Fuel System: 57 Golden Hawk Fuel Pump - Where does it get the boost signal?

[Lynn]

So, I bought a complete running 57 Packard Clipper with the supercharged 289. Planning to transfer as much as possible to my 53 Hardtop Commander, engine, trans, rear, possibly the frame and suspension, and the brakes. Because the tank is so rusted, it only runs on a gas can with with a makeshift electric fuel pump bypassing the mechanical pump.

I would like to get it running on the mechanical pump. I have read that the supercharged engines use a special pump that increases pressure with the boost.

Am posting a pic of the current mechanical pump. Also, I found this on ebay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-1959-P...53.m1438.l2649

Does the pump I picutured look like an original? Seems to match the one in the ebay auction.
I do not see a port for a vac hose on my pump or on the ebay pump.
If this pump really does increase fuel pressure under boost, where does it get the signal?

Then and Now has a rebuild kit, which I can purchase and install on my original pump. I know I have to remove it and get numbers for them before ordering.
In the alternative, I have read that the R2 pump is a good upgrade, and will combat vapor lock. I understand the frame on my 57 Packard (which may end up under my 53) would have to be notched. I also read that it has a return line. Does that mean I will need to modify my 53 tank (it is in better shape than the 57) to accept a return line if I go that way? Is the R2 upgrade really worth doing? I doubt I will ever drive the finished car across the desert. However, we do exceed 100 F. regularly in the summer here in central OK.

Sorry for so many questions.

[rockne10]

Why not maintain the Clipper as the runner it is and find the parts necessary to give you two great cars? Just asking for a friend.

Oops! Nevermind. I see in your other thread it's in bad shape. I guess the part that confused me most was one thread says the Clipper is a complete runner and the other indicates it has no engine or transmission.

[mbstude]

The supercharged fuel pumps have a boost reference line, with a fitting on the top side of the pump housing, just above the diaphragm. Neither of the pumps you show are correct for a supercharged car.

Yes you'll need a return line, easiest way is to weld a fitting to your fuel filler neck. The '57 sedan gas tank won't fit in your '53 coupe.

[Lynn]

Thanks Matthew. Any idea where I can source the correct pump for the 57?

In the alternative, is the R2 pump more readily available? I don't mind notching the frame. Not like I am building an all original car.

[Lynn]

Why not maintain the Clipper as the runner it is and find the parts necessary to give you two great cars? Just asking for a friend.

Oops! Nevermind. I see in your other thread it's in bad shape. I guess the part that confused me most was one thread says the Clipper is a complete runner and the other indicates it has no engine or transmission.

Yeah, Brad, the 57 has lots of good body parts that I don't mind passing on, but it is pretty rough (especially floors and interior), although better than I expected. Besides, just my opinion, and no offense to those that like them, but it is just not my cup o tea. I will make sure all the usable parts to go good homes. I did the two threads that way as I didn't want someone finding the online ad and buying it out from under me!!! Don't know that any members here would do that, but you never know who is lurking.

[Mike]

Golden Hawk Fuel Pump

The pump pictured is standard, not a Golden Hawk part. The boost reference line would go to a fitting on the top half, behind the diaphragm, and the usual vent would be plugged. This allows the supercharger boost, ( 3/16" line goes to the fitting on the output of the supercharger), to assist the spring that controls pressure. I think Golden Hawks also had a higher pressure pump with a better diaphragm stem seal.
Use of a genuine R-2 pump requires heating and denting the cross member for clearance. Replacement R-2 pumps are modified Chrysler units that are a little smaller. I don't know if they require denting the frame.
A 3/8" fuel line and 1/4" return are a good idea. The sediment bowl, vapor diverter, as used on later R-2's is also a good idea.
Mike

[Lynn]

So, can anyone tell me if this is the correct original R2 pump, or the modified Chrysler pump?
The picture is so tiny, I can't even tell if it has the port on top.

http://avantiparts.biz/fuel-pump-r-2/

Also found one (57-58 Golden Hawk unit) outright from Studebaker International for $80.

