork. Comments?

    Here's a pictureP2240030.jpg
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member Ron Dame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by r1lark View Post
    Ron, the OD lockout rail (actually called the OD shift rail) disengages the OD so you can back up. Without doing that, youi won't back up at all, much less get up any speed <G>. What you are thinking about is the lockout switch which was dropped in the mid-'50s IIRC.
    Guess I'm confused..a state I am very familiar with. If you have no electrical contact to move the solenoid, how could it go into overdrive in reverse? I guess I really did not understand the function of the rail and thought it was just an anachronism that really did nothing anymore.
    Ron Dame
    '63 Champ

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    Robert, I didn't have to move the low-reverse shift fork. There are several different cases used in T86 and T90 transmissions, and not all T90 top covers will readily fit T86 cases. There may be also some differences in total throw on the shift forks when you mix and match like this. In my case, the cover and forks were compatible, as-is. If your cover does not fit all 6 holes on the case, then you may have to experiment to find the right orientation of the cover, so that both forks move their associated gears to the desired limits. You should be able to determine this by carefully measuring the travel of each gear relative to a fixed point (say the front face of the transmission case), and then measuring the travel of each fork relative to the same datum. Those values should be the same; if not figure out what you have to do to bring them into agreement. Or find another top cover. There is a top cover shifter made for the later model T86 long-tail transmission, because I have a NOS taxi transmission that has one.

    Ron, you do need to move the OD shift rail. The solenoid isn't the issue, it's the sprag clutch. With the OD shift rail in the forward position the sun gear is positioned such that, without the solenoid being energized, all torque flow is through the sprag clutch, which is the one-way device that allows free-wheeling. Engage reverse, and the mainshaft just spins, and you won't move. Probably, things will get broken, too.

    Once you have a top cover that works right with the gears in the main transmission case, adding the finger to operate the OD shift rail is a pretty simple matter.
    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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    Thanks Gord. This T90-148 top cover fits the bolt holes exactly. I'll do some measuring on the throw and the gear movement, and try to post the results later today.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Mystery (I think) solved!

    Take a look at this picture: See the orientation of the 1st/Rev slider gear? It's positioned so the shift collar is toward the rear of the trans. This is the picture I took of the trans as I was disassembling it in preparation for replacing the cluster and 1/st/Rev gear. This is the picture I referred to when I put this trans back together.

    PC190007.jpg

    So I was measuring things trying to figure out how much I'd have to reposition the 1st/Rev shift fork, and it looked like it would work pretty good if only that shift collar were on the front of that gear... and I had an "ah ha" moment, and looked in the Shop Manual--sure enough it shows the gear with the collar facing the front. So I looked at a picture I took of another T86E--a non-OD trans, and it has the collar facing front too. LOOKS LIKE WHOEVER REBUILT THE TRANS PREVIOUSLY INSTALLED THE GEAR WRONG! No wonder it broke! Here's the picture of the second trans:

    PC220018.jpg

    I can't say for absolute certainty, but right now it looks like all I have to do is flip that gear around and my top shifter will be shifting correctly. I will still have to fab up something to disengage the O.D. but at least ONE Problem might be easily fixed. I'll let everybody in about an hour--I should be able to flip it around in that time.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    OK, I pulled the trans apart and flipped the 1st/Rev gear around, and while I'm still going to have to make a small adjustment to that shift fork, it's much more doable that the way it was! Took me about 45 minutes--not too shoddy!
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member r1lark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Dame View Post
    Guess I'm confused..a state I am very familiar with. If you have no electrical contact to move the solenoid, how could it go into overdrive in reverse? I guess I really did not understand the function of the rail and thought it was just an anachronism that really did nothing anymore.
    Ron, the OD shift rail engages and disengages the sun gear, which effectively either enables or locks out the overdrive function. The OD shift rail can be moved two ways. One is by using the OD control/cable that mounts on the dash; if you pull this control out all the way, the OD is locked out, and if you push it in, the OD is enabled. The internal shift linkage does the same thing - when the tranny is shifted to reverse, the linkage pushes the OD shift rail back and locks it out, just the same as if you would have pulled the OD control on the dash out. It really does not have anything to do with the solenoid. If the OD is not locked out, the vehicle will not back up because the sprag clutch will not rotate in the opposite direction.

