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View Full Version : Brakes: Has anyone changed a Disc. brake hawk to Drum Brakes 1963 -1964



G T Joe
07-12-2012, 01:14 PM
Has anyone changed a Disc brake hawk 1963-1964 to drum brakes , if you did , what changes did you do, and why?

Dick Steinkamp
07-12-2012, 02:24 PM
I haven't done it, but it makes sense. The self energizing finned drum brakes stop the car quite well and drum brake parts are available and inexpensive. It also give you the opportunity to use a dual MC that you can't use with the stock disc brake set up.

You'll have to change both the front and back brakes since the rear brakes with the disc set up are non self energizing and designed solely for use with the front discs. You should get rid of the troublesome hydrovac since it is really not needed with the self energizing drums and would probably make them too sensitive (just my guess). The stock MC is different between disc cars and drum cars, and you'll need the drum pedal since the geometry is different from disc cars. You'll need a variety of new hard lines since you eliminate the hydrovac, and more if you replace the stock MC with a dual chamber one.

Bo Markham
07-12-2012, 03:51 PM
[QUOTE=Dick Steinkamp;661684]I haven't done it, but it makes sense. The self energizing finned drum brakes stop the car quite well and drum brake parts are available and inexpensive. It also give you the opportunity to use a dual MC that you can't use with the stock disc brake set up.

Why can't one use a dual M/C with stock disc brake set up?

Dick Steinkamp
07-12-2012, 05:37 PM
Why can't one use a dual M/C with stock disc brake set up?

The hydrovac only allows one in and one out. If you eliminated the hydrovac you could, but I don't know if the car would be drivable without the power assist.

Dan White
07-12-2012, 06:17 PM
The PO of my '64 R1 Hawk did this since the old disk were pretty well shot. He removed the hydrovac and put on the big finned front drums, no change on the rear brake setup. It worked OK. I converted it back to Hydrovac/disk, but with an aftermarket disk setup, not the stock Stude version. Have not had any problems with it since converting back.

I would suggest you look at the front disk kits that are out there. Much better than the original, I have both, stock on my R2 Hawk and aftermarket on the R1 and the R1's brakes are far superior.

Bo Markham
07-13-2012, 08:00 AM
The hydrovac only allows one in and one out. If you eliminated the hydrovac you could, but I don't know if the car would be drivable without the power assist.

Dick,

I see what you mean. I hadn't thought much about the hydrovac unit used on hawks. I was thinking of my 64 T-cab, Daytona and Avanti with conventional power booster mounted on firewall.

Bo

Hawklover
07-13-2012, 07:48 PM
I will do you one better.........Avanti owner Peter Crisitello has removed the disk fronts and installed drums with drum master cyl.
Has anyone changed a Disc brake hawk 1963-1964 to drum brakes , if you did , what changes did you do, and why?

G T Joe
07-13-2012, 08:06 PM
Has he posted this swap on the forum ?

SN-60
07-13-2012, 08:10 PM
To: GT Joe,---Yes, I did that conversion on a '63 GT Hawk at the owners request. And it turned out fine, but personally I thought it was really a step 'backwards'. I'd straighten out the original disc system, paying
careful attention to the disc booster and it's vacuum hose, or better yet go with modern Turner brakes up front.

63 R2 Hawk
07-13-2012, 08:15 PM
SI, among other vendors, has all the parts needed to rebuild the original Dunlop disc brakes, probably for less than what it would cost to convert to drums. My Hydrovac has never worked since I bought the car and it stops with authority. Gonna rebuild it "whenever I find the time" though.

