Other: Zinc etc

[drnittler]

I know this has been done a million times before, but are there auto store, on the shelf, additives that have the needed zink?
I have use ZDDP, purchased from SI, but with shipping that adds up with shipping.
I am the guy who has the leaky Lark, and do not want to waist my ZDDP if it leaks out.
I looked for Shell Rotella T 15w40 but nobody seems to sell it unless you buy a gallon.
Any suggestions are welcome.
Thanks.

[Gunslinger]

Add a container of STP...it has ZDDP in it. You can buy GM's EOS from dealer's parts department. The parts manager at a local GM dealer told me that EOS is really nothing more than GM's own brand of STP. If you can find it, the red container STP for 4-cylinder engines has double the ZDDP the blue container does.

From all that I've read on the subject...there's lots of good and bad information out there about it and determining what's right is not easy. It seems that the issue may well be overblown...it seems to be high performance flat-tappet engines with high valve spring pressures that are at the most risk...and even then, mostly during break-in. Other cars are doing just fine or we'd be seeing lots of cars wiping cams and that's not happening. There was also a lot of substandard camshaft blanks and lifters coming in from offshore suppliers several years back and the failures were being blamed on the oil and/or poor assembly and break-in techniques.

[Son O Lark]

Lucas Oil has a break-in engine additive with zinc. It's available at Advance, probably at Auto-Zone too.

[Tom Bredehoft]

I looked for Shell Rotella T 15w40 but nobody seems to sell it unless you buy a gallon.

I bought 5 gallons, With consumption of a quart every 250-300 miles, I can just keep filling the crankcase, drain it every 2000, and know I've got plenty of ZDDP all the time. Then, too, that's only 3 oil changes, with two V8's I'll need another 5 gallons soon.

[E. Davis]

I could be wrong (often am) but its my understanding the current Shell Rotella 15/40 on the shelves does not contain zddp. You can go to your local NAPA store and buy 10/30 or 20/50 valvoline racing oil that contains the right amount of zddp. You might have to ask for the 10/30 because they don't always display it .

[Kurt]

Just use Valvoline VR1. plenty of zddp, no mixing, and easy to find.

[JohnM15]

I can't find VR1 on the shelves, my wife bought me 12 quarts over the Internets for Christmas though. I have not tried but I think I can order VR1 for $8.99 at Advance Auto on the internets and pick up at the local store. Saves shipping and no need to use additive...

[drnittler]

Thanks one and all. Are these products available at parts stores?

[JohnM15]

The wife just told me that she bought it from Amazon, $63.39 for 12 quarts:

http://www.amazon.com/Valvoline-VV20...7708086&sr=8-1

[wittsend]

"I am the guy who has the leaky Lark, and do not want to waist (waste) my ZDDP if it leaks out.
I looked for Shell Rotella T 15w40 but nobody seems to sell it unless you buy a gallon."

Not trying to be obnoxious, but why would a guy who admittedly leaks oil be concern because the oil he wants is only sold in gallons?

I'm on a number of (different) car forums and I don't think anyone ever comes to a consensus on ZDDP. Part of recommendations seem to be based on past history of a product, wives tales, hope etc.. It would be SO nice if substantiated (and up to date) information was readily available. Otherwise I too am buying based on "past history of a product, wives tales, hope etc.."

Tom

[avantilover]

With respect David, why not just identify and fix the leaky parts then you save money in the long term?

[drnittler]

I thought the leaks were fixed when the engine was rebuilt by a professional. For the first 2500 miles they were. Then the leaks came back. Some of the bolts seem to work a bit loose or the gasket shrinks, or something. Anyway when I loose oil I loose zink. I rather solve the leak problems. Thanks

[Bud]

I recently checked both the Shell and Chevron websites product data sheets and both Rotella 15w-40 and the Delo 400LE 15w-40 have the necessary amounts of ZDDP for use in the older flat tappet cam engines. I use Chevron Delo 400 in both my 62 Hawk and my 63 Avanti because I can get it at Costco for a good price. I also called their technical reps. and asked about their oils and they both said that their diesel rated oils are fine for the older gas engines. I also asked about adding additives to the oil and both reps recommended against doing it as the additive packs in the oil could be compromised by the use of addives. Bud

[JoeHall]

"It would be SO nice if substantiated (and up to date) information was readily available. Otherwise I too am buying based on "past history of a product, wives tales, hope etc.."

Tom[/QUOTE]

I am rebuilding a 289, back to stock specs, and will likely have it in the car and running next month. By summer it will hopefully have a few thousand miles on it. I have already bought the WalMart oil, and plan to break it in with their 10W30 "Super Tech". After break in, will switch to Mobil 1 15W50 and change oil every 10,000 miles as I have always done on other Studes. Other than the assembly lube used in reassembly, there will not be and zinc, ZDDP, snake oil, or whatever used during break in or later.

Anyone care to bet on the issue about ZDDP? I am willing to bet it will be just fine without it.

[Gunslinger]

Anyone care to bet on the issue about ZDDP? I am willing to bet it will be just fine without it.

My own conclusion is that the perceived problem is overblown. Kind of like back in the '70s when unleaded fuel was mandated...everyone was bombarded with dire predictions of valve failure without hardened valve seats or lead substitute lubricants added. Many thousands of cars have been driven millions of miles without problems. For those that did have problems that were blamed on unleaded fuel may actually have had other wear issues and a history of poor maintenance.

The issue of reduced ZDDP occurred about the same time as substandard camshaft blanks and cam lifters were coming in from offshore suppliers...a lot of cam and lifter failures occurred and were blamed either completely or partially on the reduced ZDDP levels. While the cam and lifter problems have been resolved (some may still be sitting on dealer shelves somewhere), the controversy of oils with reduced ZDDP is still ongoing.

Most cam failures will occur during break-in. If the cam is installed and broken in properly, the potential of failure due to reduced ZDDP is reduced to almost non-existant...in all flat-tappet engines other than high-performance versions with high valve spring pressures. That's where the potential for failure is, and even then not all that likely.

Reduced ZDDP oils have been a way of life for some time now. If the danger was so bad, why are so many Studebaker as well as millions of other older design, flat-tappet engines not wiping cams on a historic basis? All these old cars seem to running just fine. When they do go bad, it's much more likely due to years of wear and tear...they're simply worn out.

For me...I have two cars with flat-tappet engines...a '69 Corvette 427 and a '70 Avanti with a GM Performance crate engine. I do add STP (as I have been doing for my cars for over forty years) and have never had a problem. STP is inexpensive and gives me peace of mind...whether the problem is overblown or not.