    Take a look at gordr's post/pictures here, it should help you visualize it: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...school+shifter
    Last edited by r1lark; 02-24-2012 at 08:54 PM. Reason: spelin'
    Paul
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    After getting the 1st/rev sliding gear flipped around, I've been working on getting the OD shift rail to move back when the trans is put into Rev. Here's where I am:
    Here's a column shift 1st/Rev shift fork in stock configuration. When the gear is moved by the top-loader shift fork, if this fork is also installed, it will move too, causing the column-shift shift arm (and cam) to rotate and actually push back on the shift rail. But like this it's too big to fit on the gear along with the top-loader shift fork. In fact I'll have to grind on both of them to get them to fit.
    P2260031.jpg

    Here I've got the column fork ground down (cooling it in ice water as I ground on it, so as not to anneal it), and I've installed it. Next I'll grind down the top-loader shift fork until they will both fit on that gear, and not bump into each other while going through neutral position.

    P2260030.jpg
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-26-2012 at 04:53 PM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Oops. After looking at Gary Ash's website, I see where he recommends grinding off about 1/3 of that shift fork. I probably only ground off about a 5th or so. So out she comes yet again! However, I'd rather have to R&R this fork a few times than grind off TOO MUCH.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    President Member Ron Dame's Avatar
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    The link did not work, but I did not think about how that sprag clutch would grab in reverse.

    Quote Originally Posted by r1lark View Post
    Ron, the OD shift rail engages and disengages the sun gear, which effectively either enables or locks out the overdrive function. The OD shift rail can be moved two ways. One is by using the OD control/cable that mounts on the dash; if you pull this control out all the way, the OD is locked out, and if you push it in, the OD is enabled. The internal shift linkage does the same thing - when the tranny is shifted to reverse, the linkage pushes the OD shift rail back and locks it out, just the same as if you would have pulled the OD control on the dash out. It really does not have anything to do with the solenoid. If the OD is not locked out, the vehicle will not back up because the sprag clutch will not rotate in the opposite direction.

    Take a look at gordr's post/pictures here, it should help you visualize it: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...school+shifter
    Ron Dame
    '63 Champ

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    (Link didn't work for me either)

    OK, it's looking better after some more grinding:

    P2260030.jpg

    And it's riding lower in the collar so the top-loader shift fork can get a more secure grab on the gear in order to shift it.

    P2260031.jpg
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    we appreciate the extra pix and explanation you are doing. I need all the details i can get 'cause i want to do this myself at some point
    keep up the good work
    ? yr M5 under restoration
    a bunch of non-Stude stuff

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    President Member r1lark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Dame View Post
    The link did not work, but I did not think about how that sprag clutch would grab in reverse.
    Try this: http://http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?13581-Old-School-Floor-Shifter-for-T86-part-one.&highlight=old-school+shifter
    Paul
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    Thanks tbirdbird! The more I get into it, the easier it becomes.

    I found an amusing detail on the T90 shifter I'm using on this T-86 trans. Take a look at this welch plug which some long-ago rebuilder installed into the shift-pin bore.
    Hmmmm... at least Bob, who owns the truck this is going into, will never be broke!
    P2260030.jpg
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Golden Hawk Member Dick Steinkamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gordr View Post
    BTW, Gord's converted T86 worked PERFECTLY in the Ute. Here's one of the first drives. Gord handling the camera work...

    Dick Steinkamp
    Bellingham, WA


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    Gorgeous car! Great job on the installation. It looks and sounds very, very well done.
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-26-2012 at 11:06 PM.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    OK, here's how I hooked up 1st/Rev gear so that when shifting to Rev. it does disconnect the O.D.

    I did measure the gear travel on the mainshaft, and the throw of the 1st/Rev shift fork on the top-loader shifter. Both measurements were 1&5/8ths. So I figured it would work OK and shift that gear through all three positions (Rev.-Neutral-1st) just fine.

    I had to pull the column shift-fork (the one inside the trans) once again and grind it down some more, and that meant pulling the OD/mainshaft out of the trans case again. I'm getting pretty good at this--it was about the 7th time R&R'd it on this trans, but I had to, as I don't have a borescope, and I like things to work well.

    And so I ground on the old column 1st/Rev shift-fork some more, and I took it down to about 60%. It still rides in the collar on the 1st/Rev gear just fine in all three positions--Rev/Neutral/1st. Then I started grinding on the top-loader 1st/Rev shift fork, and I took it down a bit more on it's left side.

