Announcement

**Michidan** · 10-05-2007, 04:47 AM

BTW - car will be Auto trans so cluth pedal is not a concern of mine.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

**Dick Steinkamp** · 10-05-2007, 06:37 AM

I think Studebaker went to hanging pedals in '62.

You will have to substantially reinforce the firewall if you use a hanging pedal, but it would be possible to do. No aftermarket hanging pedal kits are made specifically for a Studebaker.

The rod sticking out is the pivot for the stock pedal. Turner makes a kit to put a dual master cylinder in the stock location. It's probably easier to find a stock pedal and cut a hole in the floor than to engineer a hanging pedal set up. The frame mounted pivot point is a nice, solid anchor...much better than a flexible firewall (even reinforced). It also keeps the engine bay "cleaner" to have the Master Cylinder under the floor.

Be sure to use the proper MC for your application (frankly, I don't know how you are going to compute MC piston sizes with that brake set up, but if you don't get the right MC bore and stroke for the calipers and wheel cylinders you are using, the brakes will not work well. Brake systems aren't just a collection of parts. If the components aren't carefully engineered to work together...trouble!) Also, use the proper residual check valves and an adjustable proportioning valve.

**52 Ragtop** · 10-05-2007, 08:58 AM

on a 52, the M/C goes inside the frame, away from the body. The double pedal pivot is held on with a very long bolt, not sure the exact length. The reason for the double pedal is for a larger brake pad to fit both feet (in my opinion anyway)
I can send you a pic. later, as I am at work and my 52 is home.

Jim

**Michidan** · 10-05-2007, 09:32 AM

I am just not sure, given the other mods made under the frame there, that the stock pedal is going to work. A dual m/c is a must, and I doubt it will fit. But i'd love to see a picture of one installed.

I am going to talk with master power about getting a system with correct diameters and valves that will work. But I figured I would narrow it down by at little by having a basic pedal idea.

I need to appeal to the many bullet nose street rodders out there, I am sure hanging pedals have been done 100 times. But I don't think many of these guys hang out with us here.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

**N8N** · 10-05-2007, 09:41 AM

The frame mounted pedal pivot provides FAR more solid support for the master cylinder than hanging it on the firewall, and pedal feel is therefore that much better. Porsche used bottom-pivot pedals for years claiming that they were more ergonomically correct, but that might be a bit of a stretch (I suspect it was really because the VW Beetle used them and they were parts-binning a lot of equipment)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight

http://members.cox.net/njnagel

**lstude** · 10-05-2007, 09:49 AM

Summit Racing has a hanging setup, but it is a little pricy. Studebaker started using hanging pedals in 1961.

Here is the Tilton system that Summit has:

http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+115+314490&D=314490

Leonard Shepherd

http://leonardshepherd.com/

**JBOYLE** · 10-05-2007, 10:00 AM

Mind if I ask a related (but non-Stude) question?

On my Barris Bearcat, it was originally built with hanging (from the dash) pedals but was soon comnverted by the builer to a floor mounted setup.

Any technical (as opposed to driver comfort) reason why that would have been done?

63 Avanti R1 2788
1914 Stutz Bearcat
(George Barris replica)

Washington State

**Michidan** · 10-05-2007, 11:00 AM

I can't imagine anything being more sturdy than pivoting off that huge rod coming out the frame. No argument there.
I will not just bolt a pedal to the firewall. Even if it could be done, that sheet metal isn't stiff enough.
I only have 1 parts car currently, 78 chevy truck. Looking under it, the OEM's used a pretty stout U brace that bridges between the firewal and the dash. This is what I need to fab into my 52 somehow.

I browsed the internet a bit. Sites like bullet nose paradise show a several cars that have hanging pedals. Wish I could tap into the success and failures discovered in those projects.

