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Thread: When you look up "collector" in the dictionary...

  1. #1
    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    When you look up "collector" in the dictionary...

    ...I'm pretty sure it's this guy's picture... BP

    https://nam02.safelinks.protection.o...%3D&reserved=0
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

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    Hopefully they will get some of this information straightened out before the sale. There are numerous errors in make/model as well as year (a '58 Continental is called a '59 and a '50 Mercury is called a '49). This before I even looked at all of the pictures.
    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

  3. #3
    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    What Gary said. Don't take as gospel the identity or descriptions of any cars! BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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    President Member Commander Eddie's Avatar
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    Yikes! That is quite a collection. What wonderful stuff he had. I hope it all goes to new owners who will cherish and maintain them.
    Ed Sallia
    Dundee, OR

    Sol Lucet Omnibus

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    President Member BobWaitz's Avatar
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    Where's the LIKE button again?

    Wow.

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    Speedster Member bumpkinvilledano's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by studegary View Post
    Hopefully they will get some of this information straightened out before the sale. There are numerous errors in make/model as well as year (a '58 Continental is called a '59 and a '50 Mercury is called a '49). This before I even looked at all of the pictures.
    As well as the 66 Ford that looks suspiciously like a 63/64
    Money may not buy happiness, but it's more comfortable to cry in a Mercedes than on a bicycle.

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    Golden Hawk Member 8E45E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by studegary View Post
    Hopefully they will get some of this information straightened out before the sale. There are numerous errors in make/model as well as year (a '58 Continental is called a '59 and a '50 Mercury is called a '49). This before I even looked at all of the pictures.
    I mentioned the errors earlier: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...ghlight=squire

    Craig

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    Quote Originally Posted by BobPalma View Post
    ...I'm pretty sure it's this guy's picture... BP

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    Bob,

    Something tells me you're right!

    Rog
    '59 Lark VI Regal Hardtop
    Smithtown,NY
    Recording Secretary, Long Island Studebaker Club

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    Commander Member
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    Some awesome Canadian only stuff for sale there!

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    Wow, what a wonderful collection.

    But I do not understand one thing:
    Why do some people buy such beautiful vehicles and then put them somewhere and let them rot?
    This is not my understanding of a collector.

  11. #11
    President Member bob40's Avatar
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    I will take a stab at why they are called collections.
    Nobody who is a member of a group including Studebaker fans wants to use the H word.
    People will say "Save them all....don't crush them" and some folks do just that.
    How many times over the years have we read stories and seen pictures of someones 'collection' of Studebakers which is nothing more than a large amount of vehicles saved but nothing was ever done with them. Never restored or parted out so parts could be used on other cars.
    Kenny James here in Minnesota. Over 50 Studebakers including Golden Hawks and a Speedster sitting for 40+ years with windows open.
    He 'saved' all those cars. Most broke in two when the scrap yard came to haul them away.
    He was called a collector,not the H word.
    Chuck Naugle had a collection.He saved a whole lot of Studebakers,sold parts and restored some too.Most just sat until his auctions which dispersed the vehicles across the nation.
    He was a collector,not the H word.
    I can think of a gentleman in Wisconsin who has 'saved' a lot of Studes over the years and driven few.They sit outside and wait.
    He is known as a collector,not the H word.
    I think if we all thought about it we could come up with names of people who have either a large or small number of Studebakers in their possession that have not seen the road in many years. Some are on this Forum.They may have as little as 3-4 or 10+. Most are not driven and need restoration so they slowly buy parts needed to complete that 'someday' resto as time creeps up on their drive and financial ability to actually perform that restoration.Cars and parts accumulate and they talk about it even as they realize they will never get the car done. They did save them even though few ever see the vehicles and they deteriorated over the years.
    They are collectors,we don't want to use the H word.
    I bought 18 Studebakers from a collector here in Minnesota.'53-'55 coupes and hardtops,1/2T pickups,Larks and 4 door Presidents.All saved then parked outside in the elements.Not one was so rare it deserved a restoration.It was a very very rusty collection of used up vehicles.I parted them out and over 100 different people all around the world bought parts off those cars.Other cars are being driven and seen with those parts.
    The guy I bought the vehicles from called himself a collector,not the H word.
    That group of vehicles up in Canada was served better by that collector than most.His are in buildings which spared them the indignity of waiting to be rescued while rotting outside.
    This is just my humble take on the subject.
    I would like to add that the true collectors are those who buy,restore and drive/display their vehicles.
    There are several here who I would put in that category.The vehicles are driven yearly and maintained
    Last edited by bob40; 01-14-2018 at 11:10 AM.
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  12. #12
    Golden Hawk Member
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    "Bob40" - Well put.
    When I got up to ten vehicles, I realized that I was mostly paying storage in three counties and could not keep up with maintaining the cars. I sold down to four and in recent years, I limit myself to one or two "extra" cars at a time.
    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

