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  • Replacement Bodies

    I probably have a poor title, but I'm wondering what the convention is in relation to replacing the body on a special car where the original body is basically scrap.

    The Speedster that Bob Palma and (John Kern) are looking at in the latest TW is a case in point - say, Bob gets the car and as it's rare rebodies it - how is the new body identified i.e. is the original data plate affixed to the firewall alongside that body's own plate with an explanation that this car is in effect a composite of two vehicles, created to preserve a rare car that would otherwise disappear?

    Just that doing otherwise could be considered fraudulent (wouldn't it?)as folks wouldn't know that what they see didn't come from the factory that way.

    John Clements
    Avantilover, your South Australian Studebaker lover!!!
    Lockleys South Australia
    John Clements
    Christchurch, New Zealand

  • #2
    quote:Originally posted by avantilover

    I probably have a poor title, but I'm wondering what the convention is in relation to replacing the body on a special car where the original body is basically scrap.

    The Speedster that Bob Palma and (John Kern) are looking at in the latest TW is a case in point - say, Bob gets the car and as it's rare rebodies it - how is the new body identified i.e. is the original data plate affixed to the firewall alongside that body's own plate with an explanation that this car is in effect a composite of two vehicles, created to preserve a rare car that would otherwise disappear?

    Just that doing otherwise could be considered fraudulent (wouldn't it?)as folks wouldn't know that what they see didn't come from the factory that way.
    Well, the various Time Guides which give an estimate of the amount of labor it takes to perform all the repairs on a Studebaker does list a "Frame Swap". If you do keep the original chassis and swap it with a same-year body from a doner car, I would say probably not.
    The time would be at 'sale' time when you decide to sell the car, and get asked about the originalness of it, then you would have to step up and state the body was swapped.

    Craig.

    Comment


    • #3
      quote:Originally posted by avantilover

      I probably have a poor title, but I'm wondering what the convention is in relation to replacing the body on a special car where the original body is basically scrap.

      The Speedster that Bob Palma and (John Kern) are looking at in the latest TW is a case in point - say, Bob gets the car and as it's rare rebodies it - how is the new body identified i.e. is the original data plate affixed to the firewall alongside that body's own plate with an explanation that this car is in effect a composite of two vehicles, created to preserve a rare car that would otherwise disappear?

      Just that doing otherwise could be considered fraudulent (wouldn't it?)as folks wouldn't know that what they see didn't come from the factory that way.
      Well, the various Time Guides which give an estimate of the amount of labor it takes to perform all the repairs on a Studebaker does list a "Frame Swap". If you do keep the original chassis and swap it with a same-year body from a doner car, I would say probably not.
      The time would be at 'sale' time when you decide to sell the car, and get asked about the originalness of it, then you would have to step up and state the body was swapped.

      Craig.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi John,
        swaping VIN plates is fraudulent, without question.

        However, Studebakers are way off the radar in terms of stolen vehicles etc and swaping a VIN number is so easy to do from one body to another, that nobody in the registration dept will notice it or even care if they are not informed.

        If you have a real nice body of another doner car floating around it really is not going to matter doing a swap 45 years after they were first made.

        Dont change the body number on your Avanti to that of a 59 lark 6

        Greg

        Greg Diffen
        Australian Stude nut living in Warwick, United Kingdom

        1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 Dutch delivered
        1937 Dicator sedan. Australian Body by TJ Richards
        1939 Packard Seven Passenger monster UK delivered
        1939 Commander Sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards
        1939 Commander Swiss Cabriolet by Lagenthal
        1961 Hawk
        1963 Daytona Hardtop
        1988 Avanti Convertible
        Greg Diffen

        Editor Studebaker Owners Club UK magazine

        Australian Stude guy living in Warwick, United Kingdom

        1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 delivered new in the Netherlands
        1937 Dictator sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards RHC
        1937 Packard Super 8 Limousine UK delivered RHC
        1939 Packard Super 8 Seven Passenger sedan monster UK delivered RHC
        1939 Commander Cabriolet by Lagenthal of Switzerland
        1963 Lark Daytona Hardtop
        1988 Avanti Convertible

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi John,
          swaping VIN plates is fraudulent, without question.

