Electronic ign. on hawks v8's

[studelover]

I just got my distributor back from Mr. Cathcart and wondered how many of the hawk or Hipo v8's out there use electronic Ign. in there cars and trucks, is there a big difference, in starting, road performance? I had a chance to hear a hawk for the first time and Now I am very intriged to learn how mine will sound. These motors have a sound of there own, I will be using the Edelbrock mufflers with the advanced tecnology so I look frward to a healthy sound!

Studebakers forever!

[fmarshall]

Will your tachometer still work, after switching from points to electronic. It is my understanding that the electronic conversions don't put out enough power for the tach to work.

I just took a transistorized ignition distributor out of my Avanti, and replaced it with a new dual-point one. And it works great, tach and all.

[studelover]

My hawk doesen't have a tach so I don't know, mine is tach delete and I have a flight-o-matic no need to over rev.

Studebakers forever!

[53k]

quote:Originally posted by studelover

I just got my distributor back from Mr. Cathcart and wondered how many of the hawk or Hipo v8's out there use electronic Ign. in there cars and trucks, is there a big difference, in starting, road performance? I had a chance to hear a hawk for the first time and Now I am very intriged to learn how mine will sound. These motors have a sound of there own, I will be using the Edelbrock mufflers with the advanced tecnology so I look frward to a healthy sound!

I had a Pertronix on my '64 Avanti and I have a MoPar electronic ignition on my Wagonaire. They make a big difference in starting. I'm not sure if there is a big change in road performance, but there must be some. I prefer the MoPar setup, but it involved changing the entire distributor where the Pertronix is a much simpler installation. Studebaker offered a transistorized ignition system on R-3 and R-4 engines and on at least some if not all '66s. It still required points though. Most of them have been removed supposedly due to reliability problems. However, a man told me some years ago that there wasn't anything wrong with the system, but they were very sensitive to bad grounds. There was a Studebaker service bulletin that adddressed the problem.
BTW, the Pertronix didn't affect my Avanti tach at all.


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine

[fpstude]

I have an electronic distributor conversion from Dave Thibeault on our '63 Hawk. It works fine, snd so does the Tach. So far it has very low miles, but that is about to change as the car is now at the paint shop.

Perry
'23 Special Six,
'50 Business Champ,
'50 Starlight Champ,
'60 Lark droptop,
'63 GT R1

[GTtim]

I put in a newly rebuilt engine in the spring of '06. As part of the rebuild, I rebuilt the R2 distributor and had it checked on a distributor machine. It is now finishing its second season with about 8000 miles. It starts and runs great and I haven't touched the points, the dwell is still within spec. I'm sure the electronic ones are better, but you can buy a lot of points for the money spent.

Tim K.
'64 R2 GT Hawk

[Guest]

i have a dual point in my hawk and have had no issues for almost 3 years everything is still set correct. i have been told by a reliable studebaker racer that used single, dual and electronic. that the electronic is alot better than the single point in all around useage , but about the same as the dual point. he said he actually like the dual point better but stays with electronic for convinence.. i also know his tach works fine... 1961 tach drive doenst drive off the coil. it had a piece that mounts on top the distributor shaft to run the tach.

Erin Hays
"From Stuck and Rusty to Slick steel and sex appeal"
RZRECTD
1961 Hawk
1962 Lark
1963 Wagonaire

[1956 Hawk]

From my experience points are as good as electronic ignition if they are adjusted correctly. The problem is that points wear, and go out of adjustment. In my Lark, I just added a MSD box to the stock points. Because it only puts 5 volts through the points, they don't wear as much. Also dwell is not an issue anymore, so as long as the points open and close it will still work.
On my R2 Hawk I am running a magnetic pickup distributer and a Holley Annihilator ignition system. This system is nice because you have full control of the timing curve.
David

[DEEPNHOCK]

I agree with you on this up to a point (pun intended).
I think the amount of voltage going through your points with an MSD setup is much less than 5 volts (maybe .5 volts?).. MSD only uses the points as a trigger for their capacitor.
But, having said that, the point gap can change due to rubbing block wear and shaft slop. That is something that an electronic setup moves away from. The MSD package adds a lot more to the ignition process than 'just' an electronic ignition (ie: Pertronix). But you have a bigger setup that visually isn't what some people want.
Good food for thought though...
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by 1956 Hawk

From my experience points are as good as electronic ignition if they are adjusted correctly. The problem is that points wear, and go out of adjustment. In my Lark, I just added a MSD box to the stock points. Because it only puts 5 volts through the points, they don't wear as much. Also dwell is not an issue anymore, so as long as the points open and close it will still work.
On my R2 Hawk I am running a magnetic pickup distributer and a Holley Annihilator ignition system. This system is nice because you have full control of the timing curve.
David

[chocolate turkey]

I have converted more than a couple of dozen Studebaker V-8's to electronic ignition. I started with the Chryco stuff in the '70's using the pre-lean burn guts out of a 400 motor, installing it in the Stude V-8 housing. The module was mounted on the firewall. I've used Pertronix ever since they have had it available. So, about 30 years of trouble-free mega-mile Stude driving with modern up-dated ignition, never having to change the points! Tach always worked too!

