I have an International truck with a 404 engine and have to replace the engine. How can we remove the engine with a torque converter attached to the flywheel without damaging the transmission? Or must the flywheel be detached from the torque converter and the torque converter left with the transmission? The reason I'm asking is that the engine is locked up and we cannot turn the flywheel to get at the torque converter bolts. This is a 15 ton truck and a driveway project. We would like to pull the engine with the torque converter and take it inside so that we can loosen the crank and get the engine to turn over. Our concern is that we may damage the transmission. Comments please.
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don -
May have to remove the core support to get the room but as long as you support the trans when removing the engine shouldn't be a dig deal, not sure how big a 15 ton truck is but sounds BIG, may be enough room with just the radiator out of the way.
Good luch
Johnny
PS. Sure will be a mess with trans fluid leaking but a pan could catch most of it. -
When I sourced my 700R4 from Pick Your Part it was from one of those Obama cars that had to have silica run in the engine so they wouldn't run - ever again. In my case (do at your own risk) I yanked the transmission as fast and as far back as I could to minimize the weight on the input shaft. An old car seat cushioned the transmission falling to the ground. Once the transmission and thus the attached bellhousing was removed from around the engine I was able to get thin, low angle box wrenches to all the torque convertor bolts and liberate it from the flex plate. If your IH truck has enough tunnel clearance you might just be able to balance the trans on a jack, getting it back far enough to expose the convertor bolts.
I don't envy you because I almost gave up twice to get the trans out. But the $70 (50% off sale) for a 700R4 and convertor that looked like it had recently been rebuilt challenged this CASO to persist.'64 Lark Type, powered by '85 Corvette L-98 (carburetor), 700R4, - CASO to the Max.Comment
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Generally, any automatic will separate from the engine by removing the bolts holding it to the bellhousing. The converter is bolted to the engine flexplate and will stay on the engine when the engine is removed. The converter to transmission connection is facilitated by the tanged pump drive at the center of the converter. On the installation, you will have to remove the converter from the flexplate and install it in the front pump, since it may take a few twists to correctly get it seated in the front pump seals. Once the converter is on the transmission, the engine can be installed and the converter bolted back up to the flexplate. I'm sure you can find a manual or some help online...64 GT Hawk (K7)
1970 Avanti (R3)Comment
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Well, I was taught by an auto specialist to always leave the torque converter on the auto gear box. Reason was not to endanger the torque converter seal. I've since always done that, and never had a leak develop after separating engine & auto. I don't know if that is still necessary on modern gear boxes, but won't take the chance. Did one last month (2003 *** car) and had no major dramas, except for the poor access of course.Comment
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Sir, you have gained instant respect and admiration in my eyes.Originally posted by GTHawk View PostI have an International truck with a 404 engine and have to replace the engine. How can we remove the engine with a torque converter attached to the flywheel without damaging the transmission? Or must the flywheel be detached from the torque converter and the torque converter left with the transmission? The reason I'm asking is that the engine is locked up and we cannot turn the flywheel to get at the torque converter bolts. This is a 15 ton truck and a driveway project.
We would like to pull the engine with the torque converter and take it inside so that we can loosen the crank and get the engine to turn over. Our concern is that we may damage the transmission. Comments please.
Here, in the hills of upstate S.C. this morning, the weather is blustery, windy, high thirty's to low forty degrees. Due to my daily driver truck being in a body shop from a hit & run accident, I am having to use a Studebaker to get to a morning appointment. Making the trek out to the barn, at dawn, to be sure the cold natured Stude would fire up, was a chilly wake-up call.
My only suggestion to your engine removal/hoisting, is to place a robust drip pan & absorption pad under the transmission/engine as you separate them, and to keep the engine as level as possible. Tilting the converter could result in a substantial fluid spill and driveway stain.
But most of all...a DRIVEWAY PROJECT
...this time of year...in WINTERTIME Minnesota...I can't think of a better testament to the hardiness and toughness to you folks living in the land of "REAL WINTER!"
John Clary
Greer, SC
SDC member since 1975Comment
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Originally posted by jclary View Post
Sir, you have gained instant respect and admiration in my eyes. Here, in the hills of upstate S.C. this morning, the weather is blustery, windy, high thirty's to low forty degrees. Due to my daily driver truck being in a body shop from a hit & run accident, I am having to use a Studebaker to get to a morning appointment. Making the trek out to the barn, at dawn, to be sure the cold natured Stude would fire up, was a chilly wake-up call.
