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lstude
07-08-2007, 08:17 PM
I was cruising along in my 52 on my way to our club meet in the 98 degree and 90% humidity weather when I noticed that my temperature gauge was going toward the passenger side. then I noticed that my oil pressure gauge was going toward the drivers side. Then I heard an engine knock. I pulled off the interstate to let it cool down.

A couple in our club ("stewed" on this forum) stopped by to help. They went and got some water and when the engine cooled down I followed them to their house and left my car there.

I think I might have some serious engine trouble. :(

Not what I wanted to happen. I bought this engine off of eBay and the seller said that it had been rebuilt by an old Studebaker enthusiast who had died before he finished the 64 Hawk that it was in. The seller parted out the car and I bought the engine. My friend Tom, had noticed some things that we thought were not right. I guess I should have pulled the engine down and checked it out, but it was running so good until today.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/JulyMeetRogerHills7.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
07-08-2007, 08:23 PM
Not good, Leonard. Sorry. :(. Hopefully it's something simple. Keep us posted.



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
07-08-2007, 08:23 PM
Not good, Leonard. Sorry. :(. Hopefully it's something simple. Keep us posted.



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

41 Frank
07-08-2007, 08:30 PM
We're keeping our fingers crossed Leonard,is the engine making unusual noises?

41 Frank
07-08-2007, 08:30 PM
We're keeping our fingers crossed Leonard,is the engine making unusual noises?

lstude
07-08-2007, 08:33 PM
quote: We're keeping our fingers crossed Leonard,is the engine making unusual noises?

Yes, I drove it very slowly to Perk's house and I could hear the rod knock when I let off the gas but not when it was accelerating. When I was getting to his house it sounded like maybe something had come loose.


Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

lstude
07-08-2007, 08:33 PM
quote: We're keeping our fingers crossed Leonard,is the engine making unusual noises?

Yes, I drove it very slowly to Perk's house and I could hear the rod knock when I let off the gas but not when it was accelerating. When I was getting to his house it sounded like maybe something had come loose.


Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

mbstude
07-08-2007, 08:42 PM
Oh man, sorry to hear that Leonard.:( I hope it isn't anything too bad. I know you've done a lot of work to that car, and for this to happen, I'm sure you have to be sick. [xx(]

If worse comes to worse, maybe the engine in that GT Hawk will be OK. :)

Matthew Burnette
'59 Scotsman
'63 Daytona
Hazlehurst, GA

Cruising the Proving Ground Test Track
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/provingground2.jpg

mbstude
07-08-2007, 08:42 PM
Oh man, sorry to hear that Leonard.:( I hope it isn't anything too bad. I know you've done a lot of work to that car, and for this to happen, I'm sure you have to be sick. [xx(]

If worse comes to worse, maybe the engine in that GT Hawk will be OK. :)

Matthew Burnette
'59 Scotsman
'63 Daytona
Hazlehurst, GA

Cruising the Proving Ground Test Track
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/provingground2.jpg

lstude
07-08-2007, 08:47 PM
quote:If worse comes to worse, maybe the engine in that GT Hawk will be OK.

I have decided to let Bams have the GT Hawk. I just can't handle that right now and he wanted it bad.

I have two 259 engines, if this one is too far gone, but I hope it isn't.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

lstude
07-08-2007, 08:47 PM
quote:If worse comes to worse, maybe the engine in that GT Hawk will be OK.

I have decided to let Bams have the GT Hawk. I just can't handle that right now and he wanted it bad.

I have two 259 engines, if this one is too far gone, but I hope it isn't.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

ST2DE5
07-08-2007, 09:18 PM
I bought a engine one time that was supose to have benn overhauled. I decided I would look inside to be sure be for I installed it. The guy had done a good job but. He didn't torque anything. I found some connecting rod nuts to tight and some to loose. I guess he just wrenched everything. I torqued every nut and bolt and didn't have a problem with the motor

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s197/wagon56/MoparMeet2.jpg
7G-Q1 49 2R12 10G-F5 56B-D4 56B-F2
As soon as you find a product you like they will stop making it.

ST2DE5
07-08-2007, 09:18 PM
I bought a engine one time that was supose to have benn overhauled. I decided I would look inside to be sure be for I installed it. The guy had done a good job but. He didn't torque anything. I found some connecting rod nuts to tight and some to loose. I guess he just wrenched everything. I torqued every nut and bolt and didn't have a problem with the motor

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s197/wagon56/MoparMeet2.jpg
7G-Q1 49 2R12 10G-F5 56B-D4 56B-F2
As soon as you find a product you like they will stop making it.

go-studebaker
07-09-2007, 08:29 AM
Hi Leonard,
it sounds loike your motor is in deep do do.

