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pbrown
08-09-2013, 11:23 AM
Hi there! I have decided to sell my 2011 Mustang GT convertible (that depreciates every day). This would leave me with 2 dependable daily drivers, but no "toy". I'm thinking that a Hawk would be a fun toy that is also an investment (or at least not a depreciating possession...). So, what should I buy? I like the looks of the Golden/Silver Hawks, but my wife likes the GT Hawks. As far as pricing, good looking vehicles seem to be available for $6-10K. Hagerty Insurance valuation says they are worth more than that...What am I missing? :confused: And if I do decide to go forward, what things should I be looking for/concerned about? Thanks in advance! Phillip:)

warrlaw1
08-09-2013, 11:41 AM
Insurance values are usually more than market value. $6 - 10K seems about right for a very nice driver. Economy is still shaky so good buys are out there. A better buy would be from an SDC member...you'll have a running start (pun intended). Let is know where in the "US" you are located. Offer may just pop up.

candbstudebakers
08-09-2013, 11:48 AM
I have access to two very nice GT hawks one a supercharged 63 and the other a nice 64 both drive able and nice looking lots of work done to both to just get in and drive home, where do you live always helps to know when talking about moving cars around.......Bob 510-266-2522 if interested in talking or you can just use the PM here.

jimmijim8
08-09-2013, 12:16 PM
Chuck Kenny has a supposedly turn key nice 62 GT advertised on the Unofficial Studebaker Drivers club swap page. {www.studebakerswap.com} August ads right near 10,000. Chuck is a long time member and afficianado. He always has nice stuff at fair prices. He doesn't sell junk. White Cloud Minnesota. cheers jimmijim

JEWELL
08-09-2013, 12:22 PM
Phillip, If you decided to go with the GT Hawks go for a 64. Very low production numbers, just a little over 1,500 built.

Mark

jimmijim8
08-09-2013, 12:54 PM
I wish I had known before I bought my 63. cheers
Phillip, If you decided to go with the GT Hawks go for a 64. Very low production numbers, just a little over 1,500 built.

Mark

studebaker-R2-4-me
08-09-2013, 01:50 PM
IMHO there are two Hawks to look at. The 1964 GT Hawk are the one's to look at in the GT series, with cleaner deck lid, grill surrounds and LOW production numbers. Otherwise it would have to be a 1961 Hawk with 4 speed. 1961 is the first year with 4 speed and have that Iconic early 60's look.

Good luck with your search and welcome to the forum.

Allen

billmdonn
08-09-2013, 01:57 PM
You knew that Jim.

JEWELL
08-09-2013, 02:43 PM
I wish I had known before I bought my 63. cheers
Well my 64 did not come with a battery hold down (don't tell Mr. Palma) so you got a better deal on your 63. It did come with a battery hold down didn't it?

Mark

pbrown
08-09-2013, 03:13 PM
Thanks for all the quick replies! I'm near Tampa, Florida, but get up to NC occasionally. I would be OK with buying a car and shipping it to me in Florida (if the price + shipping was still reasonable, and it came from a trustworthy source). Phillip

warrlaw1
08-09-2013, 03:16 PM
See Bob Petersen's post above (candbstudebakers). He finds some awesome cars and the prices are usually right. Sal and TXrebel are always coming up with sweet finds, too. Good luck.

Totempole
08-09-2013, 03:31 PM
Thanks or all the quick replies! I'm near Tampa, Florida, but get up to NC occasionally. I would be OK with buying a car and shipping it to me in Florida (if the price + shipping was still reasonable, and it came from a trustworthy source). PhillipWhere do you come to in NC...Totempole.

pbrown
08-09-2013, 03:58 PM
After more discussion with my wife she now agrees that tail fins are a must have, so it sounds like a Golden/Silver Hawk is what we need.

pbrown
08-09-2013, 04:00 PM
I lived in Denver NC (near Charlotte) all my life until I moved to Fl last Oct. I go to Gastonia occasionally to visit my son, DIL and grand-daughter

GThawkwind
08-09-2013, 04:46 PM
I agree a that a 61 would be a good way to go, I don't remember where but I saw a fantastic 61 in red/black on craigslist, needed minor work, are you at mechanically inclined? Or need something truly finished.

pbrown
08-09-2013, 06:03 PM
I agree a that a 61 would be a good way to go, I don't remember where but I saw a fantastic 61 in red/black on craigslist, needed minor work, are you at mechanically inclined? Or need something truly finished.

I am very mechanically inclined, but am currently lazy/involved in new house projects. (One of the reasons I got my 2011 Mustang is that I wouldn't have to touch it), So I'd prefer something that doesn't HAVE to have work immediately. I'm especially interested in a car that is drivable (and looks nice enough that my wife won't complain), that I can then do stuff to because I WANT to, not because I HAVE to.

pbrown
08-09-2013, 08:47 PM
Does anyone know if studoc has sold his hawk that had the red/black interior?

jimmijim8
08-09-2013, 08:58 PM
Then you should buy a good one to start with.
I am very mechanically inclined, but am currently lazy/involved in new house projects. (One of the reasons I got my 2011 Mustang is that I wouldn't have to touch it), So I'd prefer something that doesn't HAVE to have work immediately. I'm especially interested in a car that is drivable (and looks nice enough that my wife won't complain), that I can then do stuff to because I WANT to, not because I HAVE to.

pbrown
08-09-2013, 09:11 PM
Then you should buy a good one to start with.

EXACTLY! I'm a cheapskate at heart, but I know that right now in life I need to not buy a "bad one", even if it is the lowest price.

That's why I'm here, hoping to find out what makes a "good one", and also hoping for a reference to one that you guys trust.

jimmijim8
08-09-2013, 09:27 PM
I have mentioned a good car by a trusty worthy person. cheers jimmijim

studerodder
08-10-2013, 12:07 AM
sage words from a hawk man.
IMHO there are two Hawks to look at. The 1964 GT Hawk are the one's to look at in the GT series, with cleaner deck lid, grill surrounds and LOW production numbers. Otherwise it would have to be a 1961 Hawk with 4 speed. 1961 is the first year with 4 speed and have that Iconic early 60's look.

Good luck with your search and welcome to the forum.

Allen

pbrown
08-10-2013, 09:23 AM
I have mentioned a good car by a trusty worthy person. cheers jimmijim

You are correct - I've already been in touch with him. Thank you!

He's a real straight up guy. Unfortunately, the one he has is a GT - otherwise it would already be on its way to me. He doesn't have a finned hawk at the moment, so the search continues...(Unless we take a 180 degree turn and decide we would be happy with a GT Hawk...stranger things have happened!)

candbstudebakers
08-10-2013, 10:49 AM
You just missed a very nice 61 fin hawk, this one and it is going to New Zealand at end of the month.

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv271/canbstudebakers/SAM_0913_zps252dd2da.jpg (http://s691.photobucket.com/user/canbstudebakers/media/SAM_0913_zps252dd2da.jpg.html)

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv271/canbstudebakers/SAM_0914_zps080ce854.jpg (http://s691.photobucket.com/user/canbstudebakers/media/SAM_0914_zps080ce854.jpg.html)

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv271/canbstudebakers/SAM_0915_zps0c7ee186.jpg (http://s691.photobucket.com/user/canbstudebakers/media/SAM_0915_zps0c7ee186.jpg.html)

and the 63 and 64 are as nice as this one with the 63 being set up as a R-2 supercharged car and power shift on the floor.

valleyguy
08-10-2013, 03:01 PM
I'll be listing a nice driver on Ebay, RED 1960 Hawk within the next coupld of weeks.

Joe D.

studegary
08-10-2013, 07:08 PM
After more discussion with my wife she now agrees that tail fins are a must have, so it sounds like a Golden/Silver Hawk is what we need.

1960 and 1961 Hawk models also have fins (Golden are 1956-1958, Silver are 1957-1959) .

pbrown
08-10-2013, 07:15 PM
1960 and 1961 Hawk models also have fins (Golden are 1956-1958, Silver are 1957-1959) .

So I have recently learned (since my original post - I've been doing loads of research in last few days to come up to speed!)

Please keep making comments and corrections - I'm not proud, and you guys are THE source for good info!

52hawk
08-10-2013, 07:45 PM
I am getting ready to sell my '61 Hawk. Restored [not to stock]over the last 10 years-289 automatic,A/C and cruise control.Silver w/black interior,drive anywhere. Asking $15,000.

bhanlon
08-10-2013, 07:47 PM
As also a new member I have learned that these guys are the experts. I wish I knew of this site before purchasing my 62 GT Hawk last November. At that time I did not know of the "hog trough's" or how the body is mounted to the frame. I checked the frame for about 30 seconds or so before buying for rust but ignored the rest as the exterior looked great. Now I am paying for an expensive learning curve. In the end it will be great but if I knew what I know now I would have passed on the car. I now check the site daily and continue my education.

StudeRich
08-10-2013, 08:15 PM
It sounds like this Hawk is going to be "shared" with "She who must be listened to"! If this is the case, is she comfortable with a Manual Trans. Car?

The reason I mention it, is that when looking for '61's the big "Value" is in the first year Manual 4 Speed Cars, so if you can throw those OUT of the considerations, you will save quite a few $ ! :!:

candbstudebakers
08-11-2013, 01:18 AM
Chuck Kenny has a supposedly turn key nice 62 GT advertised on the Unofficial Studebaker Drivers club swap page. {www.studebakerswap.com} August ads right near 10,000. Chuck is a long time member and afficianado. He always has nice stuff at fair prices. He doesn't sell junk. White Cloud Minnesota. cheers jimmijim

Jimmijim FYI Chuck lives in White Cloud Michigan, not Minnesota

jimmijim8
08-11-2013, 06:46 AM
Yes you are right. Thanks for correcting and getting the info straight. I had Chuck's address written on a sheet of toilet paper and you know where that goes. Next time I'll write an address and phone number on the backside of a business card of mine. I can't imagine using a business card to wipe ones arss. I ain't LION. cheers jimmijim
Jimmijim FYI Chuck lives in White Cloud Michigan, not Minnesota

pbrown
08-11-2013, 08:41 AM
It sounds like this Hawk is going to be "shared" with "She who must be listened to"! If this is the case, is she comfortable with a Manual Trans. Car?

The reason I mention it, is that when looking for '61's the big "Value" is in the first year Manual 4 Speed Cars, so if you can throw those OUT of the considerations, you will save quite a few $ ! :!:
The sharing is mostly that "S W M B L T" :Dwill be riding in it and want to be comfy and proud (she has her own toy to drive, a Bright Red Lexus SC430 convertible). She may drive my toy occasionally though, so an auto is preferred. And for me personally, if I get a manual, I'd prefer it to be on the floor - how might those considerations change things?

studebaker-R2-4-me
08-11-2013, 12:30 PM
1963-64 GT Hawk's, Avanti's and Lark's have floor shift automatic transmissions (Powershift) that perform (almost) like standard shift cars. In drive (D) they have 2nd gear start, therefore you will find that you shift from first gear, to second gear and then into drive. It is the best of both worlds, performance and ease of shifting.

So, you want a finned Hawk, and want to stay away from 3 or 4 speed cars, therefore any 57-61 Automatic Hawk will do and will save the premium value of a 1961 Hawk 4 speed. It is quite easy to convert a column shift Hawk to floor shift with a Powershift transmission, Powershift shifter, wiring harness, shifter tower, bucket seats and center console. Most of this stuff is easy to get. You may want to change out the torque convertor as well to the Powershift 2200 rpm stall vs the standard 1700 rpm stall ratio. The only hard thing to find is the steering collar (Bell) for four speed and powershift cars, but I have heard others grinding off the column shift buttress and patching the hole and shift indicator hole with bondo.

I converted my column shift Lark to Powershift with buckets. I even went as far to pull the steering column removed the shifter parts, welded in patches to cover the two holes and painted the column and reinstalled it. You would never know this car was a column shift car.

Nice thing about buying a Studebaker is there are parts available and a great network of people willing to help out. Keep your eyes open and find a nice car. This forum is a good resource to everything Studebaker.

BTW become a member of the Studebaker Drivers Club and start receiving their glossy monthly magazine "Turning Wheels" with advertisements of parts, vendors, cars, and great articles. Cost for new members is under $20. A deal of a lifetime.

Good Luck,

Allen

woodysrods
08-11-2013, 12:43 PM
61's had a floor shift with bucket seats! Good Roads Brian & Sandi

studegary
08-11-2013, 05:50 PM
1963-64 GT Hawk's, Avanti's and Lark's have floor shift automatic transmissions (Powershift) that perform (almost) like standard shift cars. In drive (D) they have 2nd gear start, therefore you will find that you shift from first gear, to second gear and then into drive. It is the best of both worlds, performance and ease of shifting.

So, you want a finned Hawk, and want to stay away from 3 or 4 speed cars, therefore any 57-61 Automatic Hawk will do and will save the premium value of a 1961 Hawk 4 speed. It is quite easy to convert a column shift Hawk to floor shift with a Powershift transmission, Powershift shifter, wiring harness, shifter tower, bucket seats and center console. Most of this stuff is easy to get. You may want to change out the torque convertor as well to the Powershift 2200 rpm stall vs the standard 1700 rpm stall ratio. The only hard thing to find is the steering collar (Bell) for four speed and powershift cars, but I have heard others grinding off the column shift buttress and patching the hole and shift indicator hole with bondo.

I converted my column shift Lark to Powershift with buckets. I even went as far to pull the steering column removed the shifter parts, welded in patches to cover the two holes and painted the column and reinstalled it. You would never know this car was a column shift car.

Nice thing about buying a Studebaker is there are parts available and a great network of people willing to help out. Keep your eyes open and find a nice car. This forum is a good resource to everything Studebaker.

BTW become a member of the Studebaker Drivers Club and start receiving their glossy monthly magazine "Turning Wheels" with advertisements of parts, vendors, cars, and great articles. Cost for new members is under $20. A deal of a lifetime.

Good Luck,

Allen

A couple of corrections.
1) He did not say that he wants to stay away from standard shift - just the opposite (re-read his prior post).
2) The first year membership in SDC is $24 in the USA (not "under $20").

8E45E
08-11-2013, 08:00 PM
For G.T. Hawks, here's a thread on which is "most desirable"

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?56372-Most-Desirable-Year-GT&highlight=refined

Craig

GThawkwind
08-11-2013, 08:31 PM
This seemed like a pretty good deal to me
http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?73193-Anyone-interested-in-a-61-Hawk
Manual on the column but you could enjoy as is for now then later on do a floor shift conversion, or even a four, or auto swap. Probably too far but worth a look at least. Read the whole thing as the price changes.

pbrown
08-11-2013, 10:39 PM
This seemed like a pretty good deal to me
http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?73193-Anyone-interested-in-a-61-Hawk
Manual on the column but you could enjoy as is for now then later on do a floor shift conversion, or even a four, or auto swap. Probably too far but worth a look at least. Read the whole thing as the price changes.

I agree that it looks good - in fact, I joined the SDC initially just so I could see the pics of that car (I was locked out till I became a member)

I PMed him the first day I was a member, and again yesterday.. but I haven't gotten a response yet. Is studoc a regular on here?

