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View Full Version : Body: recommendation for Mig solid wire size for Stude floor and rocker panels?



bsrosell
08-12-2011, 09:17 PM
Hi,
just tried my new Mig welder for the first time. Got a roll of 0.030 solid wire (use gas with it) when I bought it. Looking at the instruction manual, could go with either the .030" or .023" wire, and wondering which you experienced welders would recommend for the ~18 gauge (0.045") Classic replacement panels (and thinner, original panels; I'm measuring about 0.35-0.040" thick).
My first trials with my Mig were not pretty, and I know it will take some practice, but wondering if the thinner (0.023") wire would help too? I'm on the low end of power and wire-speed either way...
Thanks!!
Barry

sweetolbob
08-12-2011, 09:30 PM
Hi,
just tried my new Mig welder for the first time. Got a roll of 0.030 solid wire (use gas with it) when I bought it. Looking at the instruction manual, could go with either the .030" or .023" wire, and wondering which you experienced welders would recommend for the ~18 gauge (0.045") Classic replacement panels (and thinner, original panels; I'm measuring about 0.35-0.040" thick).
My first trials with my Mig were not pretty, and I know it will take some practice, but wondering if the thinner (0.023") wire would help too? I'm on the low end of power and wire-speed either way...
Thanks!!
Barry

Barry

You have answered your own question. Use the 0.023 and your welds will improve. You will need to practice on a new piece of metal the same thickness as the piece you are welding to get correct heat and feed. Your's is infinitely variable I hope. Also leave a slight gap, about than 0.023, between the panels.

You may be suprised to find the heat and feed may be higher than you first start at.

Bob

bsrosell
08-12-2011, 10:08 PM
thanks Bob, I did pick up a spool of 0.023 tonight, but thought I'd double-check on the forum before opening it, in case 0.030 is ideal....
I have an old beatup Stude deck lid to practice on, simply cutting strips with my zip tool and then trying to weld them back together again. Sure looks easier when you watch someone who knows what they are doing. :-) Time to practice, practice, practice...

DEEPNHOCK
08-12-2011, 10:19 PM
Go to your welding gas/welding supply company and ask him for a spool of 'soft' wire and a combo gas mix.
Tell him what you are doing, and trust his judgement.
Welding wire from places like Lowe's and Tractor supply tend to be pretty hard wire.
This will make your welds harder and make it harder to grind smooth.
HTIH
Jeff:cool:

sweetolbob
08-12-2011, 10:28 PM
thanks Bob, I did pick up a spool of 0.023 tonight, but thought I'd double-check on the forum before opening it, in case 0.030 is ideal....
I have an old beatup Stude deck lid to practice on, simply cutting strips with my zip tool and then trying to weld them back together again. Sure looks easier when you watch someone who knows what they are doing. :-) Time to practice, practice, practice...

Barry

Another thought, the best purchase I made 25 years ago was an Auto-darkening welding helmet. I hope you also have one of them. It makes welding thin metal so much easier, as I can more accurately see where I want the wire to hit. If you have one, great, otherwise HF has decent ones but I use a Speedglas that's 25 years old.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised at how quickly you will pick it up and be sure to start on horizontal welds first. Vertical is not bad but overhead takes a lot of practice. I always try to reduce the overheads by moving the parts I'm welding.

Bob

GTCruiser
08-13-2011, 07:52 AM
Am about to do the same welding (floors and bottom of fenders) on a '63 Champ, after some practice. This will be my first welding. Have a new MIG 135 from Eastwood and this informaion was helpful. Thanks

JohnM15
08-13-2011, 08:11 AM
I am experienced in gas welding and some arc welding but have not MIG or TIG welding and plan to in the future. These posts are priceless. I have also seen some Youtube videos that help you to learn. I'm on the fence as to which to purchase, MIG or TIG. HB has a small TIG/ARC machine that has good reviews. It's just missing foot pedal control but I did find on the Internets a way of modifying it for a pedal. My big problem with welding currently is the goggles. It is nearly impossible to wear them and have my glasses situated correctly to keep things in focus. I have not checked, do they have prescription goggles?

The other problem I have is that the closest 220 outlet to the work I do in the garage to be 100'. I suspect that I would have to make a fairly hefty extension cord for that to work without too much IR drop.

jclary
08-13-2011, 09:12 AM
OK, since you are admitting to being a novice, don't be insulted by this suggestion. (My military experience taught me not to be offended when instructions treated me as if I were a two-year old needing instructions for operating a spoon.)

Be sure to match your tip to the wire diameter you select. Some welders may also require you to change "feed rollers" to the wire diameter as well. Another adjustment you might want some help on is to get the correct setting for your gas regulator. If you are welding inside, it will be constant. If you are working outside on a windy day, it will probably need a little more. I have a small Lincoln bench top wire feed. It was not intended for high volume work and I had to replace the OEM gun and hose assembly for better performance.