You will have to pull it out and check it over.

It is a real bummer, but maybe something can be saved. Sometimes rebuilt motors sit for too long before being fired up. I always pull the pan and have a check of the lower end, and pull a few bearing caps off to see if things seem OK and check for end play in the crank.

Good luck. Its back into the garage for you..... Heaven...

Greg




Greg Diffen
Australian Stude nut living in Warwick, United Kingdom

1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 Dutch delivered
1937 Dicator sedan. Australian Body by TJ Richards
1939 Packard Seven Passenger monster UK delivered
1939 Commander Swiss Cabriolet by Lagenthal
1988 Avanti Convertible

go-studebaker
07-09-2007, 08:29 AM
Hi Leonard,
it sounds loike your motor is in deep do do.

You will have to pull it out and check it over.

It is a real bummer, but maybe something can be saved. Sometimes rebuilt motors sit for too long before being fired up. I always pull the pan and have a check of the lower end, and pull a few bearing caps off to see if things seem OK and check for end play in the crank.

Good luck. Its back into the garage for you..... Heaven...

Greg




Greg Diffen
Australian Stude nut living in Warwick, United Kingdom

1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 Dutch delivered
1937 Dicator sedan. Australian Body by TJ Richards
1939 Packard Seven Passenger monster UK delivered
1939 Commander Swiss Cabriolet by Lagenthal
1988 Avanti Convertible

curt
07-09-2007, 09:11 AM
I have had a car the PO had restored. I decided he never used a torque wrench. AL bolts mostly over torqued, other bolts too tight or way too loose. Heaven knows what the rods and crank bolts were 'wenched' to.

curt
07-09-2007, 09:11 AM
I have had a car the PO had restored. I decided he never used a torque wrench. AL bolts mostly over torqued, other bolts too tight or way too loose. Heaven knows what the rods and crank bolts were 'wenched' to.

stude53
07-09-2007, 09:49 AM
Sorry to hear it, Leonard.

Just think though, about the fun tour around the banked track at the Proving Grounds, and the Studebaker parade. At least you got to drive the 52 around Bouth Bend.

Hope it turns out to be a small problem.

[img=left]http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j259/stude53/studesmall2.jpg[/img=left]Bob Feaganes (stude53)
53 Starliner Hardtop
Newton Grove, NC

stude53
07-09-2007, 09:49 AM
Sorry to hear it, Leonard.

Just think though, about the fun tour around the banked track at the Proving Grounds, and the Studebaker parade. At least you got to drive the 52 around Bouth Bend.

Hope it turns out to be a small problem.

[img=left]http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j259/stude53/studesmall2.jpg[/img=left]Bob Feaganes (stude53)
53 Starliner Hardtop
Newton Grove, NC

studelark
07-09-2007, 10:42 AM
Leonard; I know what you're going through and you have my sympathies. Back in 2001, I had the engine in my newly acquired '60 Lark, with a blown engine, rebuilt by a friend of my son's who had built or overhauled a number of engines (mostly Chebbies) The price was right (cheap). After a rebuild with NOS parts, we put the engine back in the car and everything seemed fine in the several short runs I make here in Town. It sounded great. A local meet came up and I prepped the Lark for a Sunday run. I got exactly 13 miles when I stopped at an intersection. When the car stopped, the engine cut off and that was it. The engine was seized.

I took the engine to a professional machine shop owner, who not only built race engines, but numerous antique engines. When I took my engine to him, he had just finished a Lincoln V12 and a flathead Caddy from '46. He found:

> Two pistons put in backwards
> The Oil Pressure Relief Valve had never been removed and it was blocked.

With another rebuild with NOS parts, the engine runs well, can maintain 60-65 mph on the Interstate (overdrive) with no problem. I learned a hard lesson on this one- use a professional.

Frank Drumheller
Louisa, VA
'60 Lark Regal VI 4 door Sedan
'48 M16-52 Studebaker/Boyer fire truck

studelark
07-09-2007, 10:42 AM
Leonard; I know what you're going through and you have my sympathies. Back in 2001, I had the engine in my newly acquired '60 Lark, with a blown engine, rebuilt by a friend of my son's who had built or overhauled a number of engines (mostly Chebbies) The price was right (cheap). After a rebuild with NOS parts, we put the engine back in the car and everything seemed fine in the several short runs I make here in Town. It sounded great. A local meet came up and I prepped the Lark for a Sunday run. I got exactly 13 miles when I stopped at an intersection. When the car stopped, the engine cut off and that was it. The engine was seized.