          However, Studebakers are way off the radar in terms of stolen vehicles etc and swaping a VIN number is so easy to do from one body to another, that nobody in the registration dept will notice it or even care if they are not informed.

          If you have a real nice body of another doner car floating around it really is not going to matter doing a swap 45 years after they were first made.

          Dont change the body number on your Avanti to that of a 59 lark 6

          Greg

          Greg Diffen
          Australian Stude nut living in Warwick, United Kingdom

          1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 Dutch delivered
          1937 Dicator sedan. Australian Body by TJ Richards
          1939 Packard Seven Passenger monster UK delivered
          1939 Commander Sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards
          1939 Commander Swiss Cabriolet by Lagenthal
          1961 Hawk
          1963 Daytona Hardtop
          1988 Avanti Convertible
          Greg Diffen

          Editor Studebaker Owners Club UK magazine

          Australian Stude guy living in Warwick, United Kingdom

          1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 delivered new in the Netherlands
          1937 Dictator sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards RHC
          1937 Packard Super 8 Limousine UK delivered RHC
          1939 Packard Super 8 Seven Passenger sedan monster UK delivered RHC
          1939 Commander Cabriolet by Lagenthal of Switzerland
          1963 Lark Daytona Hardtop
          1988 Avanti Convertible

          Comment


          • #6
            quote:Originally posted by go-studebaker

            Hi John,
            swaping VIN plates is fraudulent, without question.

            Greg Diffen
            Keep in mind he is not swapping VIN plates!! He is asking about using a good body from a wrecked car that has a) either been in an auto wreckers that has had a salvage ticket written on it; or b), its been off the road and unregistered for so long, its null-and-void. The body for my '66 Commander was from an autowreckers. It had a salvage ticket written up for it long before I bought it. It was sold to me as a 'body shell', not a complete car. In other words, I need an existing car to 'make it work'. If anyone tried to register that serial number the car from the autowrecker had, it would be turned down due to its 'salvage' status. The only other way to register it would be to get a government-issued VIN, which is a tamper resistent sticker similar to the licence plate one that is affixed to the door.

            Craig
            post.

            Comment


            • #7
              quote:Originally posted by go-studebaker

              Hi John,
              swaping VIN plates is fraudulent, without question.

              Greg Diffen
              Keep in mind he is not swapping VIN plates!! He is asking about using a good body from a wrecked car that has a) either been in an auto wreckers that has had a salvage ticket written on it; or b), its been off the road and unregistered for so long, its null-and-void. The body for my '66 Commander was from an autowreckers. It had a salvage ticket written up for it long before I bought it. It was sold to me as a 'body shell', not a complete car. In other words, I need an existing car to 'make it work'. If anyone tried to register that serial number the car from the autowrecker had, it would be turned down due to its 'salvage' status. The only other way to register it would be to get a government-issued VIN, which is a tamper resistent sticker similar to the licence plate one that is affixed to the door.

              Craig
              post.

              Comment


              • #8
                We have discussed this before, but here it goes again. You can swap a serial tag or frame as part of a restoration as long as their is no intent to commit fraud. i.e. you have a good, valid title to a Speedster that has a rusty or damaged body or frame and you buy and install new or used parts to restore it, even a body or frame, that's a legal restoration. The Classic car guys will even build a new body from scratch for a high dollar car if another body is not available. If it were otherwise, every Avanti that had a rusty frame swapped would be a fraud since the serial tag is on the frame. The same with a Lark/Hawk that had a NOS door pillar installed.
                If you have a vin and body tag made for a car you do not own or was never built, that's fraud. The Jet thrust registry tracks cars that were scrapped so we won't see them suddenly reappear to prevent fraud.
                There are even companies that will even legally reproduce a lost serial tag if you have the title since they are not covered under the stricter federal VIN laws.

