Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: How do you identify babbitt type rods?

  1. #1
    Silver Hawk Member 52-fan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Searcy, Arkansas, USA.
    Posts
    7,420

    How do you identify babbitt type rods?

    Are the early Champion rods babbitt type? Joe has a set of 197584 rods in the box and I was looking at them and wondered how you can tell.
    In any case, they are for sale if you need some. Pm me with an offer if you are interested. We can deliver to South Bend in May.


    "In the heart of Arkansas."
    Searcy, Arkansas
    1952 Commander 2 door. Really fine 259.
    1952 2R pickup

  2. #2
    President Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    mass
    Posts
    3,804
    I believe Champions used the Babbit type rods at least up til 1941 and maybe later, include the Commanders.

  3. #3
    Speedster Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    175
    Babbited rods have the bearing cast in place.

  4. #4
    Golden Hawk Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Wappingers Falls, New York, USA.
    Posts
    21,687
    The wise aXX answer to the title question is; look at them.
    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

  5. #5
    President Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Seattle WA, USA.
    Posts
    1,067
    Could be wrong, but believe that the Champ engine was an all new concept power plant. I think that all had insert bearings. It was the Commander engine that use insert mains, and poured babbitt bearings, following a redesign of that engine in 1936-42.

  6. #6
    Speedster Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ, USA.
    Posts
    202
    197584 is not in even in the 1950 price book?

  7. #7
    Silver Hawk Member 52-fan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Searcy, Arkansas, USA.
    Posts
    7,420
    Quote Originally Posted by studegary View Post
    The wise aXX answer to the title question is; look at them.
    I looked, but was not sure. Do the insert type always have tabs to keep the bearing from turning? These do not.


    "In the heart of Arkansas."
    Searcy, Arkansas
    1952 Commander 2 door. Really fine 259.
    1952 2R pickup

  8. #8
    Silver Hawk Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Spokane, WA, USA.
    Posts
    8,393
    Quote Originally Posted by Hallabutt View Post
    Could be wrong, but believe that the Champ engine was an all new concept power plant. I think that all had insert bearings. It was the Commander engine that use insert mains, and poured babbitt bearings, following a redesign of that engine in 1936-42.
    Not maybe, definitely wrong. Early Champion engines had babbit rods. It is possible to convert babbit rods to accept insert bearings.

    jack vines
    PackardV8

  9. #9
    Silver Hawk Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Trochu, Alberta , Canada.
    Posts
    5,498
    Did the change from Babbitt to insert rod bearings coincide with the advent of the 170 engine in 1941, or was it for the Weasel engines? I seem to remember tearing down a Weasel engine that had insert bearings in it.
    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

  10. #10
    President Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Seattle WA, USA.
    Posts
    1,067
    I humbly bow to the expert engine builder. I was only reporting what I had read long ago, and it made sense. Why Studebaker would have continued with babbitt rods, in a new concept engine, when the President eight had been completely redesigned, for 1936, for inserts, is a mystery to me.

  11. #11
    Silver Hawk Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Spokane, WA, USA.
    Posts
    8,393
    Quote Originally Posted by Hallabutt View Post
    I humbly bow to the expert engine builder. I was only reporting what I had read long ago, and it made sense. Why Studebaker would have continued with babbitt rods, in a new concept engine, when the President eight had been completely redesigned, for 1936, for inserts, is a mystery to me.
    We'll never know the decision process Studebaker Engineering went through, but it could simply have been at that juncture, babbit was still less expensive than insert bearings.

    The more one examines the Champion as a design exercise, it was a brilliant piece of work. It's tiny, light, inexpensive to manufacture, durable (with a couple of exceptions) and had sufficient power for a 2200# car.

    i and most of our generation came to sneer at the Champion, because by the time we were buying old Studes, the Champion was being asked to motivate a 3500# car or truck and it just should never have been asked to shoulder that load.

    jack vines
    PackardV8

  12. #12
    President Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Montpelier, VT, USA.
    Posts
    1,182
    You might want to check that part number as the 1934-1946 Chassis Parts Catalog lists 197504 as a Rod Set for Model G & 2G and references note 11, which says "Babbited Type Rods - Used in engines having cylinder head with casting no. 194777."
    Dan Peterson
    Montpelier, VT
    1960 Lark V-8 Convertible
    1960 Lark V-8 Convertible (parts car)

  13. #13
    Champion Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by dpson View Post
    You might want to check that part number as the 1934-1946 Chassis Parts Catalog lists 197504 as a Rod Set for Model G & 2G and references note 11, which says "Babbited Type Rods - Used in engines having cylinder head with casting no. 194777."
    Measure the ID of the rod big end bore. Compare with a rod journal on the crankshaft OD. If they're the same, it's babbited. If 1/8" off, it's insert. Easy.

  14. #14
    Silver Hawk Member 52-fan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Searcy, Arkansas, USA.
    Posts
    7,420
    Quote Originally Posted by dpson View Post
    You might want to check that part number as the 1934-1946 Chassis Parts Catalog lists 197504 as a Rod Set for Model G & 2G and references note 11, which says "Babbited Type Rods - Used in engines having cylinder head with casting no. 194777."
    Thanks, I'll tell him.


    "In the heart of Arkansas."
    Searcy, Arkansas
    1952 Commander 2 door. Really fine 259.
    1952 2R pickup

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •