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royvaldez
09-14-2006, 05:35 PM
Hey guy's. I just purchased on ebay a front grill for a car that I have. Mind you, this is not a stude part. Ever since I started purchasing Pontiac parts, it has been a nightmare. Take a look at my ebay auction and tell me what you think. I paid for the item via Pay Pal. Can I get my money back. Please advise. I have not had any problems dealing with my Studebakers. It makes ya wounder? Please look at this ebay site.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=330028753417&ih=014&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

CHAMP
09-14-2006, 06:08 PM
Have you talked to the Seller about a refund? If you can't get satisfaction from the Seller try your cedit card company. You can also give him negative feedback. There also might be someone from e/bay that can help you out. Give us Sellers name so we will know not to deal with this liar. You know its people like that make it bad for honest people and e/bay in general.[8]

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

CHAMP
09-14-2006, 06:08 PM
Have you talked to the Seller about a refund? If you can't get satisfaction from the Seller try your cedit card company. You can also give him negative feedback. There also might be someone from e/bay that can help you out. Give us Sellers name so we will know not to deal with this liar. You know its people like that make it bad for honest people and e/bay in general.[8]

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

bams50
09-14-2006, 06:09 PM
I went and looked at the original ad after looking at your ad [:o)]

To be honest, I didn't see a lot of difference between his pics and yours... in fact, his made the teeth in particular look pretty bad...? I tried to look at it objectively as a frequent buyer AND seller on eBay- and if I were in the market, I would have passed on it b/c of the condition... especially at that price...[:0]

When I looked at his feedback, I saw that he sold the engine out of the same car due to a V8 swap... Based on that I figure the grill was a take-off that he had from replacing his with a better one; which is good info for making a judgement call on the current item...

Please understand where I'm coming from: As a fellow Stude fan, I really wanted to be angry at this seller; just not comfortable with putting all the blame on him...[B)]

I saw it had 19 bids when you bought it; why not try relisting it?

Robert K. Andrews Owner- IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2358680/1

bams50
09-14-2006, 06:09 PM
I went and looked at the original ad after looking at your ad [:o)]

To be honest, I didn't see a lot of difference between his pics and yours... in fact, his made the teeth in particular look pretty bad...? I tried to look at it objectively as a frequent buyer AND seller on eBay- and if I were in the market, I would have passed on it b/c of the condition... especially at that price...[:0]

When I looked at his feedback, I saw that he sold the engine out of the same car due to a V8 swap... Based on that I figure the grill was a take-off that he had from replacing his with a better one; which is good info for making a judgement call on the current item...

Please understand where I'm coming from: As a fellow Stude fan, I really wanted to be angry at this seller; just not comfortable with putting all the blame on him...[B)]

I saw it had 19 bids when you bought it; why not try relisting it?

Robert K. Andrews Owner- IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2358680/1

CHAMP
09-14-2006, 06:42 PM
I may have jumped the gun. I didn't look at the original ad. I should have because they say a picture is worth a thousand words, But it still sounds like the Seller may have stretched the truth pretty bad!

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

CHAMP
09-14-2006, 06:42 PM
I may have jumped the gun. I didn't look at the original ad. I should have because they say a picture is worth a thousand words, But it still sounds like the Seller may have stretched the truth pretty bad!

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

keeffer
09-14-2006, 07:03 PM
I sell car parts all the time on ebay People see a old part an go nuts with their bids {case in point} an then cry because its not as nice as they had hoped if the seller had bad pictures or lied about the quality you deserve a refund if you over bid that is your own fault
sorry a ebay power seller

keith kirchhoff
brockport ny 14420

keeffer
09-14-2006, 07:03 PM
I sell car parts all the time on ebay People see a old part an go nuts with their bids {case in point} an then cry because its not as nice as they had hoped if the seller had bad pictures or lied about the quality you deserve a refund if you over bid that is your own fault
sorry a ebay power seller

keith kirchhoff
brockport ny 14420

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 07:51 PM
I was told by seller that parts had minor rust and small cracks. Seller did not describe items well enough. I did ask for more information on other defects. Seller keeped on stating that the parts had small cracks and some rust.

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 07:51 PM
I was told by seller that parts had minor rust and small cracks. Seller did not describe items well enough. I did ask for more information on other defects. Seller keeped on stating that the parts had small cracks and some rust.

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 07:54 PM
The seller should not sell parts like this. If they are not useable, then do not post on ebay. I really need these parts. If they were useable, I would not post on this forum.

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 07:54 PM
The seller should not sell parts like this. If they are not useable, then do not post on ebay. I really need these parts. If they were useable, I would not post on this forum.

chrysleritis
09-14-2006, 11:30 PM
I think you're right to be p.o.'ed. I compared your photos with the seller's, and not admitting to the actual tears on the parts really isn't ethical. The seller said "rust, pitting, and dents" which can be easily fixed when you do a re-chrome job. The major dents, and the torn parts are really hard and pointlessly expensive to restore to any presentable condition. I would be mad, if this were me. I have not purchased parts which have been this badly represented. This is not the norm.

chrysleritis
09-14-2006, 11:30 PM
I think you're right to be p.o.'ed. I compared your photos with the seller's, and not admitting to the actual tears on the parts really isn't ethical. The seller said "rust, pitting, and dents" which can be easily fixed when you do a re-chrome job. The major dents, and the torn parts are really hard and pointlessly expensive to restore to any presentable condition. I would be mad, if this were me. I have not purchased parts which have been this badly represented. This is not the norm.

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 11:57 PM
I am mad as hell. Take a look at the seller add. Please go to

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=290025612289&ih=019&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT

Please advise. I need to get this person off the computer. What do you think?

Now look at mine as posted on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=330028753417&ih=014&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

royvaldez
09-14-2006, 11:57 PM
I am mad as hell. Take a look at the seller add. Please go to

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=290025612289&ih=019&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT

Please advise. I need to get this person off the computer. What do you think?

Now look at mine as posted on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=330028753417&ih=014&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

JDP
09-15-2006, 01:04 AM
I think it'll depend on the sellers reserve if he had one. If he expected say $50 for the parts and they were bid to four times that by you and others, it may be hard to prove he was trying to get more then it's worth.
I had one guy ask for my help about a Avanti he did not feel was worth the 22K he paid, but the owners reserve was 10K under that and the car was well worth 12-15K, maybe not the 22K he bid.

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
Arnold Md.
65 Sports Sedan(sold)
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner(sold)
51 Commander

JDP
09-15-2006, 01:04 AM
I think it'll depend on the sellers reserve if he had one. If he expected say $50 for the parts and they were bid to four times that by you and others, it may be hard to prove he was trying to get more then it's worth.
I had one guy ask for my help about a Avanti he did not feel was worth the 22K he paid, but the owners reserve was 10K under that and the car was well worth 12-15K, maybe not the 22K he bid.

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
Arnold Md.
65 Sports Sedan(sold)
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner(sold)
51 Commander

5859
09-15-2006, 01:11 AM
I don't know what to think, the parts look bad to me in his original ad, they look worse in your pictures of course, but your pictures are much closer. Like anything I think it is buyer beware, did you in addition to asking for more information on the defects, ask him to email you more detailed pictures of the defects? You might try contacting ebay or paypal directly to see if you have a case for getting your money back, but I think the chances are slim.

5859
09-15-2006, 01:11 AM
I don't know what to think, the parts look bad to me in his original ad, they look worse in your pictures of course, but your pictures are much closer. Like anything I think it is buyer beware, did you in addition to asking for more information on the defects, ask him to email you more detailed pictures of the defects? You might try contacting ebay or paypal directly to see if you have a case for getting your money back, but I think the chances are slim.

sbca96
09-15-2006, 02:20 AM
Ebay is great for Jesus Toast :

http://www.blacktable.com/images/0412pics/jesus/28000.jpg

How to create your own, and make thousands on Ebay! :

http://www.blacktable.com/gillin041202.htm

Tom

sbca96
09-15-2006, 02:20 AM
Ebay is great for Jesus Toast :

http://www.blacktable.com/images/0412pics/jesus/28000.jpg

How to create your own, and make thousands on Ebay! :

http://www.blacktable.com/gillin041202.htm

Tom

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 05:57 AM
I looked at that auction and the pictures are pretty small. He states in his ad: 1950 pontiac grill parts upper and lower grill bars and asorted teeth with center section and tooth retainers. some rust and pitting and dents on some pieces should be able to see in pics. if any questions please contact me and I will try to anwser as quickly as possiable.

He mentions some rust, pitting and dents. He doesn't mention tears. However this is a good case for asking questions about an auction. I really think that Paypal is NOT going to refund the money on this one as "not significantly as described".


________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 05:57 AM
I looked at that auction and the pictures are pretty small. He states in his ad: 1950 pontiac grill parts upper and lower grill bars and asorted teeth with center section and tooth retainers. some rust and pitting and dents on some pieces should be able to see in pics. if any questions please contact me and I will try to anwser as quickly as possiable.

He mentions some rust, pitting and dents. He doesn't mention tears. However this is a good case for asking questions about an auction. I really think that Paypal is NOT going to refund the money on this one as "not significantly as described".


________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

CHAMP
09-15-2006, 08:20 AM
I don't uderstand how a seller can give a buyer negative feedback if the buyer has held up his end of the bargain. Basicaly a seller can use feedback to get even with a disatisfied buyer. Oh the childish games we play over money and material objects:)

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

CHAMP
09-15-2006, 08:20 AM
I don't uderstand how a seller can give a buyer negative feedback if the buyer has held up his end of the bargain. Basicaly a seller can use feedback to get even with a disatisfied buyer. Oh the childish games we play over money and material objects:)

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 10:08 AM
That's called a retaliatory neg. It's a fact of life in Ebay land. Their feedback system totally sucks. For that reason, I will not leave feedback until someone has left it for me.


quote:Originally posted by CHAMP

I don't uderstand how a seller can give a buyer negative feedback if the buyer has held up his end of the bargain. Basicaly a seller can use feedback to get even with a disatisfied buyer. Oh the childish games we play over money and material objects:)

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.


________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 10:08 AM
That's called a retaliatory neg. It's a fact of life in Ebay land. Their feedback system totally sucks. For that reason, I will not leave feedback until someone has left it for me.


quote:Originally posted by CHAMP

I don't uderstand how a seller can give a buyer negative feedback if the buyer has held up his end of the bargain. Basicaly a seller can use feedback to get even with a disatisfied buyer. Oh the childish games we play over money and material objects:)

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.


________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

Roscomacaw
09-15-2006, 11:10 AM
Jesus toast? Only if you're that gullible. I don't see anything on this site (http://www.blacktable.com/gillin041202.htm) about how to fabricate phony Studebaker parts.

I couldn't begin to guess how many things I've gotten off ebay since '98. Way - WAY more than the number of feedbacks I've gotten ('cause I sell there too) and I remember maybe FOUR times that I've been stung to some degree.

Here's a couple of NOS pieces I NEVER would've found without ebay.

Here's a NOS hood ornament that was $24.95+ shipping! These have been gone from SASCO for some time now.

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/hoodtrim.jpg

Here's a hood mouldings (NOS again) that I recently paid about 35 bucks for. (Don't know HOW StudeDave missed these, but I'm glad they slid under his radar!

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/hoodmoulding.jpg

And these factory sill plates for a 57 2-dr sedan (NOS of course) $50 bucks + shipping.

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/stepplates.jpg

Got a $1400-dollar range top in the kitchen that was NEW for $300 bucks! Have yet to get "burned" on it as well.


Roy, I feel for you. BUT - unless it's appearant that I might win an item I really want for a really cheap price, I'd NOT have bid without the benefit of close-up photos such as you've provided in your auction.
It's pretty obvious the seller has a digital camera. If he can't be bothered to provide pics of better definition, then you need to not bid. I've stuck to this rule without pause and it's served me well.;)

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle!!

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

Roscomacaw
09-15-2006, 11:10 AM
Jesus toast? Only if you're that gullible. I don't see anything on this site (http://www.blacktable.com/gillin041202.htm) about how to fabricate phony Studebaker parts.

I couldn't begin to guess how many things I've gotten off ebay since '98. Way - WAY more than the number of feedbacks I've gotten ('cause I sell there too) and I remember maybe FOUR times that I've been stung to some degree.

Here's a couple of NOS pieces I NEVER would've found without ebay.

Here's a NOS hood ornament that was $24.95+ shipping! These have been gone from SASCO for some time now.

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/hoodtrim.jpg

Here's a hood mouldings (NOS again) that I recently paid about 35 bucks for. (Don't know HOW StudeDave missed these, but I'm glad they slid under his radar!

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/hoodmoulding.jpg

And these factory sill plates for a 57 2-dr sedan (NOS of course) $50 bucks + shipping.

http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/9/15/stepplates.jpg

Got a $1400-dollar range top in the kitchen that was NEW for $300 bucks! Have yet to get "burned" on it as well.


Roy, I feel for you. BUT - unless it's appearant that I might win an item I really want for a really cheap price, I'd NOT have bid without the benefit of close-up photos such as you've provided in your auction.
It's pretty obvious the seller has a digital camera. If he can't be bothered to provide pics of better definition, then you need to not bid. I've stuck to this rule without pause and it's served me well.;)

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle!!

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 11:46 AM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs
I couldn't begin to guess how many things I've gotten off ebay since '98. Way - WAY more than the number of feedbacks I've gotten ('cause I sell there too) and I remember maybe FOUR times that I've been stung to some degree.


I know there are folks that really don't like eBay (evil Bay?) for what ever reason. Like Biggs, I'm not one of them. I've only got a couple of hundred transactions under my belt (buying and selling), but never been stung either way (I probably shouldn't have said that [}:)]). I've paid more for some items than I thought I would have to...but was glad to get them because I probably would not have found them any other place. I've paid far less for some items than I was prepared to pay. I've sold items for more than I thought they would bring and gave a few "very good deals" to some buyers [:0].

Maybe I haven't been "stung" because I'm lucky (probably not;)). Maybe because most in the eBay community are pretty honest. Maybe because like Biggs, I probe pretty deep if it's going to involve a substantial investment (and to a Stude guy, a substantial investment is anything over $1.95 :D). If I don't like what I see or hear (or don't see or hear), I don't bid. Same with selling. I've locked out several sellers and cancelled bids when I have a bidder that doesn't look like someone I want to do business with.

I like this "virtual swap meet" that is eBay. It's not perfect, but IMHO, it's pretty close.

http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 11:46 AM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs
I couldn't begin to guess how many things I've gotten off ebay since '98. Way - WAY more than the number of feedbacks I've gotten ('cause I sell there too) and I remember maybe FOUR times that I've been stung to some degree.


I know there are folks that really don't like eBay (evil Bay?) for what ever reason. Like Biggs, I'm not one of them. I've only got a couple of hundred transactions under my belt (buying and selling), but never been stung either way (I probably shouldn't have said that [}:)]). I've paid more for some items than I thought I would have to...but was glad to get them because I probably would not have found them any other place. I've paid far less for some items than I was prepared to pay. I've sold items for more than I thought they would bring and gave a few "very good deals" to some buyers [:0].

Maybe I haven't been "stung" because I'm lucky (probably not;)). Maybe because most in the eBay community are pretty honest. Maybe because like Biggs, I probe pretty deep if it's going to involve a substantial investment (and to a Stude guy, a substantial investment is anything over $1.95 :D). If I don't like what I see or hear (or don't see or hear), I don't bid. Same with selling. I've locked out several sellers and cancelled bids when I have a bidder that doesn't look like someone I want to do business with.

I like this "virtual swap meet" that is eBay. It's not perfect, but IMHO, it's pretty close.

http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

JDP
09-15-2006, 11:54 AM
His neg says"no limit bidder then extorts partial refund with neg feedback decline his bids!!"

Perhaps the sellers view is that the bids went way too high, then the bidder felt the items were not worth the high bid. BTDT, I got one of my two negs from a guy that bid a new book with a retail of $100 and a buy it now of that amount, the reserve was met, and the BIN went away, and this fellow bid the book to $130. He then negged me for "ripping him off" when he found I'd relisted aaother copy of the book with the $100 BIN:)

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
Arnold Md.
65 Sports Sedan(sold)
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner(sold)
51 Commander

JDP
09-15-2006, 11:54 AM
His neg says"no limit bidder then extorts partial refund with neg feedback decline his bids!!"

Perhaps the sellers view is that the bids went way too high, then the bidder felt the items were not worth the high bid. BTDT, I got one of my two negs from a guy that bid a new book with a retail of $100 and a buy it now of that amount, the reserve was met, and the BIN went away, and this fellow bid the book to $130. He then negged me for "ripping him off" when he found I'd relisted aaother copy of the book with the $100 BIN:)

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
Arnold Md.
65 Sports Sedan(sold)
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner(sold)
51 Commander

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 01:41 PM
I've listed lots of stuff with a BIN, then had bids take the BIN away. Then, the item sells for WAY over the BIN.

That makes me grin.


quote:Originally posted by JDP

His neg says"no limit bidder then extorts partial refund with neg feedback decline his bids!!"

Perhaps the sellers view is that the bids went way too high, then the bidder felt the items were not worth the high bid. BTDT, I got one of my two negs from a guy that bid a new book with a retail of $100 and a buy it now of that amount, the reserve was met, and the BIN went away, and this fellow bid the book to $130. He then negged me for "ripping him off" when he found I'd relisted aaother copy of the book with the $100 BIN:)

________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

65cruiser
09-15-2006, 01:41 PM
I've listed lots of stuff with a BIN, then had bids take the BIN away. Then, the item sells for WAY over the BIN.

That makes me grin.


quote:Originally posted by JDP

His neg says"no limit bidder then extorts partial refund with neg feedback decline his bids!!"

Perhaps the sellers view is that the bids went way too high, then the bidder felt the items were not worth the high bid. BTDT, I got one of my two negs from a guy that bid a new book with a retail of $100 and a buy it now of that amount, the reserve was met, and the BIN went away, and this fellow bid the book to $130. He then negged me for "ripping him off" when he found I'd relisted aaother copy of the book with the $100 BIN:)

________________________
Mark Anderson
1965 Cruiser
http://home.alltel.net/anderm

http://home.alltel.net/anderm/images/smstude.jpg

Scott
09-15-2006, 01:55 PM
This doesn't make sense. If a person bids the amount that equals the BIN, why isn't the auction over? I've heard that it just goes away, but how can that work? I've done BIN items and when I do, it's over.

If a person is not bright enough to hit the buy-it-now button when he can see his bid will equal the BIN amount, why should he complain about paying more than the BIN amount if he just goes ahead and enters a bid? That's the only way I can see the program ignoring and then erasing the BIN option - by placing a bid instead of hitting the BIN before it's gone.

Scott
09-15-2006, 01:55 PM
This doesn't make sense. If a person bids the amount that equals the BIN, why isn't the auction over? I've heard that it just goes away, but how can that work? I've done BIN items and when I do, it's over.

If a person is not bright enough to hit the buy-it-now button when he can see his bid will equal the BIN amount, why should he complain about paying more than the BIN amount if he just goes ahead and enters a bid? That's the only way I can see the program ignoring and then erasing the BIN option - by placing a bid instead of hitting the BIN before it's gone.

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 02:18 PM
quote:Originally posted by Scott

This doesn't make sense.


The BIN will disapear one of two ways. Either when the first bid is placed if it's a no reserve auction, or when the reserve is met if it is a reserve auction.

Say the BIN is $100 and it's a no reserve auction. The BIN goes away when the first $1 is bid. Say it's a $75 reserve auction with a $100 BIN. The BIN goes away when the bidding reaches the reserve of $75.

I think it's a good system for the buyers, sellers, and eBay. How would you do it?





http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 02:18 PM
quote:Originally posted by Scott

This doesn't make sense.


The BIN will disapear one of two ways. Either when the first bid is placed if it's a no reserve auction, or when the reserve is met if it is a reserve auction.

Say the BIN is $100 and it's a no reserve auction. The BIN goes away when the first $1 is bid. Say it's a $75 reserve auction with a $100 BIN. The BIN goes away when the bidding reaches the reserve of $75.

I think it's a good system for the buyers, sellers, and eBay. How would you do it?





http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Scott
09-15-2006, 03:07 PM
I don't know. I obviously don't unbderstand the eBay system all that well. I love (he said sarcastically) these different levels of reserves. First there's the "reserve" which is normally not disclosed. Then there's the BIN, which is another level of reserve, where the seller basically says "I may or may not have a reserve, but this is the price I'll sell this for" aka a reserve. Then there's the starting bid, which is the owner saying, "This is the absolute lowest I'll even consider selling item X for", aka a reserve.

So we really have three levels of reserve, and we have the hapless buyer unaware of anything but the starting bid in most situations. The buyer is not aware that the BIN may have already been superceded and if he is uninformed may over-spend for an item.

It's just the old caveat emptor!

By the way, the issue of the starting bid has always perplexed me because the way a lot of people on eBay abuse it. They go on and on about how there's no reserve on an item and then have a starting bid level 1% under their buy-it-now. If that's not a reserve, I don't know what is.

Scott
09-15-2006, 03:07 PM
I don't know. I obviously don't unbderstand the eBay system all that well. I love (he said sarcastically) these different levels of reserves. First there's the "reserve" which is normally not disclosed. Then there's the BIN, which is another level of reserve, where the seller basically says "I may or may not have a reserve, but this is the price I'll sell this for" aka a reserve. Then there's the starting bid, which is the owner saying, "This is the absolute lowest I'll even consider selling item X for", aka a reserve.

So we really have three levels of reserve, and we have the hapless buyer unaware of anything but the starting bid in most situations. The buyer is not aware that the BIN may have already been superceded and if he is uninformed may over-spend for an item.

It's just the old caveat emptor!

By the way, the issue of the starting bid has always perplexed me because the way a lot of people on eBay abuse it. They go on and on about how there's no reserve on an item and then have a starting bid level 1% under their buy-it-now. If that's not a reserve, I don't know what is.

Studedude1961
09-15-2006, 03:10 PM
First of all, if you paid via PayPal you can file a dispute with Paypal and I can almost guarantee that you will win. You may have to mail the grill parts to Paypal for them to judge, but I have never ever found Paypal to rule against a buyer.

Second, both ads look like this auction featured a pile of very tired Pontiac grill parts.

Third, eBay is changing. Any resemblance to an "auction" site is fast disappearing. I do alot of selling on eBay and am finding alot of bidders who totally "blue-skying" listings...giving items the added luster of their own hopes and dreams and reading things into descriptions that simply aren't there. The seller mails the item and the buyer then "shops it," takes a look and wants his/her money back. This isn't how classic auctions work. Sellers can somewhat try to protect themselves by stating everything sold is "as-is" but sellers accepting Paypal need to know that Paypal almost always decides in favor of the buyer.

Fourth, eBay plays into many people's natural desire for "something for nothing" and the natural competitive spirit we all have. That's why piles of parts that start at a reasonable $5 sometimes escalate to $200 when the parts are only really worth $3...and so on.

Fifth, be careful. eBay may seem like a "pretend" place of commerce where buyers and sellers may feel free to bash each other but keep in mind slander and libel laws do apply and retribution can sometimes escalate into "real world" court battles.

All five points being said, probably 99% of all transactions on eBay are mutually beneficial and just downright fun. I think our Studebaker friend here was most likely taken advantage of but taking a look at the photos I would say the likelyhood of these grill pieces being usable in the first place was iffy at best.

I have done over 2,300 transactions as buyer and seller but mostly seller on eBay and so far, knock on wood, have 100% positive feedback.

Studedude1961
--1963 Cruiser

Studedude1961
09-15-2006, 03:10 PM
First of all, if you paid via PayPal you can file a dispute with Paypal and I can almost guarantee that you will win. You may have to mail the grill parts to Paypal for them to judge, but I have never ever found Paypal to rule against a buyer.

Second, both ads look like this auction featured a pile of very tired Pontiac grill parts.

Third, eBay is changing. Any resemblance to an "auction" site is fast disappearing. I do alot of selling on eBay and am finding alot of bidders who totally "blue-skying" listings...giving items the added luster of their own hopes and dreams and reading things into descriptions that simply aren't there. The seller mails the item and the buyer then "shops it," takes a look and wants his/her money back. This isn't how classic auctions work. Sellers can somewhat try to protect themselves by stating everything sold is "as-is" but sellers accepting Paypal need to know that Paypal almost always decides in favor of the buyer.

Fourth, eBay plays into many people's natural desire for "something for nothing" and the natural competitive spirit we all have. That's why piles of parts that start at a reasonable $5 sometimes escalate to $200 when the parts are only really worth $3...and so on.

Fifth, be careful. eBay may seem like a "pretend" place of commerce where buyers and sellers may feel free to bash each other but keep in mind slander and libel laws do apply and retribution can sometimes escalate into "real world" court battles.

All five points being said, probably 99% of all transactions on eBay are mutually beneficial and just downright fun. I think our Studebaker friend here was most likely taken advantage of but taking a look at the photos I would say the likelyhood of these grill pieces being usable in the first place was iffy at best.

I have done over 2,300 transactions as buyer and seller but mostly seller on eBay and so far, knock on wood, have 100% positive feedback.

Studedude1961
--1963 Cruiser

Transtar56
09-15-2006, 03:10 PM
On parts like this ,chrome,trim,its really tough to see the defects if the pictures arn't high resoulution,or from some distance away. You should not have bid unless the seller was willing to send you some good high res,close up pictures. Even then its hard to tell good chrome from fair chrome.

Transtar56
09-15-2006, 03:10 PM
On parts like this ,chrome,trim,its really tough to see the defects if the pictures arn't high resoulution,or from some distance away. You should not have bid unless the seller was willing to send you some good high res,close up pictures. Even then its hard to tell good chrome from fair chrome.

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 03:54 PM
quote:Originally posted by Scott

I don't know. I obviously don't unbderstand the eBay system all that well. I love (he said sarcastically) these different levels of reserves.


Actually, there is only one reserve. That is the "hidden" number that is the lowest amount that will result in a sale.

The BIN is the same as a price tag on an item in a store. As a buyer, you are free to purchase the item for that amount (knowing that it is over the reserve, but also knowing you can "own it now" for that price).

The starting price in a reserve auction is somewhat meaningless. Some sellers use a super low starting price to get some interest going in the auction and maybe generate some "auction fever". Some set a relatively high starting price to attract only serious buyers. Some (as you state) use the starting price as the lowest amount they will accept for the item in a no reserve auction.

I've bought far more items than I've sold. I don't consider myself "hapless" as a buyer. If you believe that (most, all) eBay sellers are out to get you, it would be best for you not to purchase items through eBay. My experience has been otherwise.



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
09-15-2006, 03:54 PM
quote:Originally posted by Scott

I don't know. I obviously don't unbderstand the eBay system all that well. I love (he said sarcastically) these different levels of reserves.


Actually, there is only one reserve. That is the "hidden" number that is the lowest amount that will result in a sale.

The BIN is the same as a price tag on an item in a store. As a buyer, you are free to purchase the item for that amount (knowing that it is over the reserve, but also knowing you can "own it now" for that price).

The starting price in a reserve auction is somewhat meaningless. Some sellers use a super low starting price to get some interest going in the auction and maybe generate some "auction fever". Some set a relatively high starting price to attract only serious buyers. Some (as you state) use the starting price as the lowest amount they will accept for the item in a no reserve auction.

I've bought far more items than I've sold. I don't consider myself "hapless" as a buyer. If you believe that (most, all) eBay sellers are out to get you, it would be best for you not to purchase items through eBay. My experience has been otherwise.



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

N8N
09-15-2006, 04:01 PM
quote:First of all, if you paid via PayPal you can file a dispute with Paypal and I can almost guarantee that you will win. You may have to mail the grill parts to Paypal for them to judge, but I have never ever found Paypal to rule against a buyer.

Paypal's dispute procedure is utterly worthless. I bought a "new" Edelbrock carb off eBay and when it showed up, it had a 5 year old date code and also had been dropped so hard that it bent the primary throttle shaft and cracked the main body casting. As a result, the primaries wouldn't close, and had I not noticed this and bolted it on my engine, I might have got quite a nasty surprise. I contacted the seller and after he had his wife make up some story about him having a family emergency (what a classy guy!) and I didn't back off he basically told me to piss up a rope. Contacted PayPal and they wanted a quote from an "expert" to repair the carb, which was of course unrepairable, at least for less than the cost of a new Edelbrock. None of the major carb rebuilders would even agree to let me ship them the carb for inspection because they knew that they wouldn't be getting any business from me. The PayPal people refused to call any of the companies that I talked to, even though I provided them with contact information, they refused to look at the pictures I offered to send them, and the seller lied to them and told them that I had damaged the carb and was trying to screw him. (why would I damage a carb to the point that it was unrepairable just to get my money back? why wouldn't I just have not bid on it if I didn't want the carb?) So I'm out my money and have a worthless POS carburetor.

The seller's name was James Roe aka "roefastford" by the way. Only negative feedback on my account was from this transaction, but I'll be damned before I'll retract my negative to him, he screwed me fair and square.

All I can say is "caveat emptor" and ALWAYS check the feedback of people you're buying from. Most sellers will have mostly positive feedback, but a few negatives can be telling. Find the negatives and see who's being unreasonable, and if it's the seller that's being unreasonable, don't buy from them! It's not worth the risk. (should have done that in my case; the guy has mostly good feedback, but if there's a problem, he has a pattern of going ballistic on buyers that have the temerity to complain.)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

N8N
09-15-2006, 04:01 PM
quote:First of all, if you paid via PayPal you can file a dispute with Paypal and I can almost guarantee that you will win. You may have to mail the grill parts to Paypal for them to judge, but I have never ever found Paypal to rule against a buyer.

Paypal's dispute procedure is utterly worthless. I bought a "new" Edelbrock carb off eBay and when it showed up, it had a 5 year old date code and also had been dropped so hard that it bent the primary throttle shaft and cracked the main body casting. As a result, the primaries wouldn't close, and had I not noticed this and bolted it on my engine, I might have got quite a nasty surprise. I contacted the seller and after he had his wife make up some story about him having a family emergency (what a classy guy!) and I didn't back off he basically told me to piss up a rope. Contacted PayPal and they wanted a quote from an "expert" to repair the carb, which was of course unrepairable, at least for less than the cost of a new Edelbrock. None of the major carb rebuilders would even agree to let me ship them the carb for inspection because they knew that they wouldn't be getting any business from me. The PayPal people refused to call any of the companies that I talked to, even though I provided them with contact information, they refused to look at the pictures I offered to send them, and the seller lied to them and told them that I had damaged the carb and was trying to screw him. (why would I damage a carb to the point that it was unrepairable just to get my money back? why wouldn't I just have not bid on it if I didn't want the carb?) So I'm out my money and have a worthless POS carburetor.

The seller's name was James Roe aka "roefastford" by the way. Only negative feedback on my account was from this transaction, but I'll be damned before I'll retract my negative to him, he screwed me fair and square.

All I can say is "caveat emptor" and ALWAYS check the feedback of people you're buying from. Most sellers will have mostly positive feedback, but a few negatives can be telling. Find the negatives and see who's being unreasonable, and if it's the seller that's being unreasonable, don't buy from them! It's not worth the risk. (should have done that in my case; the guy has mostly good feedback, but if there's a problem, he has a pattern of going ballistic on buyers that have the temerity to complain.)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Studedude1961
09-15-2006, 04:25 PM
Nate there are more seller Paypal horror stories than I can shake a stick at, and even a few websites devoted to Paypal and the chance sellers take in accepting Paypal payments because if sellers really push, most (I shouldn't have said all) get their money back through Paypal's guarantee program. Quite a few sellers have quit accepting Paypal because of this (and because their fees are high and, if you ever have problems with Paypal, they are second only to the IRS to deal with...they can literally reach into your bank account and withdraw money to send back to buyers). I have been fortunate in that I have only had two buyers who have taken me through the Paypal dispute process (they failed to buy insurance and since I accept Paypal my terms: not responsible for USPS damage without insurance) meant ZIP. In short, Paypal sets seller policy in return for convenience and when we sign up to accept Paypal we sellers accept this.

Studedude1961
--1963 Cruiser

Studedude1961
09-15-2006, 04:25 PM
Nate there are more seller Paypal horror stories than I can shake a stick at, and even a few websites devoted to Paypal and the chance sellers take in accepting Paypal payments because if sellers really push, most (I shouldn't have said all) get their money back through Paypal's guarantee program. Quite a few sellers have quit accepting Paypal because of this (and because their fees are high and, if you ever have problems with Paypal, they are second only to the IRS to deal with...they can literally reach into your bank account and withdraw money to send back to buyers). I have been fortunate in that I have only had two buyers who have taken me through the Paypal dispute process (they failed to buy insurance and since I accept Paypal my terms: not responsible for USPS damage without insurance) meant ZIP. In short, Paypal sets seller policy in return for convenience and when we sign up to accept Paypal we sellers accept this.

