Clutch / Torque Converter: Clutch does not disengage

[BShaw]

After getting the new motor to run pretty smooth (per previous threads) I figured it was high time that I try out the new tranny... WRONG!

Clutch does not disengage. When I go to shift into gear the car wants to move with the clutch pedal fully depressed. Of course, I did not attempt to force the car into gear. I took the clutch adjustment rod through it's full range to no avail.

Is there anything else I can try before pulling the tranny?

Details:

• The tranny is a Keisler-modified Tremec T45 5-speed (think cross between a T5 and 3550).
• Clutch is stock Studebaker with new pressure plate, disk, t/o bearing.
• Dan Giblin adapter kit used to connect the two.
• Everything seemed to go together fine.

[rockne10]

I would first check for any wear in any of the clutch linkage parts. On several occasions I have managed to flip the adjusting rod block or build a weld on a worn area. Sagging motor or body mounts? Next could be a crack in the throw out bearing activation fork.

[unclemiltie]

Some years back I put a new clutch and pressure plate in a Lark V8 for a friend, the parts came from a FLAPS. We had the same experience. I tore it down again this time replacing both the clutch and pressure plate with NOS Studebaker pieces. We compared the plates and the discs and could not see any difference in heights etc. Amazingly with the Studebaker NOS parts it worked properly and we could shift. We figured it had to be something in the pressure plate that was not correct but for the life of us we could not see what it was. The FLAPS plate was a rebuilt one.

[Skip Lackie]

Bob- Did you see this thread? My contribution was post #8.

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?72794-clutch-will-not-disengage

[BShaw]

Bob- Did you see this thread? My contribution was post #8.

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...-not-disengage

Here is Skip's post he noted above:
I don't think anybody has asked yet: has the car been sitting for a long time (~6 months)? If so, rust could be causing the clutch plate to just be stuck. If so, the technique for breaking it loose is to jack up the rear wheels, start the engine in high (the rear wheels will turn), put the clutch in and slam on the brakes. The inertia of the engine turning will usually break it loose. The HD clutches used in Stude's big trucks are famous for this problem after only a few weeks out of use.

It's been quite a few months since I put the tranny in. I should get my brakes working first, eh? I assume I set it up for about 1" freeplay, get it off the hoist, out in the driveway and make sure the neighbor kids are not out playing in the street.

BTW, the clutch components all came from SI, not my FLAPS.

[BShaw]

I would first check for any wear in any of the clutch linkage parts. On several occasions I have managed to flip the adjusting rod block or build a weld on a worn area. Sagging motor or body mounts? Next could be a crack in the throw out bearing activation fork.

The linkage parts looked good to me. I used a shorter clutch operating shaft to accomodate the wider trans but confirmed that the ear for the adjustment rod was in the same place as before. I had actually maintained the orginal setting of the adjustment rod thinking that this should not change much as my original clutch plate did not show a lot of wear (spring in the pressure plate had broken). Motor and rear mounts are new.

[Dan Timberlake]

Does the pedal resistance change from ~ none at the top when there's free play, to significant after the free play is taken up?

A rusted to the flywheel disc "feels" fine thru the clutch pedal. It just doesn't let go of the flywheel.

[Skip Lackie]

Here is Skip's post he noted above:
I don't think anybody has asked yet: has the car been sitting for a long time (~6 months)? If so, rust could be causing the clutch plate to just be stuck. If so, the technique for breaking it loose is to jack up the rear wheels, start the engine in high (the rear wheels will turn), put the clutch in and slam on the brakes. The inertia of the engine turning will usually break it loose. The HD clutches used in Stude's big trucks are famous for this problem after only a few weeks out of use.

It's been quite a few months since I put the tranny in. I should get my brakes working first, eh? I assume I set it up for about 1" freeplay, get it off the hoist, out in the driveway and make sure the neighbor kids are not out playing in the street.

BTW, the clutch components all came from SI, not my FLAPS.

If your hydraulic brakes don't work, you can still use the parking brake to stop the rear wheels.

[BShaw]

If your hydraulic brakes don't work, you can still use the parking brake to stop the rear wheels.

Unfortunately, the parking brake is dissassembled awaiting the new front cable somewhere in the garage.

Actually, I do have brakes...just have a leak somewhere. I filled the master cyl and it pumped up okay...certainly enough to try your breakout plan.

BTW, doing that won't harm my new trans will it?

(remember that there is good luck, bad luck and Bob luck in descending order hence my sig tagline)

[BShaw]

Does the pedal resistance change from ~ none at the top when there's free play, to significant after the free play is taken up?

A rusted to the flywheel disc "feels" fine thru the clutch pedal. It just doesn't let go of the flywheel.

When I first stepped on the pedal it was a consistant resistance from top to bottom. Then, I made some adjustment to get some freeplay then had what seemed to me to be a normal resistance the rest of the way down.

BTW, I have kept the return spring connected. Is that appropriate for making freeplay adjustments?

[PlainBrownR2]

I had this situation on my '55 a couple years ago. I did the same thing, except I put the rear end in the air, ran the car up a bit, and then hit the clutch and brake at the same time. Didn't jar it loose, even after 5-6 times, so I got under there, and looked at the bellhousing. There's an adjustment rod on those cars next to the bellhousing that adjusts the linkage in and out for the clutch. Mine was adjusted a little far out, so I incrementally turned it back in, and then played with the clutch pedal some more, until I heard what sounded like a paper bag popping, and I got resistance in the clutch again. There's a little bit of freeplay when the pedal is out, but it has resistance all the way to the floor.

[Skip Lackie]

Unfortunately, the parking brake is dissassembled awaiting the new front cable somewhere in the garage.

Actually, I do have brakes...just have a leak somewhere. I filled the master cyl and it pumped up okay...certainly enough to try your breakout plan.

BTW, doing that won't harm my new trans will it?

(remember that there is good luck, bad luck and Bob luck in descending order hence my sig tagline)

I can't imagine it hurting your trans. You could start by only running it up to 15-20 mph, and see if that's enough to break the clutch loose. That would just be equivalent to locking up your brakes in a panic stop anyway. That said, I'm not sure you should be using your brakes if you have a leak "somewhere". If you have a wheel cylinder leaking, you could foul your brake shoes with brake fluid. Once they're saturated, I have never been able to get it completely out. On the other hand, if you know that the leak is in the m/c or a junction in the line, there's less chance of damage.

[BShaw]

I can't imagine it hurting your trans. You could start by only running it up to 15-20 mph, and see if that's enough to break the clutch loose. That would just be equivalent to locking up your brakes in a panic stop anyway. That said, I'm not sure you should be using your brakes if you have a leak "somewhere". If you have a wheel cylinder leaking, you could foul your brake shoes with brake fluid. Once they're saturated, I have never been able to get it completely out. On the other hand, if you know that the leak is in the m/c or a junction in the line, there's less chance of damage.

Okay. I do plan on tracking down the brake fluid leak first thing tomorrow before proceeding.

[brngarage]

I used the "step on the clutch and brake at the same time" routine with the car on jackstands. After 4 or 5 tries, the clutch disc came unstuck and shifting is now normal.

[BShaw]

I used the "step on the clutch and brake at the same time" routine with the car on jackstands. After 4 or 5 tries, the clutch disc came unstuck and shifting is now normal.

Would you use 4th gear 1:1 or 5th gear OD? I'm thinking 4th gear.