Any reason that one won't work?

[Studebakercenteroforegon]

Studebaker International supplies a 1542299 Fuel Pump, listed for ‘57 - ‘58 Golden Hawk, ‘57 Packard, and ‘58 Packard Hawk. It would be correctly tapped so the fitting and line could be run up to the supercharger.
Page 185 in the current catalog, price is $80.00.

[mbstude]

Also found one (57-58 Golden Hawk unit) outright from Studebaker International for $80.

Any reason that one won't work?

You should call and make sure, but I think S.I. has been out of those pumps for some time now.

Your best bet might be to find an original Carter pump and put a Then And Now rebuild kit in it. Someone, somewhere, has one sitting around gathering dust.

[Mike]

R-2 replacement pumps

All the R-2 replacement pumps I've seen are modified Chryslers. The operating lever has to be heated and reformed slightly, and the venting modified. The smaller diameter Chrysler pumps have 8 screws holding the top "bell" to the valve body. Stude R-2's had only 6. Also the Chrysler pumps have 3 valves, the Stude only 2; and the Stude has a smaller out put fitting.
If the Chrysler pump doesn't have the boost reference port, it's an easy modification. There is a thickened bump cast into the bell that can be tapped for the boost fitting, (note: VS superchargers used a smaller line than SN, 3/16 versus 1/4"). It's easy to plug the original vent. Tap for a set screw from the inside of the housing.
Mike

So, can anyone tell me if this is the correct original R2 pump, or the modified Chrysler pump?
The picture is so tiny, I can't even tell if it has the port on top.

http://avantiparts.biz/fuel-pump-r-2/

Also found one (57-58 Golden Hawk unit) outright from Studebaker International for $80.

Any reason that one won't work?

[5brown1]

Can this pump be modified to accept the boost line and rebuilt with the Then and Now rebuild kit allowing it to function as the original pump which provides more pressure than
the standard V8 pump?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Studebaker-V8-Carter-Glass-Fuel-Pump-used-original-equipment-a/112764966065?hash=item1a4150d4b1:g:Db8AAOSwIC1Z1r3Z&vxp=mtr

Pictures of the original style pump. Glass bowl not shown

[Lynn]

By "thickened bump" are you referring to this boss cast in the top housing?

If so, looks like the pump posted by 5brown1 has the same boss, excpept it has been drilled already.

[bezhawk]

It would work only if there is an upper seal present. Not all regular fuel pumps are separated from the engine oil on the top side. So adding a fitting wouldn't pressurize the diaphragm as needed. A NOS one would not work either, as it would deteriorate with the modern fuel formulations. Best bet is to get one of the modified modern Chrysler conversions available from many Stude vendors. The ones pictured with the glass bowl is not correct either, as the factory GH fuel pumps had metal sediment bowls, not glass. Pictured is a factory GH pump

[Mike]

On some Carter pumps the "bump is internal, others external. It just provides enough "meat" to tap for a fitting. It's there as much for marine vents as anything.
I've never seen a pump with the boss quite like the one pictured.
As Bezhawk says, the seal on the diaphragm stem is critical for boost referencing. The simple rod seal in most rebuild kits won't do the job.
I agree the best bet is probably a modified Chrysler pump; unless you have a rebuildable "R" pump and are willing to experiment with diaphragms from other manufacturers.
Mike

By "thickened bump" are you referring to this boss cast in the top housing?

If so, looks like the pump posted by 5brown1 has the same boss, excpept it has been drilled already.

[acolds]

My supercharged Clipper has a glass bowl and the fitting for boost line the parts book calls out also the 3/8 fuel line and fitting and flexible line from steel line to pump which Studebaker international sells. The same fuel bowl for supercharged and non supercharged engines are the same according to parts book