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SN-60
07-26-2015, 02:46 PM
No one saw the 'Fantomworks' restoration show this week where a very nice '50 Commander convertible is brought back to life?

Dan converted the car from 6V to 12V.....I figured a move like that would 'Bring The House Down' on this forum!! ;)

LarkTruck
07-26-2015, 02:57 PM
No one saw the 'Fantom Autoworks' show this week where a very nice '50 Commander convertible is brought back to life?

Dan converted the car from 6V to 12V.....I figured a move like that would 'Bring The House Down' on this forum!! ;)

Dan is such a head strong know it all I don't think anyone here (me included) wants to admit they watch the show.
Though I will admit I missed this episode.:woot:
JS

SN-60
07-26-2015, 03:05 PM
Dan is such a head strong know it all I don't think anyone here (me included) wants to admit they watch the show.
Though I will admit I missed this episode.:woot:
JS

Well Lark, like Dan says on his shows intro,.....If he had to choose between you and your car.....he wouldn't choose you! :lol:

sweetolbob
07-26-2015, 04:32 PM
I watch it on a regular basis now that the angst and BS has been toned down. I continue to be amazed at what some folks will spend to bring back a low value car. IIRC the early Barracuda cost about $80K to restore and, I think, the 50 Stude 'vert was over $40K eventhough it started in pretty good nick.

I always like to watch Pros do what they do well. I just wonder whom pays for the tires after Dan does a brake test. The GTO must have a flat spot or two on it's meats.

Bob

sweetolbob
07-26-2015, 04:55 PM
It's on tonight (sunday) at 8:00 Eastern on Velocity. The Stude 'vert show that is.

63t-cab
07-26-2015, 05:06 PM
That thought crossed my mind too.I think He said a gas tank and a couple brake items were $1,000.00 - was it a n.o.s. tank ?

SN-60
07-26-2015, 06:02 PM
That thought crossed my mind too.I think He said a gas tank and a couple brake items were $1,000.00 - was it a n.o.s. tank ?

Apparently the Commander's original gas tank couldn't be saved, and the 'possibly' NOS replacement tank was over $500!

Deaf Mute
07-26-2015, 08:37 PM
At least there is another 1950 Commander convertible on the road... I also noticed (at the end of the show) that the woman has since passed away. We hope the husband can driver the car in her memory. Does anyone know the owner??

doug
07-26-2015, 11:17 PM
I watch the show because there are no artificial deadlines to rush to meet, and not hacked to quick flip on some unsuspecting fool.

I have wondered how he can present the large bills when he had the cars for many months and must have collected some cash in the mean time. That row of cars outside his shop must be orders he had to "eat" because someone couldn't or wouldn't pay the tab.

Bob Andrews
07-27-2015, 05:19 AM
Doug I find that most people that go through with a restoration job have no problem with the large bill. The key is to properly inform them from the beginning of the possibilities. I know that in this club people brag about being tightwads, but it's a whole different world in most other parts of the hobby.

I have found that most people that are able and willing to spend five or six digits on a car rarely give any problem as long as the product is what they wanted . I have experienced people who scrounged all their lives, and are at the point to live their dreams and have no complaints with a five or six figure bill. I have also dealt with many customers who are wealthy and just want what they want the way they want it; the size of the bill is of zero consequence to them.

Admittedly, it is hard to imagine when seen through the prism of the only club that is so proud of being cheapskates that they have an actual title for it LOL

r1lark
07-27-2015, 07:13 AM
Admittedly, it is hard to imagine when seen through the prism of the only club that is so proud of being cheapskates that they have an actual title for it LOL

:lol: :eek: :lol: That has to be the quote of the month Bob - love it!!

However, I will admit I'm out of touch on 'restoration shop' rates - $40K+ for the work done on the '50 convertible, and it didn't need paint, interior, bodywork. WOW :ohmy:

Gunslinger
07-27-2015, 07:27 AM
I have wondered how he can present the large bills when he had the cars for many months and must have collected some cash in the mean time. That row of cars outside his shop must be orders he had to "eat" because someone couldn't or wouldn't pay the tab.

Restoration shops in my experience operate by sending the vehicle owner a statement every two weeks for work performed and parts obtained...if the owner fails to send prompt payment the work stops until the account is up to date. That way, the shop is not out much while cars sit.

I do know of one vehicle (an Avanti), that sat in a shop for so long that the shop owner was going to start legal proceedings to obtain a mechanics lien on it. The owner eventually had to sell the car to settle up the account.

sweetolbob
07-27-2015, 11:50 AM
Restoration shops in my experience operate by sending the vehicle owner a statement every two weeks for work performed and parts obtained...if the owner fails to send prompt payment the work stops until the account is up to date. That way, the shop is not out much while cars sit.

I do know of one vehicle (an Avanti), that sat in a shop for so long that the shop owner was going to start legal proceedings to obtain a mechanics lien on it. The owner eventually had to sell the car to settle up the account.

I would think any good business is run like this. From the Fantomworks website on terms and conditions they state this on payments.


From Fantomworks
5. What is the payment schedule like?

We will send the customer reports of the progress made. At these junctures, we generally require some payment toward the total bill. We generally require about 25% as a down payment. Note: We CANNOT accept checks as final payment for new customers.

Here's there list of the all the comments on the FAQ page

http://fantomworks.com/support/faqs/

Bob Andrews
07-27-2015, 04:05 PM
LOL Thanks, Paul.

What Bruce and Bob mention is pretty much SOP in the business. I have mostly been building racecars the last few years, and it's the same way. For a small job, say under $2000, the customer just pays at the time of delivery. Beyond that it is usually a percentage down and pay as you go. Some just write a check for the full amount quoted and then another at the end for any overages. Usually the bigger spenders are usually fine with whatever terms you set for payment; they are far more interested in getting what they want the way they want it.

SN-60
07-27-2015, 05:53 PM
Gosh, who would think that 'High End' race car owners would consult with a shop known to associate themselves with ADMITTED CASO'S??? :eek:

wlfrench
07-27-2015, 06:34 PM
Who's in the driver's seat (Ha Ha) in the restoration biz when it comes to setting prices for a job when both the car owner and the shop know the job is going to run 10, 20 or 30 thousand $$$. Can a savvy car owner beat a shop down in price or do the good shops command what they want?

bob40
07-27-2015, 06:49 PM
A savvy shop knows the signs of a problem child owner who is going to cause issues or nit pick costs to the point of frustration and carefully guide said problem child to another shop.Most good shops book 1-2 years out and finding another customer is not a issue.

Bob Andrews
07-28-2015, 06:05 AM
Who's in the driver's seat (Ha Ha) in the restoration biz when it comes to setting prices for a job when both the car owner and the shop know the job is going to run 10, 20 or 30 thousand $$$. Can a savvy car owner beat a shop down in price or do the good shops command what they want?

Bob40 said it well.

Restoration work on a car several decades old hiding who's knows what under the current finish is a tricky business. The details of saying have to be made clear, in plain language, to the customer, especially an uninitiated customer. The best a shop can do is to educate the potential customer the best he can. With any shop I know, if a potential customer is trying to 'beat down' the shop from the beginning, they are far better off to not take them on.

Parts and materials cost what they cost. Labor rates are market driven. Any negotiation room comes in the area of level/depth of the work. And even there it can be tricky.

If you watch Fantomorks you can get a pretty accurate idea of what shops can run into with cars. More often than not cars have much more hidden damage than the owner realizes. The shop has to be comfortable that they have educated that owner, and they understand what might happen as the job is opened up.

If someone brings their pride and joy to have work done, but starts the conversation with trying to beat down the shop... Well, that is too big a risk of a problem customer to take on.

Bob Andrews
07-28-2015, 06:24 AM
Gosh, who would think that 'High End' race car owners would consult with a shop known to associate themselves with ADMITTED CASO'S??? :eek:

Ed, this may surprise you, but it's a pretty big world out there. It's only in this tiny portion of the world that people brag about being cheap skates, and even more shocking, there are plenty of Studebaker owners that don't get involved with the clubs just because of that image. They have no problem with spending what it takes to get their car where they want, and they have a great time enjoying same.

Any hobby has their tightwads. They usually don't last long in their hobby; they get all indignant and storm off to the next hobby and repeat. Thankfully, they have the SDC world where they can be embraced by their own kind :-)

Bonus tip for you- there is no apostrophe in 'CASOs'. You are welcome.

SN-60
07-28-2015, 07:38 PM
Ed, this may surprise you, but it's a pretty big world out there. It's only in this tiny portion of the world that people brag about being cheap skates, and even more shocking, there are plenty of Studebaker owners that don't get involved with the clubs just because of that image. They have no problem with spending what it takes to get their car where they want, and they have a great time enjoying same.

Any hobby has their tightwads. They usually don't last long in their hobby; they get all indignant and storm off to the next hobby and repeat. Thankfully, they have the SDC world where they can be embraced by their own kind :-)

Bonus tip for you- there is no apostrophe in 'CASOs'. You are welcome.



You're a funny guy Bob......The only person on this forum that goes on and on that we're all cheap 'tightwads' is YOU!!

I do enjoy reading you're stuff though....silly as it usually is!

Bonus tip for you....capitalize the second 'S' in CASOS......You are welcome! :)

Bob Andrews
07-28-2015, 08:08 PM
Bonus tip for you....capitalize the second 'S' in CASOS......You are welcome! :)

You are, as usual, incorrect. Again. Ow, that's gotta hurt LOL

Love ya, ya cantankerous old bastard :)

SN-60
07-28-2015, 09:40 PM
You are, as usual, incorrect. Again. Ow, that's gotta hurt LOL

Love ya, ya cantankerous old bastard :)


Well, I guess things are improving. Bob Andrews replaced 'senile' with 'cantankerous'....AND he says he loves me!:ohmy:

Bob Andrews
07-28-2015, 09:43 PM
It's true, Ed. We have never met, but you give me no end of entertainment when I come here. :)

63t-cab
07-28-2015, 10:05 PM
Well Bob, that's NOT being a CASO - that's going ALL OUT :lol:---------------------------:!!:

It's true, Ed. We have never met, but you give me no end of entertainment when I come here. :)