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rkapteyn
03-27-2013, 12:06 PM
I had the following question emailed to me.


I currently have a 1960 Lark with a small block Chevy in it. It's far from stock anymore but looks pretty good. I would like to put in a new instrument cluster, but the limited space in the stock Lark dash pod for the instruments is pretty small. Well, while driving today I thought about how great the Power Hawk (and I'm sure others) dashboard looked with all of the Stewart Warner gauges. Then I asked myself if it would be possible to put in a K body dash into the Lark. I know the K bodies had a flatter windshield so the dash followed that same curve, or lack of a curve. Maybe with a little metal work (added material to allow for the increased curve) this could be done. How close are the widths of the K body dash vs. the Lark? Anyway, what do you think about this? I know anything is possible, but is this a lot bigger undertaking than what I am anticipating? Let me know what you think and then tell me if you have a dashboard like this that is for sale and how much you want for it. It doesn't need to have any gauges in it. Just something that's restorable.

Has anybody tried a Hawk dash in a 1960 Lark?

Mike Van Veghten
03-27-2013, 12:19 PM
I do know that when swapping from a flat windshield car to a different, but still flat windshield car DOES work....but not so sure going from a curved windshield part to a flat windshield car or the other way works.

I was told (by a coupla long time Stude experts) that a C/K dashboard would NOT fit into a Conestoga (simillar body to the Lark)....well, I know for fact that it fits great...with no modifications..!

Give it a try and let us know what happens..

Mike

Skybolt
03-27-2013, 03:22 PM
I would have to say I have not seen such a swap but knew of it being done before with 63 GT dash into a Lark but not sure of the year. So I have also contemplated the swap, as I have a 59 Lark, so now Mike has confirmed that it is, at least possible in his instance, I will be on the look out for one. I will also follow your progress, if you decide to proceed, and let you work the bugs out.

Warren Webb
03-28-2013, 04:27 AM
I've wondered this too & now it looks like it's gonna make it into my Champ!! Imagine having gauges that tell you all of whats going on instead of some lights!!

63t-cab
03-28-2013, 09:17 PM
Robert,and Warren. you can make 63 - 66 Lark/Lark type gauges fit into a 59,60 Lark/60-64 Champ gauge housing.they JUST fit with no room to spare"maybe just enough room for a paint job <G>.but can be done,you'll need to make a shim to go between the two gauges so they sit level across the span.then you have real actual gauges between the two units,I built one and installed in my 63 Champ and I think it looks sweet "I went with the green face" style.

StudeRich
03-29-2013, 01:06 AM
You do have to remember that the reason Mikes Conestoga Sedan/Wagon Body accepted a C & K dash is that it is a curved Windshield Car, not a Late '55 to '60 Wraparound Windshield Car!

Joe's idea is an easy one and works good, and just looks OK.
BUT;

What I would do is simply bolt in a '57 Cyclops Eye Speedo Complete Dash from a Champion, Commander or President and install Hawk or any 2in. SW or whatever Gauges in the Instrument cluster. It works in both the '59-'60 Larks and all Champs and it is a bolt in.

Here is a Champ with only the dash Top from a '57 Sedan Installed.
22581

That way you could replace the Speedo with another '60 Gauge cluster with a custom fitted Ammeter and Oil Press. gauge from a '62 or '63 Lark possibly in the Fuel and Temp. Holes and you could have a Idiot light for 4 way Flasher and Parking Brake warning.

Skybolt
03-29-2013, 12:25 PM
All this has me thinking. I will check the fit of some other Studebaker gauges before I take out the dash or do any major mods. I am still a little reluctant to modify any body or interior parts of such a low mileage car, even though I have done many mods to the mechanicals. It's amazing what can be learned from this forum. Thanks.

blackhawk
03-29-2013, 05:24 PM
Many years ago I replaced the dash in my '61 Champ with a dash from a '62 Lark and replaced the gauges with those from a '64 (see photo). The gauge clusters in the '62 are the same diameter as those used in the '64 so no modification is necessary. This pickup has been sitting unused in my shed for about 15 years, so the dash doesn't look as nice as it once did. The gauges in this conversion are much more functional and easier to read than the original ones that came with the truck.
~ Dale
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa67/DHaggster/IMG_499662Larkdashamp64gaugesin61Champ.jpg

63t-cab
03-29-2013, 07:52 PM
Dale,I like the looks of that.that's one version I never thought of,minds are always thinking.boy hard to tell if you have a Champ-Lark-or Hawk with all different trim <G>
Many years ago I replaced the dash in my '61 Champ with a dash from a '62 Lark and replaced the gauges with those from a '64 (see photo). The gauge clusters in the '62 are the same diameter as those used in the '64 so no modification is necessary. This pickup has been sitting unused in my shed for about 15 years, so the dash doesn't look as nice as it once did. The gauges in this conversion are much more functional and easier to read than the original ones that came with the truck.
~ Dale
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa67/DHaggster/IMG_499662Larkdashamp64gaugesin61Champ.jpg