I took the engine to a professional machine shop owner, who not only built race engines, but numerous antique engines. When I took my engine to him, he had just finished a Lincoln V12 and a flathead Caddy from '46. He found:

> Two pistons put in backwards
> The Oil Pressure Relief Valve had never been removed and it was blocked.

With another rebuild with NOS parts, the engine runs well, can maintain 60-65 mph on the Interstate (overdrive) with no problem. I learned a hard lesson on this one- use a professional.

Frank Drumheller
Louisa, VA
'60 Lark Regal VI 4 door Sedan
'48 M16-52 Studebaker/Boyer fire truck

Allan Songer
07-09-2007, 11:00 AM
"Use a Professional." Sage advice, indeed! Unless you assemble the engine yourself, ALWAYS use a trusted, professional engine builder.

When I was 16 years old I overhauled my first engine (1961 Chevy Bel Air with a 283). I was SOOOO careful--but STILL put the scraper rings in upside down. Can you say "cloud of smoke?" No harm done, but I did have to yank everything apart . . .

Allan Songer
07-09-2007, 11:00 AM
"Use a Professional." Sage advice, indeed! Unless you assemble the engine yourself, ALWAYS use a trusted, professional engine builder.

When I was 16 years old I overhauled my first engine (1961 Chevy Bel Air with a 283). I was SOOOO careful--but STILL put the scraper rings in upside down. Can you say "cloud of smoke?" No harm done, but I did have to yank everything apart . . .

Karl
07-09-2007, 02:41 PM
Sorry to hear about your bad luck.The only thing that sounded odd was . You heard the rods knock when you backed off the gas?? Normally they knock under a load..

63 Twin Supercharged Avanti
64 Avanti R3w/NOS
88LSC Avanti 350 Supercharged w/NOS

Karl
07-09-2007, 02:41 PM
Sorry to hear about your bad luck.The only thing that sounded odd was . You heard the rods knock when you backed off the gas?? Normally they knock under a load..

63 Twin Supercharged Avanti
64 Avanti R3w/NOS
88LSC Avanti 350 Supercharged w/NOS

Roscomacaw
07-09-2007, 02:51 PM
DANG! Leonard!!!:(

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

Roscomacaw
07-09-2007, 02:51 PM
DANG! Leonard!!!:(

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

showbizkid
07-09-2007, 04:19 PM
Sorry to hear this, Leonard. Hopefully the damage will be minimal and the correction easy.


[img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

Clark in San Diego
'63 F2/Lark Standard
http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

showbizkid
07-09-2007, 04:19 PM
Sorry to hear this, Leonard. Hopefully the damage will be minimal and the correction easy.


[img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

Clark in San Diego
'63 F2/Lark Standard
http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

lstude
07-09-2007, 04:31 PM
Thanks everyone, and Frank, I remember you telling that story, and I was thinking "I hope that never happens to me".

My car is still at Perk Wall's house. I am planing to go get it, and tow it home, tomorrow. Maybe it won't be 101 degrees like it is now. [xx(]

My friend, Tom Covington has gone to look at an Avanti that is set up as a race car, but when he gets back I hope he can come over and take a look at the engine.

I will keep everyone posted. Hope it is less that what I am thinking.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

lstude
07-09-2007, 04:31 PM
Thanks everyone, and Frank, I remember you telling that story, and I was thinking "I hope that never happens to me".

My car is still at Perk Wall's house. I am planing to go get it, and tow it home, tomorrow. Maybe it won't be 101 degrees like it is now. [xx(]

My friend, Tom Covington has gone to look at an Avanti that is set up as a race car, but when he gets back I hope he can come over and take a look at the engine.

I will keep everyone posted. Hope it is less that what I am thinking.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/Mein64DaytonaatBradfieldssm2.jpghttp://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/AlmostreadyforSB6-4.jpg

Lenny R2
07-09-2007, 09:59 PM
Sorry to hear about your engine Leonard.Hope everything will
work out ok.

Lenny
Atlanta Ga.

Lenny R2
07-09-2007, 09:59 PM
Sorry to hear about your engine Leonard.Hope everything will
work out ok.

Lenny
Atlanta Ga.

N8N
07-15-2007, 02:06 PM
"true confessions" time... about 6 or 7 years ago Michele had (actually still has) a VW Corrado G60; VW used some newfangled material/construction for the rod bearings for the G60 engine and apparently they didn't work out so well in the real world. It did exactly what Leonard described; just a light rattle on overrun but not under load. I replaced the rod bearing shells with standard size shells for a regular VW 4-cyl. in my garage (yes, I had a garage back then) and it was fine after that. I also used ARP rod bolts as the factory ones were TTY and obviously did not have the rods rebored like you're supposed to when changing bolts... I just hosed everything down good with brakleen, slapped it back together, and it has been more or less happily running ever since. just an example of when doing things the "wrong way" actually can work out.