Studedude1961
--1963 Cruiser

royvaldez
09-16-2006, 02:13 PM
Hey guy's, I have never had problems buying and selling on Ebay. I always dealt on goodfaith. I figured, If I can't use it, I will not sell it. I need to adjust to the real world.

royvaldez
09-16-2006, 02:13 PM
Hey guy's, I have never had problems buying and selling on Ebay. I always dealt on goodfaith. I figured, If I can't use it, I will not sell it. I need to adjust to the real world.

N8N
09-16-2006, 03:00 PM
I have only been really "burned" the once, and only had one other questionable transaction. Most people are good, it's the few that spoil the fun. Of course, I really only buy Studebaker parts and occasionally a vintage watch or parts for same, and don't sell much at all, and for the most part I've found Studebaker people to be generally more trustworthy (not to mention helpful and friendly) than the norm and the same seems to hold true of the people that are into old watches.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

N8N
09-16-2006, 03:00 PM
I have only been really "burned" the once, and only had one other questionable transaction. Most people are good, it's the few that spoil the fun. Of course, I really only buy Studebaker parts and occasionally a vintage watch or parts for same, and don't sell much at all, and for the most part I've found Studebaker people to be generally more trustworthy (not to mention helpful and friendly) than the norm and the same seems to hold true of the people that are into old watches.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Transtar56
09-19-2006, 07:17 AM
I buy more than I sell on E-Bay,and was only burned once,by a bad check. Later someone started a thread about this same clown on the other NG about his rubber checks,so it wasn't just me that got fried by him.
When I sell stuff,I often end up selling to the same people who have bought from me before,in which case I send the goods as soon as the auction ends and wait for payment. Ive never been burned yet doing that,and folks appreciate getting their stuff quickly.
Ive also recieved stuff from JP before I even got the check in the mail,so I guess we Stude guys are,by and large,a pretty honest bunch.

Transtar56
09-19-2006, 07:17 AM
I buy more than I sell on E-Bay,and was only burned once,by a bad check. Later someone started a thread about this same clown on the other NG about his rubber checks,so it wasn't just me that got fried by him.
When I sell stuff,I often end up selling to the same people who have bought from me before,in which case I send the goods as soon as the auction ends and wait for payment. Ive never been burned yet doing that,and folks appreciate getting their stuff quickly.
Ive also recieved stuff from JP before I even got the check in the mail,so I guess we Stude guys are,by and large,a pretty honest bunch.

DEEPNHOCK
09-19-2006, 07:25 AM
Looks like Santa Claus toast to me;)
Jeff[8D]



quote:

Ebay is great for Jesus Toast :
http://www.blacktable.com/images/0412pics/jesus/28000.jpg


http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j54/deepnhock/Jeff%20Rice%20Studebaker%20Pictures/1937StudebakerCoupeExpressJeffRicee.jpg

DEEPNHOCK at Gmail.com
[u]Homeless 'til Tomorrow!</u>
'37 Coupe Express (never ending project)
'37 Coupe Express Trailer (project)
'61 Hawk (project)
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

DEEPNHOCK
09-19-2006, 07:25 AM
Looks like Santa Claus toast to me;)
Jeff[8D]



quote:

Ebay is great for Jesus Toast :
http://www.blacktable.com/images/0412pics/jesus/28000.jpg


http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j54/deepnhock/Jeff%20Rice%20Studebaker%20Pictures/1937StudebakerCoupeExpressJeffRicee.jpg

DEEPNHOCK at Gmail.com
[u]Homeless 'til Tomorrow!</u>
'37 Coupe Express (never ending project)
'37 Coupe Express Trailer (project)
'61 Hawk (project)
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

showbizkid
09-19-2006, 09:20 AM
Looks more like my dog to me :D


[img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

Clark in San Diego
'63 Lark Standard
http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

showbizkid
09-19-2006, 09:20 AM
Looks more like my dog to me :D


[img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

Clark in San Diego
'63 Lark Standard
http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

Walt Zander
09-19-2006, 10:00 AM
Looks like the toasting appliance needs tweaking.
Burnt edges (crust), untoasted center. However- like my bride says..
I'm too critical! ;)
It is with that posture I do Ebay auctions. Have been lucky so far.:)
Only wish the best for all SDC members dealing with eBay.

'49 Champion Starlight Coupe
1936 Miller Replica / Stude driveline
Wisconsin

Walt Zander
09-19-2006, 10:00 AM
Looks like the toasting appliance needs tweaking.
Burnt edges (crust), untoasted center. However- like my bride says..
I'm too critical! ;)
It is with that posture I do Ebay auctions. Have been lucky so far.:)
Only wish the best for all SDC members dealing with eBay.

'49 Champion Starlight Coupe
1936 Miller Replica / Stude driveline
Wisconsin

sbca96
09-19-2006, 11:19 AM
quote:Originally posted by showbizkid

Looks more like my dog to me :D

And "dog" spelled backward is .....;)

Tom

sbca96
09-19-2006, 11:19 AM
quote:Originally posted by showbizkid

Looks more like my dog to me :D

And "dog" spelled backward is .....;)

Tom