Leonard, that summit setup is trick but I bet more for building a dragster. So far the master power universal setup looks best. But it would need extra bracing to take the load off the firewall. Thanks for the thoughts so far guys.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

**leyrret** · 10-05-2007, 04:08 PM

Have no experience with earlier models but installed in my 56. Used 96 Mustang pedals. They are small and compact assembly. As to reinforcing firewall I find the trick is to put load somewhere other than on firewall. If you visualize a side view of firewall, cowl and floor in most vehicles it creates sort of a u shape. If you take a piece of angle or tube and place it vertically against firewall and bend the ends to fit contour of floor and cowl the force of the pedal will be applied to cowl and floor along with firewall. You may have to use a couple of pieces with bracing and tie firewall to dash. You could possibly use a plate on angles and mount to plate. Every situation is different. Since you only concerned with brake shouldn,t be to difficult. Make sure pedal position is comfortable when sitting in seat and has sufficient unobstructed travel. Consider hydroboost if space is at a premium and you have power steering.
travel

**52 Ragtop** · 10-05-2007, 05:19 PM

Michidan
Yes a dual M/C will fit under the floor, I have one on my 52 ragtop. I used a 76 Corvette M/C. I also have the brackets to adapt it to the 52 and earlier cars, I also have the brackets for the 53 and up cars too.
Before you ask, NO, there is not enough room for a power booster under the floor. I have found that Midland Brake does make a dual remote hydrovac that one could mount anywhere on the car, BUT, you must have both brake lines and a vacuum line going to it, and it's about $800!

I will get you some pictures in the morning of the M/C on my 52.

Jim

**Michidan** · 10-08-2007, 04:23 AM

Jim thank you for the offer. If everything else was stock I would probably just go with a dual under the floor and be done with it. But I'm sure the trans mount for the TH350 will be in the way. I am headed down the suspended pedal path.

This weekend I got the pedal out of my parts truck, 78 Chevy 2wd. Because the dash is empty I have all the room I need to plan out the system. From loooking inside the car, this means the area basically northwest of where the steering column exits. This part of the 52 firewall is not exactly flat. On the plus side, its also close to where the angled stiffeners run on the engine side of the firewall, the ones the fenders bolt to. It can work.

The 47-52 firewall is relatively tall compared to modern vehicles, so the truck pedal is a good fit. It's about 15.25 inches from the swivel to the pedal. GM uses a pressed in pin that the pushrod attaches on. Master Power says that for manaul brakes you want a pedal ratio of 5 or 6 to 1. I removed the pin, drilled a new hole about .75 inches closer to the swivel CL, and welded it back in. Now I have a 5.5:1 ratio. (My parts truck was power braked, stock ratio was about 4.25:1.)

Master cylinder wise, I searched the GM line for one that was disc front, drum rear, manual brakes with a 1 inch bore. Not the most common arrangement, but I got no farther than 78 chevy truck again and found one.

I have some work to do. Assuming this goes together well I promise some pictures and a full report.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

**Michidan** · 11-20-2007, 11:48 AM

Here are some progress pictures. This is custom fit stuff, but can be used to at least illustrate how one person went about it. All in all I am quite happy. Pedal position and feel is very good. The only thing I do not like about what I did was that the pushrod is not adjustable. I had the rod that came with the new MC, and the rod from the power braked parts truck. I cut each and welded. If I need more MC travel, it will mean a higher pedal, and I will have to cut the rod again and weld in more length.

**please keep in mind the car does not run, and it may be some time before I can test out my fabrication skills in the real world. (but the same can be said for the home-narrowed frame, home-cut steering, etc.)**

I started with a heavy 6x6 piece. Bent to conform to the firewall shape. The pedal hangs in an inverted U bracket. At #1 you see a brace up to a reinforced firewall area. At #2 you see a brace to the dash. It seems rock solid.

Here is the pedal. It is VERY close to the steering column, but does miss. Column is from 63 Cutlass.

Here is the underhood. I had master power brakes help me so far with MC selection. There are more pieces needed here too. What I like is where the #1 brace is bolted. This is a factory bracket used to brace the dash. It was already extra wide for some reason. My bolt looks right at home here.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

**Dick Steinkamp** · 11-20-2007, 12:29 PM

Nice installation!

(the big block Chevy looks right at home there too [8D])

**Michidan** · 11-20-2007, 12:43 PM

heh heh heh heh. [}

]
Oh, it is very at home there. Zoom Zoom.

Dan
52 hardtop

https://www.studebakerhardtop.com

Announcement

Brake pedal into 52 car

Brake pedal into 52 car

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment