Transmission / Overdrive: Thrust washers?

[SilverHawkDan]

I have been noticing that at slow speeds the camper is making a slight noise and I think I feel a little vibration in second gear only. So to help diagnose the possible issue I drained the oil out of the trans today. It did contain just a trace amount of fine metal filings and two flakes of metal. They are not magnetic and seemed to be soft metal like bearing babbit found on thrust washers. The biggest piece was about the size of small oatmeal flake. The other one was very small. So anyone ever work on these and know if there are thrust washers in there? Oh, it's a T86 with overdrive R11. I will be removing the trans for teardown and try to figure out what is shedding metal. The crazy thing is the trans works great including the OD.
Dan

[bezhawk]

There are thrust washers on each end of the cluster gear. Also the reverse idler gear. There should be one in front of the input gear, behind the front bearing, as too much end play will cause poor shifting and popping out of gear. It is one of the most overlooked areas in a rebuild.

[RadioRoy]

I'm getting ready to rebuild the T86 in my 50 Commander. I have a new cluster gear and plan to get new roller bearings, thrust washers, seals and try to figure out if the synchronizers are OK.

It's my first transmission, although I have done the overdrive part before. The local transmission shop took it apart and gave it back to me in a bag.

Any advice?

Any other new parts I should buy?

[bezhawk]

Roy, find a dowel that is the same size as the cluster gear counter shaft. Coat the roller bearings with grease (to hold them in place) insert spacers, another ow of bearings, etc.
Insert makeshift counter shaft in the case with the gears, and set up the thrust washers. Once set properly you can drive out the temporary shaft by tapping in the real one from the end, thus driving out the set up one, without miss placing any bearings. After that, the hardest part is getting the detent back in position . Pay attention to the brass syncro rings that they sit high on the taper of the gear cones and that the leading edge of the syncro teeth of the gears is pointed and even and not worn excessively. Make sure the snap rings fit their grooves exactly. And lastly, make sure you check the end play of the input gear, once the gear tower is installed, if needed buy a hardened washer to get the end play within specs. Looseness here allows the gear tower to move under torque, and decelleration loads to slip out of gear possibly.

[RadioRoy]

Thanks. Will do.

[Skybolt]

"Make sure the snap rings fit their grooves exactly."

This is one of the areas I have seen a problem with over the years also. I had one trans that made noises and would jump out of second sometimes. It turned out to be a broken snap ring, one behind the main bearing on the output side of a non-overdrive trans allowing the main shaft, and bearing, to move rearwards under load. This inturn wore many parts, including bearing surfaces on the input shaft, main shaft and the synchros, the only things with no damaged were the gears and the case, making it basically a throw away.

The main thing to make the job go as smoothly as possible is to have all the right tools. Most importantly some flag tip, or internal lock ring, pliers, I don't know what you guys call them, but to tackle this job they are a must. The first Studebaker T86 manual transmission I rebuilt was on the side of the road in the sub-tropics of Australia, about 30+ years ago, with only a few wrenches and two screwdrivers. Not the best way but it can be done. Later when I had to rebuild Ford Toploaders on a regular basis I don't know how I could get by without them. These are a simple set.