Steering: power steering problem

[StudeNorm]

Hi,

Before I start randomly pulling components out of my car and replacing them is there an easy way to tell which component has cratered and pull it first?

My steering was getting a bit stiff over the last few weeks but it always felt stiff so I didn't really notice much difference until it suddenly just quit. If I am rolling it turns using Armstrong power steering but it seems to bind up. There is lots of fluid, no leaks, no obnoxious noise, the belt is tight. Maybe the problem is in the front end components? Everything is well greased. Any ideas to get me started?

I have a complete rebuilt P/S system that only needs an o-ring clip retainer for the pump shaft (must have lost it when I pulled it apart 20 years ago) before I can install the pump. The controller and ram are ready to install.

Thanks for any advice.

Norman Searle
1963 R2 Avanti R-3803

[dtracy]

Is the ram still conneted at both ends?

[doofus]

Hey Norman, any chance the engine has settled to near the manifold pipes in turns? soggy mounts create all kinds of problems. did this start after an alignment, if so check the tie rod clamp bolts for proper positioning. jack up the front end and place stands under the outer ends of the control arm. lower jack then with a helper turning steering wheel under power watch for problems, also listen carefully. good luck, Doofus

[Warren Webb]

Is there oil in the steering gearbox? Possible that the oil there has run out as the years have gone by & now it's seizing up? King pin lubed well? Remember when the king pin is lubed the upper pivot gets grease a lot later than the lower one causing a possible problem as time goes by. If it's still hard to turn when it's up in the air as Doofus suggested, then remove the tie rods at the steering knuckle one at a time, checking as you remove them one at a time for any difference in effort.

[karterfred88]

Sorry I'm lost at "o ring clip retainer"--do you mean the shaft retaining snap ring? Without it the shaft eats into the housing. Drain all your fluid, look for "black splotchy" stuff in the fluid. Put a magnet to it, if it sticks then something inside has been grinding away. That stuff will clog the pressure relief valve, ports in the ram, and in the valve body, any of which will diminish the power assist. But getting to the point yours is would take a major internal clog, or more likely an external cause such as those suggested by others. That ram puts out a lot of power if its activating. Check the ball fitting on the valve to make sure its moving, sliding the ball sleeve with some free play? No movement there and nothing happens in the hydraulic circuit as the spool doesn't move. Check the movement of the steering parts with the front end off the ground, try moving the steering by using the tire or tie rod, not the steering wheel. the control valve should "clunk" at the pitman arm as you change direction of the wheels. This is much more noticeable under the car and moving the steering tie rods than by just turning the steering wheel back and forth. Good luck, still working on mine trying to get some seal at the control valve, finally gave up sent it to Stangers as my spool has either been turned down too far for our vendors seals to work or ??????

[StudeNorm]

Hi,

I am back in northern Canada at this time and won't be able to check the P/S until this weekend, I hope.

I have the car on the hoist right now and will try to get the front wheels off the ramps when I get home. I did notice a lot of brownish goo has escaped from the steering box and is now all over the frame and other places below the box. Warren might have something there. I will check when I get home. Sagging front mounts are probably not the problem as there is a fair amount of clearance between components. The tie rods are all tight but an alignment might be in order.

Yes, Fred. The clip I referred to is the shaft snap ring. I was talking about a pump I pulled apart 20 years ago and started to rebuild but didn't finish as I lost the snap ring (sproing, off into the netherworld) and have not yet found a replacement. I guess I will now try to finish the job...

Thanks for all the suggestions. I will try to get started on resolving this problem when I get home this weekend.

[StudeNorm]

Finally made it out of the North and got through making my guest bathroom functional so I found time a few days ago to get back to the Avanti. I parked on the hoist and unloaded the front wheels. I raised the front end at the a-arms so there wasn't a huge change in geometry. I got my neighbour to sit in the car and turn the wheel while I stood underneath and watched the action...

What can I say! There was no "action". Everything I saw and heard looked good. My friend said the steering felt just fine. I lowered the car and backed out of the garage. No binding. No undo howling from the pump. No leaks. Everything worked.

I am now concerned that this might happen again, possibly while driving down the hiway, but how do you fix something if you can't find the part that is broke?

I am going to take the car on one last outing to get the windshield replaced before I put it away for the season. I will make sure that I am tuned in to how it feels while driving and see what happens. I have AAA and Hagerty coverage so I won't get stranded, but...

More later. Or maybe not!

[RadioRoy]

Two considerations:
-It's very difficult to find out what to fix on the steering when it is working fine. It almost needs to be acting up in order to find it.

-Getting the windshield replaced before putting the car into storage can pose problems. If it leaks when you take it on the road next year, the company may say the warranty has expired on the installation, or they may forget what they did, or they may forget how they did it, or they may even forget that they did it, or the only guy who know how to do it may have retired. Much better to replace the windshield when you will be actively using the car.

[karterfred88]

Finally made it out of the North and got through making my guest bathroom functional so I found time a few days ago to get back to the Avanti. I parked on the hoist and unloaded the front wheels. I raised the front end at the a-arms so there wasn't a huge change in geometry. I got my neighbour to sit in the car and turn the wheel while I stood underneath and watched the action...

What can I say! There was no "action". Everything I saw and heard looked good. My friend said the steering felt just fine. I lowered the car and backed out of the garage. No binding. No undo howling from the pump. No leaks. Everything worked.

I am now concerned that this might happen again, possibly while driving down the hiway, but how do you fix something if you can't find the part that is broke?

I am going to take the car on one last outing to get the windshield replaced before I put it away for the season. I will make sure that I am tuned in to how it feels while driving and see what happens. I have AAA and Hagerty coverage so I won't get stranded, but...

More later. Or maybe not!

Recheck your power steering fluid level now that it works. Any big change in level? Need to add fluid? Maybe something was causing a "void" in the fluid stream and now it has self corrected. A piece of "junk" may have dissolved or moved on after blocking a port. Personally I'd drain the system into a pan from the hoses at the control valve itself and look at it carefully to see if you find any "junk" in it. Won't hurt anything and transmission fluid is pretty cheap. Flushing the system certainly won't hurt anything and may prevent a recurrence if you find anything in the fluid.

[StudeNorm]

All good advice above... I may not have a choice but to wait on the windshield. The shop can't do it for a couple of weeks and the snow will probably be flying by then. The fluid should be replaced anyways so that will get done and I will check the gooey stuff coming out of the steering box.

I now have a '63 Lark with really sloppy steering to tune up and install a set of Turner brakes in, so that may take precedence over the Avanti for a while. It will be my 'other' daily driver. My wife's Altima is No. 1. The Lark is a replacement for my Mercedes 300TE wagon... If I find anything interesting on either car I will update this thread.

Cheers