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Thread: Ford 9 inch in a Studebaker 6 cylinder model?

  1. #1
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    Ford 9 inch in a Studebaker 6 cylinder model?

    I did a search, not much HOW-TO style info, I even checked Bob Johnstones website
    and nothing. I know Alan mentioned it on Racing Studebakers, but I thought I would
    start a thread here for a definitive discussion.

    I already know the Dana 44 is a great axle, and dont have any intention of swapping
    a Ford 9 inch into my Avanti. The Lark VI that is the purpose of this thread has the
    Dana 27 and tiny brakes.

    Its a double benefit to install a later flanged Ford 9 inch with V8 brakes in a 6 cylinder
    car, where as much less benefits to replace a Dana 44 in a V8 car - lets get past that.

    So .. lets hear what you did, pictures are ALWAYS welcome.

    Tom
    Last edited by sbca96; 11-13-2010 at 03:41 PM.
    '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
    Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
    http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
    I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

  2. #2
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    There is nothing different about swapping Ford 9" rear axles into a 6-cyl versus into the V8. There are literally dozens of axle swap threads on here. You've already made up your mind this the way your friend should go. His car, his money, his decision.

    jack vines
    PackardV8

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    President Member (S)'s Avatar
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    how much power?

    I found out a Dana 44 is good for +/- 300 foot pounds of torque and have literally put mine to its limit.

    Sounds like you guys are building a strip car? Here my experience:

    A dana is a bolt in. Use a shim, angle the diff to about 5 degrees down. Add some leaves and get some soft shocks. Add a pinion snubber from a long wheel base Lark, Hawk or other Stude. The ford needs the spring plates from a dana relocated and is good for more torque and should also be angled down. How much power do you plan on putting to it? You may want to add springs from a wagon, or something HD while you are under there because having power in a Lark is useless unless you can get it 'to' the ground. The standard spring won't do.

    I ran all stock V8 brakes and suspension on my Lark, it has just under 400 ponies and all kinds of torque. It stops fine, I do wear front shoes fast. Stops from over 120 require using the gears. Stops from 95 or less are 'good' Other stops are fine below there.

    Early runs were about 16 seconds no matter how I drove it. Adding soft shocks and a set of good leaves got it to 14.90. @ 97-100 MPH It should run in the 12's with all this power but it takes time and tuning of suspension, probably a softer tire too. I used a 3.07 TT and may have to step it down, but then it is harder to control getting sideways/wheel spin...

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    JMHO, but if I didn't have either one I'd put in the Ford 9" if the correct width was available stock. Parts are everywhere, although the 44 is not bad, but if you are into ratio changes the 9" is so much easier.

    Also here in small town Michigan, it's easier to find a rebuilder (even though we are 4WD loaded here and use a lot of 44's) for the 9".

    Bob
    , ,

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    The 9" Ford swap into ANY car is a 25+ year old swap...!
    Been done a thousand times (or more).
    Do something a little different...while this has been done also...it's MUCH more rare...in this case, a Winters, (Halibrand copy) Quick Change axle...in my still Champ. powered Conestoga.

    But you knew that...!

    Mike

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    Golden Hawk Member StudeRich's Avatar
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    If you are asking who can relate their experience doing that to a stock 6 Cyl. car, I am thinking no one has, since there would be no reason to do that! But on the other hand if you are talking about modified street rods, anything is possible, so maybe someone has.
    StudeRich
    Second Generation Stude Driver,
    Proud '54 Starliner Owner




  7. #7
    Speedster Member Don Jeffers's Avatar
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    Oversized brakes on the rear of a car is dangerous.

    If the rear wheels lock up first, the car will turn around.

    This is easlly done on slick road surfaces such as rain dampened, snow, etc, when the rear brakes are overly large compared to the front brakes.

    Put the large brakes on the front first.

    When the front brakes lock up first, you plow ahead. When the rear brakes lock up first, you spin out.

    DJ

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    With the responses I will assume I didnt explain myself well here, perhaps my post was
    confusinating ... He has a Lark VI with a Dana 27 and tiny brakes, he doesnt have a Dana
    44 to install, he needs V8 brakes : the car currently has a GM 350 and 700R4. To find a
    Dana 44 with flanged axles, limited slip and V8 brakes - ready to install (hell I would buy
    it) would be lucky, it isnt going to pop up on craigslist. A Ford 9 inch, complete, and in a
    ready to install condition will be easier to find, and I am assuming therefore cheaper. So
    that is the reason for the needed rear axle upgrade : limited slip, stronger, budget.

    Quote Originally Posted by PackardV8 View Post
    There is nothing different about swapping Ford 9" rear axles into a 6-cyl versus into the V8. There are literally dozens of axle swap threads on here. You've already made up your mind this the way your friend should go. His car, his money, his decision. jack vines
    Thanks Jack, feel free to post a few of those 2 dozen links, I have asked people to use
    straight forward titles and helpfiul key words in the past to assist the search feature,
    but I tried, coming up surprisingly scant. It was his suggestion to go Ford 9 inch, my
    buddy had a Dana 44, but already gave it away (an open diff, 3.07, needing a rebuild).

    Quote Originally Posted by (S) View Post
    Sounds like you guys are building a strip car? A dana is a bolt in.
    Not a strip car, just an around the town cruiser, years ago we replaced the Dana 27 in
    my brothers '64 Lark with a Dana 44, it required a driveshaft change. Problem is, we
    dont have a Dana 44 to install, perhaps if we came across one ..... he likes the idea of
    of Ford 9 inch. Which is why I am exploring the difficulty.