blackhawk
03-29-2013, 10:07 PM
Thanks Joseph! The original dash slopes inward at the bottom, so the small gauge clusters are located in a recessed enclosure. Obviously the very skilled can modify just about anything, but this design limits what the rest of us can easily do to alter the factory offering. At the time I modified my Champ's dash, I owned a '61 station wagon. I could see that the dash in the '61 Lark should also fit in the Champ and the Lark dash had a flat, upright panel in which to mount the gauges. I no longer can remember why I used a '62 Lark dash instead of one from a '61, but I remember that there was some reason, some small advantage, in choosing the '62 over the '61. I also remember that it was not a perfect fit in the Champ, but I cannot remember what the problem was. I think there is a slight different in the curvature of the cowl or part of it. It was not severe enough to prevent attachment of the '62 dash and I don't remember any visual problems once the trim was in place. If any modifications were necessary where the dash attached at either end or to the steering column, they were easily solved. I was very satisfied with the changes I made to the dash and they certainly made my Champ unique. I have never seen another Champ with this modification, even though it seems like such a natural for the truck. Those unfamiliar with Studebakers think the truck came from the factory this way.

I forgot about the Hawk emblem on the horn button until you mentioned it. Maybe I changed that too? I can't remember what horn button came with the Champ pickup or where I would have gotten this one with the Hawk emblem if indeed I did change it.

~ Dale

candbstudebakers
03-30-2013, 12:25 AM
Just last week I got a GT dash out of the loft and held it in place of a 64 commander and it would be a lot of work to make fit and then how would it look? C/K dash are is to flat to fit the contour of larks.

Skybolt
03-30-2013, 11:47 AM
This thread has deviated a bit from the original question but I still have a few thoughts to add. I have a spare 59 dash gauge face I could try stuff on and some 62 gauges, which I'm not too fond off, so I can try a few things, I think they were black. (Just checked and I have either given them away or thrown them out) I don't care for the 64 gauge color as they are so far from the brown interior they would look out of place. The question is are there any gauges that have a black face, like the 59's, but with the four readouts that would fit the 59 holes?

63t-cab
03-30-2013, 12:47 PM
Leonard, I think 63 Lark gauges are black or blackish.if you do this,the panel will be totally filled with gauges.send me your email address and I'll send a pic of mine,then you'll know if you like the look.

blackhawk
03-30-2013, 12:59 PM
Yes, the gauge clusters in the '63s have a black face instead of the green used in the '64s. The "can" that holds either the speedometer or the 4 small gauges is the same size as those used in the '64-66 Lark models and will drop right into the holes in the '61 and '62 Lark dashes, but are larger diameter than those used in the '59 and '60 Lark dashes. I have a '63 Wagonnaire and always preferred those gauges. I just did not have an extra set to put in my Champ pickup.
~ Dale

Skybolt
03-30-2013, 06:55 PM
Joe, Thanks for sending the photos. I looked at them and the gauges certainly fill up the panel. I don't know if I want it to look that way. I will look into other options but seeing that conversion in person might make a difference.

LeoH
03-30-2013, 09:34 PM
What I would do is simply bolt in a '57 Cyclops Eye Speedo Complete Dash from a Champion, Commander or President and install Hawk or any 2in. SW or whatever Gauges in the Instrument cluster. It works in both the '59-'60 Larks and all Champs and it is a bolt in.

Here is a Champ with only the dash Top from a '57 Sedan Installed.
22581

That way you could replace the Speedo with another '60 Gauge cluster with a custom fitted Ammeter and Oil Press. gauge from a '62 or '63 Lark possibly in the Fuel and Temp. Holes and you could have a Idiot light for 4 way Flasher and Parking Brake warning.


I actually like that cyclops speedo on top, and I follow your suggestion to the OP that, if he did that he could insert the larger gauges in the original Lark cluster below, BUT, you haven't and I'm curious why you did what you did, adding the 57 dash to your Champ?

skyway
03-31-2013, 05:00 PM
Isn't the '61 dash much the same as '59?
If so, just get yourself 4 GT Hawk (oil, water, amp, & gas) gauges, a tach, and a hole saw.
The 4 Hawk gauges get hole sawed into the center of the dash just above the glove box, and the tach takes the place of the original "cluster".

Skybolt
03-31-2013, 06:05 PM
No the 59 is different. Changes are as follows. 59-60 and all Champ trucks have the same basic dash. 61 much the same as 62. 63 through 66 are similar to each other.

skyway
03-31-2013, 09:25 PM
Thanks for correcting me.
My mis-type; I meant to say 1960 and '59' are similar.
So yes, you could do the holesaw thing. Could even figure out a way to tilt those 4 slightly toward the driver, kinda ala 1965 Bonneville.

StudeRich
04-01-2013, 11:13 PM
I actually like that cyclops speedo on top, and I follow your suggestion to the OP that, if he did that he could insert the larger gauges in the original Lark cluster below, BUT, you haven't and I'm curious why you did what you did, adding the 57 dash to your Champ?

I think I got you a little confused. I suggested a Complete '57 Dash with the two Idiot Lights or all 4 replaced with 2 in. Hawk or similar Gauges.