    Here it is in it's final shape. (The shift fork to the side is the 2nd/3rd fork)
    T90 #4.jpg

    I punched out the roll-pin that positioned the 2nd/3rd shift fork in the top loader shifter pin and temporarily removed the 2nd/3rd shift fork.
    Here's a better picture:
    P2260031.jpg


    Notice the three detents on the end of that shifter pin--those detents position 2nd, Neutral, and 3rd gear. The other pin also has three detents for 1st, Neutral and Rev.
    Now then I took the T90 shifter over to my trans and set it in position so that both the inside shift fork and the T90 shift fork were riding in the collar of the 1st/Rev gear. I shifted the trans using the 1st/Rev shift lever on the side of the trans, which I had deliberately left in place for this purpose. I shifted it into Rev and then into Neutral and then into 1st. If the shift forks are going to bump into each other they will do it when that gear is shifted into the Neutral position--that's when the inside shift fork pivots to it's highest point. At that point they are the closest together. Sure enough, when I shifted that gear into Neutral the top-loader housing did get bumped upward about 1/16th or so. It wasn't much, but you don't want them making ANY contact. So I pulled the shifter off the trans and ground some more on the top-loader 1st/Rev shift fork. I took off a little more than 1/16th and took it back to the trans and tested it again--this time it didn't move at all when I shifted the trans from Rev through Neutral to 1st. When shifted between 1st and Rev. the O.D. lever on the side of the O.D. case does move as it should. Success!

    Here's a picture after the test. You can see the shift arm on the side of the trans that I used to manipulate 1st/Rev gear through its paces.
    P2260033.jpg

    Next thing is I have to get 2nd/3rd shifting correctly. That's on the agenda for this coming week.
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-26-2012 at 11:11 PM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    When you are done if you could post pics of the forks side by side with the untouched forks that would help us all understand just how much has to be ground off. So far your explanation is very clear for someone who has never done this
    ? yr M5 under restoration
    a bunch of non-Stude stuff

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    Thanks tbird!

    How much you grind off can vary. What's important is that the top loader shift fork sit in the collar deep enough to securely shift that gear forward and back. The small inside shift fork, coming from the side, only has to push back on the O.D. rail, so it can be ground down quite a bit. I just ground on the inside shift fork first and using Gary Ash's approximation, I took it down to a little over half it's original width. After I took this picture I ground on it some more.
    P2260030.jpg

    Then I installed the inside shift fork, and installed the mainshaft and O.D. unit, and just kept grinding on the top-loader shift fork until it fit into the collar without touching the other shift fork. Since you're running two shift forks in the same collar on the 1st/Rev gear, you have to grind them both down, but the one that gets ground down the least is the one that actually moves the gear.
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-27-2012 at 03:59 AM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    I see what you are doing, and I have heard of it being done this way before. Can I suggest that you remove the detent assembly and second-high shift quadrant from the case before final assembly? They way you have it now, you have to overcome two detents to shift into either low or reverse, and the force to overcome the second one has to be transmitted by the cut-down shift forks. I'm sure it will shift easier that way.
    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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    That's a good idea gordr. Thanks for that.

    Once the inside shift fork had been cut down, and installed, I then used the case's detent to position the 1st/Rev gear in Neutral. And then I also positioned the top-loader shifter in it's Neutral detent. Then I installed it, and slipped the shift fork into the collar and looked to see if the 6 mounting holes on the top shifter lined up with the 6 holes on the case. They lined up perfectly, so I knew that the 1st/Rev gear would shift just fine.

    Now I'll do that same for 2nd/3rd, and when I'm done then I'll pull the detents from the case.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    I set the trans in Neutral, and set the 2nd/3rd top-loader shift fork in Neutral and set the shifter on top the case with the shift fork engaged in the collar in the synchronizer sleeve. I rotated the input shaft and the trans is in Neutral allright. And the shifter is in Neutral, but the 6 holes in the shifter don't line up with the 6 holes in the main case. Right now it looks like the 2nd/3rd shift fork will have to be repositioned 3/8ths of an inch forward for the holes to line up. I'm thinking of various ways to achieve that. I would rather not try to cut and weld on that shift fork, because I don't have a spare and also because a weld can fail, and the effect on annealing the shift fork is unknown. So right now I'm thinking about annealing the hardened steel rod the shift fork slides on, redrilling it for a roll pin 3/8ths in front of the present roll pin hole, and repositioning the shift fork that way. I need to think about this some more, but in the meantime if anybody has any suggestions please post them. I'm open to all suggestions.
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-27-2012 at 04:07 PM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Here's the 1st/Rev shift fork that I ground down. If I had it to do over, I'd grind less on this one and more on the shift fork that comes in from the side of the case. Still, I think it will be OK--the gear collar makes contact around the I.D. of the curve somewhat and Bob won't be doing any hot-rodding.
    Attachment 13964
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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    Umm, when u click the attachment, u get:
    "Invalid Attachment specified"
    ? yr M5 under restoration
    a bunch of non-Stude stuff

