After reading Bob Palma's post and having seen several heated discussions over motor oil, I felt the urge to take computer in hand and wonder. When was the last time anyone has seen an oil related engine failure? I am sure there are the instances when someone decides that you never have to change the stuff, but it has been a while. since I have seen a failure based on type or brand. What about you guys?
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I suspect that many "oil related" engine failures as it relates to re-formulated oils used in older engines go undetected due to the fact that the owners are uninformed and ignorant of the changes.
Actually, if they were knowledgable of the facts, they wouldn't be in the position of having an oil related failure. However, when a cam wipes out from incorrect oil, the uninformed owner probably blames it on mechanical components unless someone clues him in.
John Clary
Greer, SC
SDC member since 1975 -
The only "Oil related" engine failures that I know of are more honestly caused by ignorance or neglect on the part of the owner.
When I was much younger I used to be ambition and poverty driven to buy late model repairable vehicles and repair them for transportation and eventual sale.
I purchased plenty of late model vehicles that had experienced component failure after many thousands of miles without any change of fluids besides the replenishment of petrol.
One car that I remember well was an ugly early Chevette driven by my rural postal worker.
The oil was never changed and the friction and heat warped parts and cracked the block, but it still ran that way.
I have no idea why and did not believe that could even be possible until I experienced it.
I eventually found a rear ended Chevette and purchased it on the cheap for the drive train.
It was one of the easiest vehicles I had ever done and it still ran long after I passed it on to another friend's mother who needed a cheap car for in town use and did not like the gas cost of her Mercury Marquis.
I have seen (AMC) Renault Alliances and many other cheap imports the same way.
The Renault had an interesting motor design that caused them to be easily resurrected unless you ruined the block or dared mess with the wiring.
Almost all of the cars and trucks I took motors and other failed major mechanical items out of were economy type vehicles.
All of the vehicles that I purchased that did not come from a salvage auction and need collision repair were previously owned by the same kind of people.
They were all people who relied on someone else to do all of their maintenance and who felt that maintenance was not their job.
Some of them had no idea that the fluids in a vehicle needed to be changed and had more than one catastrophic failure under their belt to prove it.Comment
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I don't use anything special in my daily driver 59, 259, Lark..
No engine related failures here...
Did have a thermostat die on me last summer...I doubt if my standard oil choise had anything to do with that..
About three years ago, I had a core (freeze) plug blow out of the block, also doubt that was oil related. BUT... I do believe my choise of Lucas additive DID "save" the engine, because of the distance driven "without" a drop of water..!
MikeComment
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It's my theory that engines fail early in their lives due to lack of maintenance and severe driving and not the brand of oil used. I've seen cam and lifter failures in high performance engines with high valve spring pressures, but I believe that the failures were caused by the lack of use of a good assembly lube and improper break in proceedures and not the oil. I recommend the use of oils with adequate levels of ZDDP, but I don't think it is as critical in most Studebaker engines as they have low valve spring pressures and are low revving with the exception of the R engines. Changing the oil regularly and using an oil from a recognized supplier is necessary to insure low wear rates and keep the internal parts of the engine clean. Reciprocating aircraft engines either from new or after rebuild are run on a non additive oil for at least 50 hours to insure a proper ring seat and the cam and lifters in them don't fail. BudComment
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About a hundred years ago, I lived in FarmingtonMO, a little burg about 60 miles south of STL. I bought a Corvair from a used car lot in QuincyILFarmington, since we had gone to Quincy
When I finally decided to play with the dead engine, I plopped it up on a couple of saw horses and attempted to drain the oil. Tho the dipstick still said full, nothing flowed. I pulled the oil pan. Setting on it, in a blob, was a black hunk of jelly-like goo that USED to be oil. I had never seen anything like it. It would wiggle when you poked it but obviously had little lubricity and obviously, too, had a tough time flowing thru the oil pump. Just ask the bent rod.
I gingerly scraped it off and put it in a jar to show at the next club meeting. No one in my section of Corvair-dom at the time had ever even HEARD of such a phenomenon, let alone poked it. It was a curiosity that required a good poke by everyone. Lotsa blobby fingers at THAT meeting!
Any ideas?