GThawkwind
08-12-2013, 01:11 AM
I agree that it looks good - in fact, I joined the SDC initially just so I could see the pics of that car (I was locked out till I became a member)

I PMed him the first day I was a member, and again yesterday.. but I haven't gotten a response yet. Is studoc a regular on here?
No not really but he'll likely see it soon enough as he's been up here more since he posted up his car. You can check on his profile to and it'll tell you the last time he was on, which was the 7th BTW so he hasn't seen either PMs.

pbrown
08-12-2013, 11:03 AM
No not really but he'll likely see it soon enough as he's been up here more since he posted up his car. You can check on his profile to and it'll tell you the last time he was on, which was the 7th BTW so he hasn't seen either PMs.

Thanks for the tip!

RareBird
08-12-2013, 01:07 PM
http://mansfield.craigslist.org/cto/3892027776.html
I talked to the owner last weekend and he tells me this is a California car with little rust
26594

studebaker-R2-4-me
08-13-2013, 09:44 AM
http://mansfield.craigslist.org/cto/3892027776.html
I talked to the owner last weekend and he tells me this is a California car with little rust
26594

That's the one I would buy if it was the original colour. I believe it is the rarest of all 1961 Hawks, 4 speed with Flamingo paint.

Allen

warrlaw1
08-13-2013, 09:50 AM
I like that Hawk, too. Flamingo!

pbrown
08-13-2013, 12:15 PM
The Flamingo is just a little more work than my wife (and I, maybe) are willing to take on as our first vintage auto.

I think we need something that drives and looks reasonable when we take possession. If we can get one where major restoration items are a good ways off in the future, we can cut our teeth on trim, etc.

My observations are that you never get your money back out of restorations anyway, so spending the money up front for a better condition car (where someone else takes the hit) is probably a good idea, especially to get my wife involved in the hobby (She never bought anything but brand new cars till she met me - we've changed that, and now hopefully she's ready for something vintage!)

GThawkwind
08-13-2013, 02:10 PM
That pink looks real solid but at 10K I thought he was being plain stupid, now at 8K it's starting to make sense a bit better, I still think it's a little high but that depends on the state of the interior too. I bet for that money you could buy a nice driver and a BWT10 or power shift setup.

warrlaw1
08-13-2013, 02:36 PM
If it IS a California car with little rust, what else do you think would be better for the money? A rare 4 spd Flamingo 61 Hawk. Your $, your mistakes to make.

RareBird
08-13-2013, 03:29 PM
Mine is also a California car. You can either pay more money up front or pay the Body shop to patch it . My car only had light surface rust in the trunk and I know I saved thousands by buying a soild car rather than one from the Rustbelt.

GThawkwind
08-15-2013, 12:27 AM
Hey. A little out your budget but so nice it's insane is this http://nashville.craigslist.org/cto/3957449289.html
And on the low end is this http://clarksville.craigslist.org/cto/3915852707.html

pbrown
10-21-2013, 07:59 AM
... It is quite easy to convert a column shift Hawk to floor shift with a Powershift transmission, Powershift shifter, wiring harness, shifter tower, bucket seats and center console. Most of this stuff is easy to get. You may want to change out the torque convertor as well to the Powershift 2200 rpm stall vs the standard 1700 rpm stall ratio. The only hard thing to find is the steering collar (Bell) for four speed and powershift cars, but I have heard others grinding off the column shift buttress and patching the hole and shift indicator hole with bondo.

I converted my column shift Lark to Powershift with buckets. I even went as far to pull the steering column removed the shifter parts, welded in patches to cover the two holes and painted the column and reinstalled it. You would never know this car was a column shift car....

Now that I've had my car for a while and have a better frame of reference, I've been rereading the early responses to my questions and comments are sinking in!

Allen, can you tell me more about moving my FOM shifter to the floor? I've now got buckets ready to go in, and that would be nice!