Of course, the Corrado is nonfunctional now, but not because of the rod bearings. I think the Woodruff key in the crank is sheared, but I haven't had time to pull the front of the engine apart because all of my vehicles seem to require little attentions every time I think I have free time to work on it.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

N8N
07-15-2007, 02:06 PM
"true confessions" time... about 6 or 7 years ago Michele had (actually still has) a VW Corrado G60; VW used some newfangled material/construction for the rod bearings for the G60 engine and apparently they didn't work out so well in the real world. It did exactly what Leonard described; just a light rattle on overrun but not under load. I replaced the rod bearing shells with standard size shells for a regular VW 4-cyl. in my garage (yes, I had a garage back then) and it was fine after that. I also used ARP rod bolts as the factory ones were TTY and obviously did not have the rods rebored like you're supposed to when changing bolts... I just hosed everything down good with brakleen, slapped it back together, and it has been more or less happily running ever since. just an example of when doing things the "wrong way" actually can work out.

Of course, the Corrado is nonfunctional now, but not because of the rod bearings. I think the Woodruff key in the crank is sheared, but I haven't had time to pull the front of the engine apart because all of my vehicles seem to require little attentions every time I think I have free time to work on it.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Guido
07-15-2007, 02:08 PM
Off to go help Leonard pull the transmission from the '52. I will have him post an update.

[Update] The transmission is out, radiator is out and Leonard is going to pull the engine now. He said he did a compression check on the engine this morning and the highest reading he got was 110. This is on a R1, so it appears it may not have been rebuilt as claimed. He will post more later tonight.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/53/453/1/21/36/2964121360097493054pVJTFL_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/57/757/2/88/4/2023288040097493054SEKowB_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/18/19/8/37/21/2050837210097493054IYBJJL_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/59/559/1/43/57/2876143570097493054jKVhDw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/22/22/0/2/68/2589002680097493054ftBuBw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/8/30/30/2075830300097493054aSSlFv_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/59/459/2/23/86/2067223860097493054YoeGMx_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/5/18/33/2537518330097493054OgEKcN_th.jpg
Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

Studebaker horse drawn doctor’s buggy; Studebaker horse drawn “Izzer” buggy; 1946 M-16 fire truck; 1948 M-16 grain truck; 1949 2R17A fire truck; 1950 2R5 pickup; 1952 2R17A grain truck; 1952 Packard 200 4 door; 1955 E-38 grain truck; 1957 3E-40 flatbed; 1961 6E-28 grain truck; 1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck; 1962 7E-7 Champ pickup; 1962 GT Hawk 4 speed; 1963 8E-28 flatbed; 1964 Avanti R2 4 speed; 1964 Cruiser and various other "treasures" (including a 1959 IH B-120 4 wheel drive and numerous Oliver and Cockshutt tractors).

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

Guido
07-15-2007, 02:08 PM
Off to go help Leonard pull the transmission from the '52. I will have him post an update.

[Update] The transmission is out, radiator is out and Leonard is going to pull the engine now. He said he did a compression check on the engine this morning and the highest reading he got was 110. This is on a R1, so it appears it may not have been rebuilt as claimed. He will post more later tonight.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/53/453/1/21/36/2964121360097493054pVJTFL_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/57/757/2/88/4/2023288040097493054SEKowB_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/18/19/8/37/21/2050837210097493054IYBJJL_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/59/559/1/43/57/2876143570097493054jKVhDw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/22/22/0/2/68/2589002680097493054ftBuBw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/8/30/30/2075830300097493054aSSlFv_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/59/459/2/23/86/2067223860097493054YoeGMx_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/5/18/33/2537518330097493054OgEKcN_th.jpg
Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

Studebaker horse drawn doctor’s buggy; Studebaker horse drawn “Izzer” buggy; 1946 M-16 fire truck; 1948 M-16 grain truck; 1949 2R17A fire truck; 1950 2R5 pickup; 1952 2R17A grain truck; 1952 Packard 200 4 door; 1955 E-38 grain truck; 1957 3E-40 flatbed; 1961 6E-28 grain truck; 1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck; 1962 7E-7 Champ pickup; 1962 GT Hawk 4 speed; 1963 8E-28 flatbed; 1964 Avanti R2 4 speed; 1964 Cruiser and various other "treasures" (including a 1959 IH B-120 4 wheel drive and numerous Oliver and Cockshutt tractors).

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.