                JDP/Maryland
                64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
                64 GT R2
                63 GT R2
                63 Lark 2 door
                59 3E truck
                58 Starlight
                52 & 53 Starliner
                51 Commander

                JDP Maryland

                Comment


                • #9
                  We have discussed this before, but here it goes again. You can swap a serial tag or frame as part of a restoration as long as their is no intent to commit fraud. i.e. you have a good, valid title to a Speedster that has a rusty or damaged body or frame and you buy and install new or used parts to restore it, even a body or frame, that's a legal restoration. The Classic car guys will even build a new body from scratch for a high dollar car if another body is not available. If it were otherwise, every Avanti that had a rusty frame swapped would be a fraud since the serial tag is on the frame. The same with a Lark/Hawk that had a NOS door pillar installed.
                  If you have a vin and body tag made for a car you do not own or was never built, that's fraud. The Jet thrust registry tracks cars that were scrapped so we won't see them suddenly reappear to prevent fraud.
                  There are even companies that will even legally reproduce a lost serial tag if you have the title since they are not covered under the stricter federal VIN laws.

                  JDP/Maryland
                  64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
                  64 GT R2
                  63 GT R2
                  63 Lark 2 door
                  59 3E truck
                  58 Starlight
                  52 & 53 Starliner
                  51 Commander

                  JDP Maryland

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    What was done when a 1955 car body was wrecked in 1956, that still had nearly new running gear under it? We know Studebaker shipped complete body's from South Bend to Ca.. Would they ship one to a dealer?
                    Klif

                    55 Speedster
                    55 Speedster/Street Machine
                    63 Avanti R2
                    64 Convertible R1

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      What was done when a 1955 car body was wrecked in 1956, that still had nearly new running gear under it? We know Studebaker shipped complete body's from South Bend to Ca.. Would they ship one to a dealer?
                      Klif

                      55 Speedster
                      55 Speedster/Street Machine
                      63 Avanti R2
                      64 Convertible R1

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        quote:Originally posted by klifton1

                        What was done when a 1955 car body was wrecked in 1956, that still had nearly new running gear under it? We know Studebaker shipped complete body's from South Bend to Ca.. Would they ship one to a dealer?
                        Klif

                        55 Speedster
                        See my previous post about the Time Guide referring to 'Frame Swap'.
                        Obviously, indeed, they would. As well, there were some early fifties dealer flyers still advertising M-series cabs for sale after the 2R series was introduced.

                        Craig

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          quote:Originally posted by klifton1

                          What was done when a 1955 car body was wrecked in 1956, that still had nearly new running gear under it? We know Studebaker shipped complete body's from South Bend to Ca.. Would they ship one to a dealer?
                          Klif

                          55 Speedster
                          See my previous post about the Time Guide referring to 'Frame Swap'.
                          Obviously, indeed, they would. As well, there were some early fifties dealer flyers still advertising M-series cabs for sale after the 2R series was introduced.

                          Craig

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Complete body tubs were available and I recall leaving a NOS trimmed out M series cab at a dealers I bought out because no one would want it. They were supplied without the serial tag installed.

                            JDP/Maryland
                            64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
                            64 GT R2
                            63 GT R2
                            63 Lark 2 door
                            59 3E truck
                            58 Starlight
                            52 & 53 Starliner
                            51 Commander

                            JDP Maryland

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Complete body tubs were available and I recall leaving a NOS trimmed out M series cab at a dealers I bought out because no one would want it. They were supplied without the serial tag installed.

                              JDP/Maryland
                              64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
                              64 GT R2
                              63 GT R2
                              63 Lark 2 door
                              59 3E truck
                              58 Starlight
                              52 & 53 Starliner
                              51 Commander

                              JDP Maryland

                              Comment

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