  13. #13
    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    Post #11: Well-stated, Bob. Your business qualifies you to speak to this subject better than 99% of us here, myself included.

    Few people like to admit defeat; it's much easier to cling to the belief that "someday" will come when they'll be restored...and in the interim, it gives the owner something to talk about and with which they may tease fellow hobbyists and legitimate restorers as they subtly, but proudly, watch the cars deteriorate to nothing.

    Probably every one of us on the forum could produce photographs or an address where one or more cars have been sitting, rotting, for as long as the poster can remember.

    Southwest of Plainfield IN, near me, are two 1956 Plymouth Furys, rare cars and fairly complete, rotting down to nothing in the weeds that have been there so long I can't remember when they weren't there...and I'm talking decades. Among their brethren on that property is a rare 1968 Dodge Dart convertible with factory V8/4-speed and factory AM/FM radio. BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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    Bob P's post (#13) reminds me of the last novelty rally that I set up. As points to find/identify I included several cars that had been sitting near the road on private property for years/decades. These were mostly 1950s cars, including a 1953 Studebaker. I set the rally up a few weeks in advance. As was my practice, I ran the rally route on the morning of the rally as a final check. At least three of the long standing/sitting cars had been removed. I had to rework the rally. I wonder if I was seen as some sort of threat of impending action when I may have been seen setting up the rally. I will never know, but it was an unusual experience that I didn't forget. None of the cars reappeared in the same location or anywhere else that I know of.
    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

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    Golden Hawk Member 8E45E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobPalma View Post
    Southwest of Plainfield IN, near me, are two 1956 Plymouth Furys, rare cars and fairly complete, rotting down to nothing in the weeds that have been there so long I can't remember when they weren't there...and I'm talking decades. Among their brethren on that property is a rare 1968 Dodge Dart convertible with factory V8/4-speed and factory AM/FM radio. BP
    I remember that! http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...-1-GM-pic-too)

    Craig

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    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8E45E View Post
    Thanks for posting that, Craig. My Photobucket account is supposed to be frozen and not allowing third-party hosting, but I see those images appeared here "just fine." I wonder what's up with that? BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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    I picked up a couple of "spare" Studebakers a while back. Not because I needed any more projects, but they were on a lot full of cars that were being cleaned up. All cars were $100.00 each for two weeks, then what was left was smashed with a loader and hauled to the scrap yard. I got a 1960 four door Lark with V8 and three speed overdrive, and a US6. The Lark is a parts car, and MAYBE when I catch up on other things, I will work on the US6. Both are fairly complete, and I couldn't bear the thought of them being scrapped. My wife things I might be the "H" word, but I think I'm a collector. I also have four other Larks, an M15A, and a 60 Hawk, so no shortage of projects as I head into retirement.

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    I know quite a few collectors and quite a few hoarders who believe they are collectors. I've watched a number of cars rot into the ground up here in Canada due to harsh weather and stubborn owners who always seem to say "gonna restore it, NO it's NOT FOR SALE". I truly do believe they just enjoy frustrating all the people that ask. This goes back to the early 1970's for me. A 58 Corvette that had left front fender damage that sat in a yard close to the salty North Atlantic with a Not For Sale sign in it for at least a decade and a 62 GT Hawk that was in my neighbourhood that ended up being saved. This was circa 1971-72. The Hawk was rusty, but was hauled away by 2 guys with a Studebaker Drivers Club decal on their car.
    The Corvette disappeared. The last time I went to see it had a totally rotted frame. Fast forward to 2013. Still see the same story over and over again.
    I bought an Avanti II that was poorly stored from a hoarder who lost his storage garage. I had it parked at a friend's shop to get it running and a local dude stops in and asks if it's so and so's old car from Ingersoll Ont, to which I reply no, this was in Hamilton Ont. He said there was one parked in a back yard in Ingersoll since mid 70's because of water pump failure. He said they tried to get 289 (likely Ford)pump to bolt up but it didnt fit so they gave up, car was parked and left to rot. I got directions, go hunt it down and the house had just been demolished, Avanti was gone after 35 or so years. So does anyone from S-W Ontario know where that car went?