OR;

Do like the owner of this Champ that was For Sale on eBay did, install JUST the dash top and '57 Speedo.
He really never finished this one because it still had a Second Stock Champ Speedo and Gauge Cluster.

I would have replaced that second Speedo with another '59-'60 Gauge cluster and modified it to take the two missing Gauges in the other cluster.
Another possibility would be what you suggest; a '63 or '64 Full Gauge Cluster, BUT if you did that, what do you put in the Speedo Hole? I guess it might be a Hawk or Daytona Tach. but not so much needed in a Truck?

I really do not like "cramming" in the '63-'64, as it really looks too tight, even though it does barely fit.
Is that clearer? :)

StudeDave57
04-01-2013, 11:30 PM
Why not make it really fancy and use a '57/8 Packard (sedan/wagon) dash?
That gives you all sorts of holes for gauges. :ohmy: :!:




StudeDave '57 :cool:

4961Studebaker
04-02-2013, 10:08 AM
If I recall correctly. The clay models for the 61 lark styling contained a variant of the 53? C/K dash. A picture not showing great detail was in TW within the last 2 years. I had toyed with the idea in my project.

LeoH
04-11-2013, 03:32 PM
Do like the owner of this Champ that was For Sale on eBay did, install JUST the dash top and '57 Speedo.
He really never finished this one because it still had a Second Stock Champ Speedo and Gauge Cluster.

I would have replaced that second Speedo with another '59-'60 Gauge cluster and modified it to take the two missing Gauges in the other cluster.
Another possibility would be what you suggest; a '63 or '64 Full Gauge Cluster, BUT if you did that, what do you put in the Speedo Hole? I guess it might be a Hawk or Daytona Tach. but not so much needed in a Truck?

I really do not like "cramming" in the '63-'64, as it really looks too tight, even though it does barely fit.
Is that clearer? :)

Yes it is, thanks. That's what seemed to be the case, glad I was on target.

StudeBob
05-24-2013, 09:26 AM
Resurrecting the thread:

There are several dashes from the mid to late sedans that will fit in the 60 Lark. I have a 60 GH powered Lark and was hoping to get more gauge choices so I did a bunch of research. I was told (but haven't confirmed) that a 56 Packard Clipper (Stude made) dash will work. I was also told that a dash from a 58 sedan would work so I put it side by side with a 60 dash shell and the mounting and curves look identical.

As someone stated earlier, the fact that the dash slopes down and away from the driver makes a custom application a bit difficult because the gauge bezel flattens it out.

I actually might be selling the 58 dash (I'm hoping to go in a different direction). I'll get pics of it and throw it on here.

41 Frank
05-24-2013, 11:22 AM
One thing I know for sure and that is that a '56 Packard dash will not fit a Studebaker. '58 would be more likely, when they were made by Studebaker. Studebaker started building the Packards starting with the 1957 models.

StudeRich
05-24-2013, 02:01 PM
Post #21 says exactly the same thing, if you talking about a '58 Studebaker or Packard Dash, but the intent of this string was to improve the gauge situation, and '58 Sedan/Wagons have IDIOT Lights!

swvalcon
05-24-2013, 06:02 PM
With enough work you can make almost anything work. I'am thinking late model mkz lincon dash and seats in a 61 champ truck I want to build this next year.

Lucy the Lark
05-24-2013, 07:00 PM
The '61 gauges (gages?) in a '60 look like they would be a neat install. How about the connections/sending units?
Original '60s or replace with '61s or ?

Lucy the Lark
05-24-2013, 07:03 PM
Correction - I meant the black-faced '63 into a '60 dash, not a '61 into a '60. Thanks.

Warren Webb
05-24-2013, 07:47 PM
This is what would be required replacing the 60 gauges with 63's. They are a very tight fit & if they look ok or not is a personal decision.

Lucy, the oil pressure light sending unit would be removed & a flex line leading to a hard metal line direct to the gauge would be installed. The other "idiot light" being the amp or generator charging light would be rewired. The main red wire to the ignition switch would be rerouted to the amp gauge. The other side of the amp gauge one would create a new wire to the ignition switch. The 2 other gauges wiring would remain the same.

Lucy the Lark
05-24-2013, 11:16 PM
WW, Thanks for sharing experience. I'm not crazy about the new looks, but I like to see degrees, amps, PSI, etc., but I'm equally unsympathetic to SWs add-on gauges. Just a little daydreaming. I tend to plan well before just lunging forward. We'll see. Thank you.

Warren Webb
05-25-2013, 08:45 PM
I took some measurements on a couple of dash bezels I have & came up with these. The 59/60 Lark bezel is 9.5 inches wide in which the gauges are in 3& 7/8" openings while the openings for the 63-66 dash are 4& 1/2" wide. I've seen the 63 up gauges in the early Lark bezel but it looks "cramped" in my opinion.

I did see these gauges online that are really good looking but not priced at CASO rates: http://www.newvintageusa.com/1969.html
$600. bucks plus what accessories may be needed is high but it offers everything plus the tach function.