Brian K. Curtis

[studelover]

I can't very technical here however the MSD box is an advanced technology that works very well with electronic ING. I have never heard of anyone using it with points. I have heard of someone using the coil(MSD)with the points. The MSD box eliminates the module on electronic ign. I learned this the hard way. I was in my 55 chevy and it stopped in the middle of no where, I pop the cap thinking that my module had gone bad and it wasen't therethe MSD box has a pos.ans neg wire that goes to the battery, the neg had worked itself loose.I tightened the nut and I was on my way[]I never forgot that and I have not had a problem since(9 years ago)

Studebakers forever!

[DEEPNHOCK]

MSD can indeed be used with a points distributor.
They also sell it with an electronic pickup distributor.
Shoot, If you can send a low voltage signal to the MSD box that is timed, you don't even need the distributor to signal the MSD box ( ie: crank trigger)...
MSD is predominately a street performance and race CD (Capacitive Discharge) ignition that gives you multiple sparks in the firing zone. Good for high compression, bad gas, etc. But it will draw some power to run.
Some good info is at: http://www.msdignition.com/ignition_4_6200.htm
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by studelover

I can't very technical here however the MSD box is an advanced technology that works very well with electronic ING. I have never heard of anyone using it with points. I have heard of someone using the coil(MSD)with the points. The MSD box eliminates the module on electronic ign. I learned this the hard way. I was in my 55 chevy and it stopped in the middle of no where, I pop the cap thinking that my module had gone bad and it wasen't therethe MSD box has a pos.ans neg wire that goes to the battery, the neg had worked itself loose.I tightened the nut and I was on my way[]I never forgot that and I have not had a problem since(9 years ago)

Studebakers forever!

[JoeHall]

So Jeff, is MSD a more recent term for CD (capacitive discharge)? If so, running one with OEM points takes the current load off the points and allows them to last about 50,000 miles. Even then, the only reason they need changing is due to the wear block wearing away.

That was been my experience with BMW "boxer" motorcycles and Studebakers. With the GT, the electronic tach would not work; with the 56J this was not an issue, since the tach is not electronic. The BMW folks had a fix to keep the tach working but I have forgotten what it was.

I got out of BMWs and the J.C. Whitney CD box finally quit working in the 56J. Have not saw CD boxes around for a long time, but if the MSD is the same thing then I may go that route again someday, though I have since converted both 56Js to electronic ignition and am satisfied.

Joe H

[Guest]

THE NICE THING TO ME ABOUT THE MSD IS THE MULTI SPARK BELOW 3000 RPM BETTER MILAGE DUE TO BETTER BURN. STARTS EASIER AND IDLES SMOOTHER.. I HAVE NEVER RAN 1 ON A STUDEBAKER BUT WE RUN THEM ON OUR RACE CARS THAT ARE CAMMED BIG. THE FIRST ONE WE DID THE CAR IDLED ABOUT 1000 RPM WITH LOPE AND INSTALLLED MSD THE IDLE RAISE TO ALMOST 1900 WE IDLE DOWN TO 750 NOW AND I SWEAR IT DOESNT SEEM TO LOPE AS MUCH.

I STILL LIKE POINTS THOUGH

Erin Hays
"From Stuck and Rusty to Slick steel and sex appeal"
RZRECTD
1961 Hawk
1962 Lark
1963 Wagonaire

[DEEPNHOCK]

Exactly.... (and what Erin says too)
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by JoeHall

So Jeff, is MSD a more recent term for CD (capacitive discharge)? If so, running one with OEM points takes the current load off the points and allows them to last about 50,000 miles. Even then, the only reason they need changing is due to the wear block wearing away.

That was been my experience with BMW "boxer" motorcycles and Studebakers. With the GT, the electronic tach would not work; with the 56J this was not an issue, since the tach is not electronic. The BMW folks had a fix to keep the tach working but I have forgotten what it was.

I got out of BMWs and the J.C. Whitney CD box finally quit working in the 56J. Have not saw CD boxes around for a long time, but if the MSD is the same thing then I may go that route again someday, though I have since converted both 56Js to electronic ignition and am satisfied.

Joe H