Engine: Starter Idea

[kmac530]

Well I have been looking for starter rebuilders here in So Cal and not having the best of fortune. I am sure they are here, but my searches have only found them far enough away that I would have to ship my starter out. With shipping and the cost of rebuilding, especially since I think it is an internal winding issue in the armature, I am looking at $200 + and then still only having a 6V starter that I could end up burning out again. After a week of banging my head on the wall and seeing others creative maching work...ding, light bulb idea.

I ordered on of these...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150660923137&ssPageName=ADME:X:AAQ:MOTORS:1123

It has a 9 tooth gear that works with the 153 tooth gear we have on Studes. My idea is to take a piece of 1/8" thick plate aluminum and using a 2 hole saws make a collar with an outside diameter of 3.5", that is the size of the neck on my stock starter that fits into the trans bell housing, and an inner hole diameter of 1.25" to fit comfortably around the gear. Then after carefully centering it around the gear drill and tap thru the ring and into the flat aluminum face of the new starter, counter sinking the collar, and using 2 allen head tappered head bolt to attach the collar so that the starter will now be centered in the bell house.

To bolt it up to the trans I may have to trim some of the big aluminum face of the starter to get it to sit flat on the engine/ trans. Then once it is fit flat and clocked ok, clamp it into place and with the solenoid removed, extend the gear drive and make sure the interface with the ring gear is ok, not too loose and not too tight, then shoot a quick shot of paint in to the mount bolt holes on the back side of the trans. Pull starter and drill holes thru the center of those paint marks, 2 bolts, and start my engine with a strong cranking high performance, readily available, 12V starter....

What do you guys think? If it works I will try to post pics so others can use the idea.

If there is an interference issue with the ring gear, before drilling the bolt holes, I will drill and countersink slightly different offset holes in the collar to get the gear set to the right lash between the ring gear interface.

[gordr]

That might work. Not sure of the pinion compatibility. Ring gear tooth count isn't everything. Ring gear diameter is important, too. 153 teeth on a 14" ring gear will necessarily have a different pitch than on a 16" ring gear.

This is for a truck engine, right?

Auto electric shops that could do starters used to be thick on the ground. Are there any small agricultural towns near you? Most farming towns would have a shop like that. Maybe check with your local airport or ag equipment dealer and ask where they send their their starter work.

What you propose might work, but without knowing tooth pitch compatibility and pinion extension, it's hard to know for sure. You might have to take the thick machined plate off the starter and substitute one of your own making. Please document what you you do and write it up so that others can benefit.

[kmac530]

In the tech talk section of this board I asked about that ring gear size and Alan insist that the chevy 153 tooth ring gear is the same, or close enough to the Stude to interchange starter gears.
I have my work cut out for sure, but I think it will work out. I do not own a lathe or mill, but I have a great friend who does, so I think I can make something work.

BTW no on the truck engine. It is in my '52 2R10, but it has a '52 Commander 232 v8 in it.

I made a template from the nose cone of my OE starter to use as a guide for the new starter fitment.

I will photo document and describe my process if it works, and if not I will post that it will not and do it with my tail between my legs and only out $77.00 bucks including shipping..not life or death.

[kmac530]

OOps, forgot, as too finding a starter rebuild shop, California is one of the hardest places to do business now days and alot of these small type of shops are just gone. Land and rent in Ca. is crazy high and we have so many regulating authorities here, EPA, CARB, local interest groups......
many of these kinds of places have just gone elsewhere or closed shop. I have asked at a few automotive shops and AP stores and noboby knows of any with 100 or so miles.

I am not saying there are none here, just none I have found. If I have to ship it, you are talking $20ish each way and somewhere between $100 minimum to $200ish and then I still have a 6v starter and I am going 12V. Just seems to me that if I can make this work with a few hours of machine work and a bit of creativity, I will have a better starter that is much more readily available for future replacement if neccesary.

We shall see.

[Warren Webb]

Kelly, I remember having some work done in Lomita (Lomita Electric maybe?) I'll have to look & see if I still have a yellow pages for there. If so, you could ship it in one of the post office boxes that are good for up to 70#. I might be going to the south bay on thursday. If I do, I could take the starter there & drop it off & maybe they could even have it done by the time I'm ready to come back. Call me.

[Warren Webb]

Astro Auto Electric
310-325-1777

[Alan]

You will have to remember that there were 2 different flywheels, early and late. Which are different sizes. Then there are 3 different bellhousings. Early, late and truck. You have to use the right parts or there will be problems.

[kmac530]

Alan: This is a cut and paste from your post on the "starter issue" thread I had when I was trying to fix my original starter...

"Just the common SBC starter then grab a chunk of aluminum 5" in diam. and 3/4" thick and whittle away. Will have to dig up some pics. Couldn't find any in my photo bucket account"
"153 and 168 tooth flywheels. The ring is the same size as a 153. "
"It will work."

I was really under the impression that the GM 153 and 168 tooth starter would work with the Stude flywheel. It is a '52 Commander 232 witha 3 speed OD trans. Either way only $77.00 to give it a shot.

[kurtruk]

If this were in the Technical Help section you might get more help. Anyway...

Not all Studebaker V-8 starters are the same. The nose length varies. Either a past Thread or one of the websites pictured all the differences. Try Bob Johnstone's website or Chuck Collins website. HTH

[kmac530]

If this were in the Technical Help section you might get more help. Anyway...

Not all Studebaker V-8 starters are the same. The nose length varies. Either a past Thread or one of the websites pictured all the differences. Try Bob Johnstone's website or Chuck Collins website. HTH

This didnt start out as, nor was it intended as, a tech thread. Just throwing out an attempt to try something different and letting folks know I will document if it works.

Side bar; the tech page forum has felt like a thread killer for me. Maybe because I am not a club member yet, still just too broke to spend on any extras right now. Soon as my boat sells, Im in.
:edit:
Just joined. The wife said the mag alone is worth the $24 new member price. She knows I need alot of stuff and I convinced her that I may get good deals from the mag and membership. I have been spending alot of coin lately on different stuff so I didnt want to tick her off. We make most money decisions together, but I pick my battles, this one was no sweat.

[Alan]

The different nose depths are for Auto or Stick. You can compensate for that by using different thickness plates. And I thought I was the only one that had to fight with my old lady to buy anything.

[kmac530]

Hahaha

Not fighting per say....just DEEP discussion. LOL.
I used to live by the motto- "it's easier to ask for forgiveness than permission", but as I have aged and tried to mature {I am failing at that, but trying} now I usually discuss purchases. Although I did not ask to buy the truck when I bought it....hmmm, just when I thought I was doing better.

[Kdancy]

Seems like the 6 volt and 12 volt ring gears are different. Or is it just the starter gear?

[kmac530]

Astro Auto Electric
310-325-1777

Hey Warren, my Brother, thanks for the number and the offer to drop off. I am gonna give this SBC mini a chance and if that does not look good, I will be calling Astro. My wife goes down to Carson to visit her mom every 2 weeks or so, but I may take you up on the offer If that does not work. I need to get down there and visit my dad, he is just really not doing well with this knee replacement. He is just not big ol Lyle anymore. Im worried about him.