  34. #34
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    Thanks tbird, I'll try again:

    P2270031.jpg
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

  35. #35
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    Here's something interesting. The gear travel on the T86 is 1&5/8ths for the 1st/Rev gear and 1" for 2nd-3rd. Thankfully the distance between the detent grooves on the T-90 shaft are the same as can be seen in this picture:

    T90-T86.jpg

    To the left are two 2nd/3rd shift forks--on top is the T90 fork and on the bottom is the T86 fork. Right now drilling the T-90 shaft for another roll-pin, and moving the shift fork over doesn't look feasible--not enough room. So I'm considering some version of cutting the T-90 fork off and either rewelding it to the base of that fork, or cutting it off and welding the T-86 fork onto the T-90 base. I can't just cut the T-90 fork off and weld it onto the side of the base--it won't be positioned 3/8ths over as it needs to be. So I'll either have to provide something to build it up, or find some way to bend it or...?

    Any suggestions? I'm temporarily stuck. I've only got one T90 shift fork, and I don't want to ruin it, and I'm not sure which way would be best--bending it, cutting it off and re-welding it or cutting it off and welding a T86 shift fork onto the T90 stub. Welding the T86 fork onto the T90 stub would move it over exactly 3/8ths, but that would also de-temper the piece.

    And the more I look at it, re-drilling the shaft COULD work... maybe.
    I just want to do this ONCE... if you know what I mean!
    Last edited by rrausch; 02-28-2012 at 04:34 PM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

  36. #36
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    hmmmm, why didn't Gary Ash have this problem i wonder...i'm reading every word, my turn is coming... LOL
    ? yr M5 under restoration
    a bunch of non-Stude stuff

  37. #37
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    Tbird, as I understand it Gary Ash found a different shifter that fit a little better.

    I dropped off the T-90 shift fork and the T-86 shift fork at my welder's place this afternoon. Tomorrow I'll go back over and help position it for the weld. That's the way I decided to go.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

  38. #38
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    OK, got 'er done. Yesterday my welder buddy tacked the T86 fork that he had cut off onto the T90 fork base that had the horseshoe cut off it. I brought the tacked fork back home and did a test fit, and the fit was good. So back to the welding shop this morning to get it welded with Ni-Rod. Here's a picture of the completed shift fork:

    P2290030.jpg

    Here's a closer picture showing the 3/8ths offset a little better:

    P2290031.jpg

    From the other side:

    P2290033.jpg

    I did a few test shifts, and it seems to shift fine. But the most important thing was that when both shifter forks were in the Neutral detents, the transmission was solidly in Neutral too. Once your Neutral position is established, if the 6 holes in the shifter are lined up with the 6 holes in the case, the trans WILL shift into all the gears correctly. Here she is, ready to install!

    P2290034.jpg
    Last edited by rrausch; 03-01-2012 at 12:46 AM. Reason: clarification
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

  39. #39
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    wow! so we are not worried about the temper of the forks?
    i wish Gary would chime in here to tell us what top loader he used
    ? yr M5 under restoration
    a bunch of non-Stude stuff

  40. #40
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    Well, I stopped worrying about the temper of the forks. They're cast steel, and look to me like they've been forged, but how much pressure are they under? How much wear are they subject to? I don't believe they're under heavy pressure--I can shift the synchro sleeve with just my fingers--it's very easy to shift it when the trans just sits there. (Is it very different at speed? Possibly, but the clutch will be pushed in.) Most of the wear, I'd think, would be in 3rd gear when you're going along 60 mph, but if there's plenty of lube in the trans, and if the fork isn't pressing against the sides of the groove in the synchro sleeve then there's about 20-30 thou or so of clearance on each side of that fork as it rides in the synchro sleeve groove. That's certainly enough to lube it, I think. I dunno... but my gut feeling is it will work just fine.
    1953 Chev. 210 Convertible, 261 6cyl w/Offy dual intake (But I always did love Studebakers!)
    1995 Dodge/Cummins Pickup, 250 HP, 620 Ft. Lbs. of Torque, ATS trans.
    Robert Rausch

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