My only suggestion to your engine removal/hoisting, is to place a robust drip pan & absorption pad under the transmission/engine as you separate them, and to keep the engine as level as possible. Tilting the converter could result in a substantial fluid spill and driveway stain.
But most of all...a DRIVEWAY PROJECT...this time of year...in WINTERTIME Minnesota...I can't think of a better testament to the hardiness and toughness to you folks living in the land of "REAL WINTER!"
X2 You have to be tough to live in that part of the WORLD.
JohnnyComment
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Today it's 10 am and still below zero. I think it does keep us healthy but sometimes I wonder why we live here because today we are plowing snow and thawing frozen water pipes. I've concluded that it is only because people are born here or have a good job here. I was born here. Obviously, I don't have a good job.Originally posted by toymobile View Post
Thank you all very much for all the comments. We will be sure to figure out a way keep the converter on the transmission as it seems to be the safest.donComment
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I second what John said about the drain pan. I'm not familiar with trucks that size, but it seems logical that there would be considerably more fluid than in a car. The rule of thumb when I was doing cars was the pan had to be capable of holding twice as much as the transmission. There will be spillage when the torque converter separates from the transmission, it is a question of how much and where it goes- including on you. Does the transmission pan have a drain plug? Draining the trans even part way would be the cleanest/neatest way to do it.
TerryComment
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Don how did it work out??
JohnnyComment
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Pulled a 390 Ford V8 out of a Fairlane out in a field in the dead of winter in 1968 or 1969 in upstate NY.
Unimaginably cold. Put the car up on four trunk rounds from a tree, called a buddy of mine who lived on a farm down the road and he came by with a wagonload of straw. We grabbed a bunch of 2 by 12 planks from my dad's lumber cache and then we built a straw bale room around that car, put a bunch of planks across the top and a layer of bales on top of that. Access was through a hole close to the ground, crawled inside, pulled in a toolbox and a few trouble lights, blocked that hole with a piece of plywood and went to work. What a bear that was - working in a straw cave. However, it would have been a whole lot worse outside in the wind and the snow. A little bit of snow drifted in here and there but wearing my Skidoo suit and boots most of me was pretty good except my fingers. When it came time to pull it, we knocked the room down, used a tractor with a bucket on the front to stand up a tripod made from wooden light posts lashed together - basically skinny telephone poles - hung a chain fall from it, and pulled the engine and transmission as a unit, basically dropping the tranny way down in back and pulling it at a pretty extreme angle - darned near vertical. It didn't clear the car, so it was jack it up, knock out the rounds and roll the car back so that we could lower the engine and transmission into the bucket and haul it down to the tractor shed. Rebuilt that darned engine in an unheated tractor shed over a period of about two weeks after school and then reversed the procedure to put it back. Damned near got frostbite on my fingers. They are still the thing that aches the most on cold days ever since.
All that said. With that Stude truck, wouldn't it be just as easy to remove the radiator and then removed the nose as a unit and then pull the engine? It could come out with the transmission attached and then he could move the engine and transmission to a warmer location. I'm just thinking about last year when I lay on the ground under the Tahoe I had trying to reach those damned bell housing bolts in order to drop the tranny. What a pain in the ass! Then I think about every time I've ever had to pull the nose off a car or truck and those took such little time to remove. Then too. Most of the times that I've ever visited a truck repair facility I didn't see anyone trying to pull an engine out over of an engine bay - the noses were off the trucks so that everything was exposed and easier to get to.
Just sayin'. I've never worked on a Studebaker truck so I might be talking through my hat here.Mike O'Handley, Cat Herder Third Class
Kenmore, Washington
hausdok@msn.com
'58 Packard Hawk
'05 Subaru Baja Turbo
'71 Toyota Crown Coupe
'69 Pontiac Firebird
(What is it with me and discontinued/orphan cars?)Comment
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On the new Ford trucks it is easier to pull the entire CAB to pull the engine rather than try to get at all the bolts, cab off in about 1 hour.
JohnnyComment
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This explains why I've been seeing Ford trucks with no cab sitting around the repair area at the local Ford dealer.Originally posted by toymobile View Post
Paul
Winston-Salem, NC
Visit The Studebaker Skytop Registry website at: www.studebakerskytop.com
Check out my YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/user/r1larkComment
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