JohnComment
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Maybe you guys saw my earlier post where I mentioned I was going to change the oil in my '51 Champion before starting it for the first time. I removed the drain plug and nothing came out ( just like Johnny's corvair). So, I poked my finger through the hole, drained the oil and removed the pan. Yesterday I filled a coffee can with the sludge that I scraped off the bottom of the pan!Comment
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back when synthetic oils were first on the market they wern't compatable with petrolem oils and would turn to jelley if mixedmervyn mundorf
63 avanti r2 4speed
83 avanti 20th ann
64 gt hawk r1 4speed
and othersComment
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John Q. Unconscious will do terrible things to internal combustion engines. For example, the church next door has an annual rummage sale and members donate articles to help raise money for youth group activities. Poking through the detritus, I noticed some good Christian had donated a Honda lawn mower. I looked it over, gave the recoil starter a pull and determined the motor was locked solid. Instead of paying to take his junk mower to the dump, the nice guy had dumped it on the church.
I checked the dipstick and of course absolutely no oil. Turning the mower on its side, I grabbed the blade and was able to free the stuck engine. One of the guys taking money had watched my investigations and knew it wasn't in running condition, so I gave him $5 for parts and pushed it home. I put a quart of diesel fuel in the crankcase, some gas in the tank and it fired right up. I let it idle for a few minutes and drained the now black diesel fuel. While I was under there, I removed the blade and sharpened it. I refilled the crancase with oil, cleaned the spark plug, adjusted the cables and returned it to the church. They sold the now operable Honda mower for $50. I noticed the church youth leader asking around if any of the others knew who had donated the mower. He said, "Most of our members are not like him and unfortunately, not all are like you."
Bottom line - engines are designed to survive hard use, but none are designed which will survive no oil.
As a FWIW, newer BMWs have no dipstick and no recommended oil change interval. The computer monitors oil temp, pressure, number of cold starts, mileage and decides for you when it is time to bring it in for an oil change. It is not even considered you might do it yourself, as only a dealer can reset the computer.
jack vinesPackardV8Comment
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I remember my dad had (actually still has) a '73 Chevy pickup truck that came from the factory with a 307; it ate a camshaft lobe sometime in the late 70's. Perhaps that was life's way of predisposing me towards Studebaker V-8s?Originally posted by Chucks Stude View Post
nate--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagelComment
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I didn't know any trucks came with the 307. I always heard it called a "Nova motor." I had one, and it's a long story.
My dad was sitting, uncharacteristically, at the bar of the local tavern after a job, and an old friend from the neighborhood, getting a little blowhardy in his maturity, was complaining about his 3/4-ton with a 350. "I'd sell the dumwitch [rhymes with] for 50 bucks." The old man's fitty was on the bar before he could close quotes. That motor was pretty clapped out--the PO was a former Stude racer after all--but it did run.
Fast forward a few weeks, and the head mechanic at the oil refinery had a son who was a Chev service manager. They had a repeat complaint of a Nova leaking oil Bad, and GM said to put a new engine in. Jumbo, the head mechanic, said something was queer about that deal, so he and Dad went out and bought the offending engine for $50. If you're counting, that's a hundred in a '67 C20 so far. A quick stop at my uncle's junkyard, $4 for a used oil pan, and what do you know, GM was wrong about a sand-casting flaw; it was an overdrawn stamped pan that would open a seam when hot. So I guess you can call that an "oil-related" failure. The failure caused the oil to run out.
We got darn good service out of that truck. Plenty of power, and decent mileage--for a C20. After it was rusty enough, I got a pretty '68 half-ton with an anemic 283 from Harry Gant's right-front-wheel man, got a kid from down the street to swap engines, and gave him the '67 and 283 as pay. He breathed on the 283 some, and sold it for $200. We both thought we'd done okay on that deal.Comment
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Almost every work day I am in a dealership service department. Almost never see an oil related failure, untill last month, A late model V6 was all apart on the floor, I have never seen so much SLUDGE
in a motor in my life. What a mess. It was lunch time so no one to ask about it.
Husband of Lark VIII girl
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Johnny Wiffer, I hate to pick nits, butWait…maybe that big red blobby substance that took over the town in that Steve McQueen epic, “The Thing”?
I think you are talking about the Steve McQueen movie. The one namedThe Blobstarred James Arness as the monster (his first movie) and took place at the South Pole. Also, there is no way you can refer to the blob in the Steve McQueen version asThe Thing, as the original movie was black and white. I thinkredwas Steve McQueen's first movie, also.The BlobComment
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Yep, 'twas "The Blob". Memories play tricks after a hundred years or so. But I do distinctly remember it being red. And if you can read it, at the very bottom of this poster, it says "Color by De Luxe"
JohnComment
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