52 Ragtop
07-13-2012, 08:39 PM
" Gonna rebuild it "whenever I find the time" though"

SI has brand new hy-dro-vacs! I was hoping to have brand new Avanti style boosters available at the International Meet, but---


Jim

Gunslinger
07-13-2012, 10:15 PM
If you're not concerned about correctness and originality, you can install a modern booster and master cylinder. That's what I had done last year after my Avanti was damaged due to brake failure. After the body damage was repaired I asked a speed shop I deal with to look into new, more effective master cylinder and booster. They worked with a performance brake supplier and came up with a good combination...an Allstar Performance 8" ALL 41006 booster and a Wilwood 2604894 master cylinder. The only real extra effort was the mounting bracket for the booster had to be modified some.

There are three different master cylinders in the Wilwood series like the one I had installed...each with a different bore size to make the pedal harder or softer. Mine is the middle size. The booster is available on Amazon.com and the master cylinder is available through Summit Racing or Jegs. There is a write up and photograph of my installation on Bob Johnstone's website http://www.studebaker-info.org/tech/bblum/bblum210911.html.

While I like to use our Studebaker vendors as much as possible, this was simply too good to not do, but my car is not the least correct and original, which may make this a non-starter for anyone who wants to preserve the correct appearance of their car.

Dick Steinkamp
07-13-2012, 10:35 PM
If you're not concerned about correctness and originality, you can install a modern booster and master cylinder. That's what I had done last year after my Avanti was damaged due to brake failure.

This might be tough to do in a GT with the underfloor MC.

swvalcon
07-14-2012, 07:01 AM
If a guy realy wants to do it just remove the pedals and install a aftermarket under dash pedal system and go late model master with booster.

G T Joe
07-15-2012, 06:45 PM
Is there a possible brake problem , if you retain the disc brake hydrovac, and use the front drums ? , should you also change the hydrovac? what about the rear wheel cylinders?

Dick Steinkamp
07-15-2012, 06:59 PM
Is there a possible brake problem , if you retain the disc brake hydrovac, and use the front drums ? , should you also change the hydrovac? what about the rear wheel cylinders?

You could experiment with retaining the disc hydrovac and pedal, but my guess is that it will make the brakes VERY touchy.

Not only the rear wheel cylinders need to change, but everything else back there as well. They are 11" non self energizing brakes...designed to work ONLY with the front discs. You need the 10" self energizing brakes that are designed to work with the front drums...backing plates, shoes, hardware, drums, cylinders all need to be changed.

JoeHall
07-15-2012, 08:35 PM
Its easy enough to go back to drums, but IMHO that is a step backward in technology. The 63 GT I recently picked up has factory PDB, and the discs & calipers were swapped over to Turner's. I am thinking it should be real sweet. Now, if I can ever just get the car to, "rolling project" status. Been working on it about six weeks and 100 hours now, but still have yet to move it out of the garage.
Can't believe I got myself into another project.

Dan White
07-16-2012, 08:47 AM
I have a complete front drum brake setup w/ the large finned drums that I took off of my '64 Hawk. This includes the backing plates, drums, shoes, etc. I am going to put the setup on the Studebaker swap site tonight or tomorrow. However, if anyone is interested I can bring these to SB for the Nationals. These are heavy to ship! If interested PM me.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p167/drwhite55/100_4943-1.jpg

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p167/drwhite55/100_4944-1.jpg

BrianC
07-16-2012, 08:55 PM
Hey Gunslinger: Much like you i damaged my 63 GT Hawk with a hydra-vac failure. Not to risk it again i purchased a conversion from Summit racing(disc and drum). Speaking to the technician he assured me that i don't need a pedal kit for the Hawk, however i 'm not sure how the configuration is to work with the existing linkage under the floor to the master cylinder? Any idea how to link up the pedal for this?
Thanks

Gunslinger
07-16-2012, 09:35 PM
I really don't as the Avanti already has the suspended brake pedal rather than the floor mounted one. I'm sure somewhere someone has done something similar to what you're doing. If no one here has done it you might go to a speed shop that does custom work and see what they have to say.

BrianC
07-17-2012, 07:22 PM
Thanks, i'll keep my fingers crossed that someone will reply to a post.