  19. #19
    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avanti-hawk View Post
    The Corvette disappeared. The last time I went to see it had a totally rotted frame.
    It might have disappeared, Ed, but you can be sure that its Serial Number plate exists on some 1958 Corvette somewhere! BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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    President Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    All it takes is to have the serial number plate from a Corvette of that vintage and either build a new car from original and repop parts bought online or go to Corvettes at Carlisle and you can build the car from parts bought there. Like Bob said...that serial number plate it likely attached to a '58 Vette somewhere.
    Poet...Mystic...Soldier of Fortune. As always...self-absorbed, adversarial, cocky and in general a malcontent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BobPalma View Post
    It might have disappeared, Ed, but you can be sure that its Serial Number plate exists on some 1958 Corvette somewhere! BP
    Yes Bob, you are probably correct! Another Corvette story. This time about a 1954. It was a factory Blue with tan interior, original paint that had been in storage since 1973. It took many years and quite a pile of $100 dollar bills to convince the owner to cut it loose in the late 90's. My friend wanted it because he had bought a 1956 Corvette also in storage after a brief racing career in the 50's and 60's. Very nice car, but had no engine or transmission. The 1954 had a 1956 265 with 2x4 bbl carbs and the proper 3 speed manual that had been transplanted in many years before. So he used the powertrain to finish the restoration on the 56 with proper date codes. So when it came time to restore the 1954 a few years later they unscrewed the serial number plate and locked it in a cabinet. Another 2 years passed and I was ready to buy the 1954 as I had found a 54 engine, proper intake and the carbs(same as Corvair). We had a deal struck until I wanted the VIN tag. The cabinet it was in got sold in a yard sale, with the serial plate still in it!
    I passed on the car, which eventually got a restamped plate as they were able to still find the serial number on the frame. I've often wondered if there are now 2 Pennant Blue 54 Vettes with the same numbers!

  22. #22
    Golden Hawk Member BobPalma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avanti-hawk View Post
    Yes Bob, you are probably correct! Another Corvette story. This time about a 1954. It was a factory Blue with tan interior, original paint that had been in storage since 1973. It took many years and quite a pile of $100 dollar bills to convince the owner to cut it loose in the late 90's. My friend wanted it because he had bought a 1956 Corvette also in storage after a brief racing career in the 50's and 60's. Very nice car, but had no engine or transmission. The 1954 had a 1956 265 with 2x4 bbl carbs and the proper 3 speed manual that had been transplanted in many years before. So he used the powertrain to finish the restoration on the 56 with proper date codes. So when it came time to restore the 1954 a few years later they unscrewed the serial number plate and locked it in a cabinet. Another 2 years passed and I was ready to buy the 1954 as I had found a 54 engine, proper intake and the carbs(same as Corvair). We had a deal struck until I wanted the VIN tag. The cabinet it was in got sold in a yard sale, with the serial plate still in it!
    I passed on the car, which eventually got a restamped plate as they were able to still find the serial number on the frame. I've often wondered if there are now 2 Pennant Blue 54 Vettes with the same numbers!
    That's a good story, Ed.

    Now, as few 1954 Corvettes as there are out there, especially in Pennant Blue, who has the real car; they guy with the original Serial Number tag on a car with a restamped frame, or the guy with the original stamped frame with the repro Serial Number tag?

    Here's hoping they don't both show up at the same auction! BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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    [QUOTE=BobPalma;1092055] That's a good story, Ed.

    Now, as few 1954 Corvettes as there are out there, especially in Pennant Blue, who has the real car; they guy with the original Serial Number tag on a car with a restamped frame, or the guy with the original stamped frame with the repro Serial Number tag?

    Last time I heard of the original car with the repro tag plate it went to auction here in Canada. It was a looker. I wish that I had bought it way back when, but a Corvette with a restamp plate would keep me awake at night! Pennant Blue with tan top and interior is indeed a rare car. This one still had the tan rubber trunk mat and original spare tire. that was over 10 years ago, so who knows where it is??

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