    Quote Originally Posted by sweetolbob View Post
    JMHO, but if I didn't have either one I'd put in the Ford 9" if the correct width was available stock.
    Thanks Bob, that was our thinking as well. I remember Alan posting info, couldnt find
    it in my search.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Van Veghten View Post
    The 9" Ford swap into ANY car is a 25+ year old swap...! Been done a thousand times (or more).
    Do something a little different...while this has been done also...it's MUCH more rare...in this case, a Winters, (Halibrand copy) Quick Change axle...in my still Champ. powered Conestoga.
    Mike
    Thanks Mike, while I am sure thats a really cheap alternative to a Ford 9 inch, I think
    we are better off sticking to commonly available junk yard parts. So if we go this route
    you can say its been done 1001 times (or more)!

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Jeffers View Post
    Oversized brakes on the rear of a car is dangerous.
    Thanks for the concern Don, but he will be matching the V8 rear brakes with the left
    over 1998 Mustang GT 11 inch front single piston disc brakes from my Avantis original
    setup. These are the ones pictured in my thread back in 2006? 2007? They have now
    been replaced with 13 inch rotors and dual piston PBR calipers.

    Tom

  9. #9
    President Member clonelark's Avatar
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    Dont overlook an 8 inch Ford. On a mild street car they are fine, and are much lighter than a 9 inch. (Less suspention weight) I ran one in my 34 Chevrolet street rod for years. And even taking it to the drag strip on several occasions. I ran 4:11 and 4:62 gears at the strip and would do a 15 to 30 minute swap and go back to 3:07s for a rod run several miles away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by clonelark View Post
    Dont overlook an 8 inch Ford. On a mild street car they are fine, and are much lighter than a 9 inch. (Less suspention weight) I ran one in my 34 Chevrolet street rod for years. And even taking it to the drag strip on several occasions. I ran 4:11 and 4:62 gears at the strip and would do a 15 to 30 minute swap and go back to 3:07s for a rod run several miles away.
    Yep, exactly what i was going to say, cheaper and lighter for mild car for sure. If you want a posi tho they are REAL hard to find used.

  11. #11
    Golden Hawk Member DEEPNHOCK's Avatar
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    The 8" has become the 'new' 9" of old.
    Nothing wrong with the 9" (I have two done), but the parts have gotten quite expensive, and the core supply is dwindling.
    The 8" seems to fit the Stude with better, since the average width of cars has shrunk in the last decade.

    Yep, exactly what i was going to say, cheaper and lighter for mild car for sure. If you want a posi tho they are REAL hard to find used.

    Yep, exactly what i was going to say, cheaper and lighter for mild car for sure. If you want a posi tho they are REAL hard to find used.

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    If you want cheap and easy the 53-56 Ford station wagon rear end is a bolt in for the Stude and is a Dana 44 with flanged axles and the spring pads are less than 1/2" difference apart. On the Stude you have to move the springs out a little. If I remember right the Stude is 41" center to center and the Ford is 41 1/2". Guys that are building street rod Ford wagons are giving away the old Danas and putting in 9"ers.

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    Anyone know how wide a Scout II rear is?
    Many have survived long after the bodies disappeared. Dana 44, Frequently posi, 11 inch rear brakes. You would need to drill the flanges for the new bolt pattern though.
    '64 R2 back on da road again

  14. #14
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    A Ford 8" from a Maverick is just 56.5 inches wide and they are still pretty plentiful and cheap. I have one in my 53. It was in the car when I got it, so I can't tell you much about the swap. Mine is on Studebaker springs. One thing about the 8 inchers, the aftermarket parts are actually a little harder to find and more expensive than similar 9" parts because the 9" is so much more popular. I still had no problem finding a track loc and gears that I wanted. It stands up to my LS1 just fine, so far. I am told they are good to about 400 hp.
    Pat Dilling
    Olivehurst, CA
    Custom '53 Starlight aka STU COOL


    LS1 Engine Swap Journal: http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/jour...ournalid=33611

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    President Member (S)'s Avatar
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    whats cheap?

    I have a 8" Ford here, already has Stude Perches welded on and has been powdercoated. I have the axles and 2 sets of gears for it but I am not sure what ratio they are. The axle is apart. Is 300 bucks cheap? I could let it go for that. Email me through the forum if interested.

  16. #16
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    Thanks everyone for your input, it isnt the direction I originally intended, but the info is very
    helpful in the decision making process. I will send him the link to read through. Thanks for
    the info again Alan, this should help someone out, heck I might even do a search for one of
    those wagon axles myself! The 8 inch sounds doable, I dont think he will be running a tire
    that with make that little Lark hook up well enough to break one. Where are you located (S)?

    Tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat Dilling View Post
    A Ford 8" from a Maverick is just 56.5 inches wide and they are still pretty plentiful and cheap. I have one in my 53. It was in the car when I got it, so I can't tell you much about the swap. Mine is on Studebaker springs. One thing about the 8 inchers, the aftermarket parts are actually a little harder to find and more expensive than similar 9" parts because the 9" is so much more popular. I still had no problem finding a track loc and gears that I wanted. It stands up to my LS1 just fine, so far. I am told they are good to about 400 hp.
    Same thing i have in my car, the spring perches need to be moved, and thats about it.

  18. #18
    President Member (S)'s Avatar
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    I'm in WA state.

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    President Member allstateguy's Avatar
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    I've put a 65 Mustang 8" into my 6-cyl 60 Lark 2dr sedan. Why? to bring the wheels in a half inch on each side, give me flanged axles for easy brake jobs, make a posi and a ratio change a half hour job, and to get ready for the 299 that I'm building.

    JohnP, driving & reviving
    60 Lark & 58 Scotsman 4dr

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