As you gain experience, you will find that your "weld grinding" requirements will diminish. Good luck, and good welding!:cool:

1954khardtop
08-13-2011, 10:18 AM
I had experience with stick welding before buying a mig, so I was used to "dragging" the wire ahead of the weld. I was having trouble with the mig at first. A buddy who's a professional welder advised me to "push" when using the mig. It seems to work much better. I think I was pulling the gas shield away from the puddle. Tilting the torch towards the seam and pushing keeps the gas over the puddle.

gordr
08-13-2011, 10:37 AM
The smaller hobbyist-type MIG and TIG machines typically plug into a 120 volt outlet. But you do need a good, heavy extension cord. I built a "hybrid" cord for my welding work. It's about sixty feet of #10 x 3 conductor rubber-covered wire. Plugs into a 220 outlet. On the other end, I have a quad box with a 220 outlet on one side, and a duplex 120 outlet on the other. Each half of the duplex outlet uses one half of the 220 circuit from the source outlet. This has served me well for years. The MIG can be run off the 120 power, also a grinder. I use the 220 power for my buzz box stick welder.

I have a couple of other heavy-duty extension cords for use away from my regular work area. I bought all the heavy-duty wire at swap meets over the years.

An under-sized extension cord (or bad wire run to an outlet) will give you lousy performance with the MIG, as voltage regulation will be poor. It becomes nearly impossible to maintain a steady arc.

bezhawk
08-14-2011, 08:58 AM
The current required to melt the .030 wire is,of course, much more than the .023 wire. Sometimes this is too high to weld thin sheet metal. (especially if it is further thinned by rust).
You mentioned prescription goggles....NEVER arc weld without fully covering exposed skin. The arc is a powerful ultraviolet light that will cause severe sunburn, and of course, you need the proper eye protection. You can wear glasses under your full face shield.

Chucks Stude
08-14-2011, 10:18 AM
I saw the other day, that there is a wireless foot feed available for a tig machine. Looks like it would help to get that wire out of the way.

GEEMAC
08-14-2011, 11:16 AM
By using .023 wire you will find out that you can use ahigher heat & faster speed and make better welds, this is after you become comfortable in useing the Mig.Mac

junior
08-14-2011, 12:25 PM
My big problem with welding currently is the goggles. It is nearly impossible to wear them and have my glasses situated correctly to keep things in focus. I have not checked, do they have prescription goggles?
.

My glasses are progressive, and fairly new to me...I have had a lot of difficulty using them to weld with, because to focus on the weld I have to tilt my head head in such a position that my welding helmet blocks my view. What I found that works for me is to replace my glasses with cheap pair of dime-store reading glasses, that way everything in field of vision under the welding helmet is in constant focus. Works for me, and at a minimal cost, plus there is no way I'm going to scratch or otherwise damage my prescription glasses. Junior

bsrosell
08-14-2011, 03:00 PM
Barry

Another thought, the best purchase I made 25 years ago was an Auto-darkening welding helmet. I hope you also have one of them. It makes welding thin metal so much easier, as I can more accurately see where I want the wire to hit. If you have one, great, otherwise HF has decent ones but I use a Speedglas that's 25 years old.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised at how quickly you will pick it up and be sure to start on horizontal welds first. Vertical is not bad but overhead takes a lot of practice. I always try to reduce the overheads by moving the parts I'm welding.

Bob

funny you should mention this Bob, I work for 3M, and know we make a very good (professional grade) auto-darkening helmet. I asked my next door neighbor, who I knew worked for that division of 3M and asked if he knew anyone I could talk to about getting a "scratch and dent" for test model or something, as they are NOT cheap. He said, 'your're talking to the right guy, I'm the tech service engineer for the welding helmets; what color do you want?" :-) Dropped one off after a trade show a few weeks later. After trying it for the first time this weekend, I know you what you mean, its GREAT to be able to see immediately prior to pulling the trigger.... Don't know how you'd do it without an 'auto-darkening'.....

bsrosell
08-14-2011, 03:02 PM
The smaller hobbyist-type MIG and TIG machines typically plug into a 120 volt outlet. But you do need a good, heavy extension cord. I built a "hybrid" cord for my welding work. It's about sixty feet of #10 x 3 conductor rubber-covered wire. Plugs into a 220 outlet. On the other end, I have a quad box with a 220 outlet on one side, and a duplex 120 outlet on the other. Each half of the duplex outlet uses one half of the 220 circuit from the source outlet. This has served me well for years. The MIG can be run off the 120 power, also a grinder. I use the 220 power for my buzz box stick welder.

I have a couple of other heavy-duty extension cords for use away from my regular work area. I bought all the heavy-duty wire at swap meets over the years.

An under-sized extension cord (or bad wire run to an outlet) will give you lousy performance with the MIG, as voltage regulation will be poor. It becomes nearly impossible to maintain a steady arc.

Good advice Gord; I plugged it in first using a heavy (12 gauge!) extension cord; it ran for awhile, then popped my GFI in the shop. Plugged it in directly to an outlet, no more problems.
But, when I actually start using it and not 'playing' at the bench, I'll need to do something for an extension. Making my own might be the ticket. thanks.

bsrosell
08-14-2011, 03:09 PM
OK, since you are admitting to being a novice, don't be insulted by this suggestion. (My military experience taught me not to be offended when instructions treated me as if I were a two-year old needing instructions for operating a spoon.)

Be sure to match your tip to the wire diameter you select. Some welders may also require you to change "feed rollers" to the wire diameter as well. Another adjustment you might want some help on is to get the correct setting for your gas regulator. If you are welding inside, it will be constant. If you are working outside on a windy day, it will probably need a little more. I have a small Lincoln bench top wire feed. It was not intended for high volume work and I had to replace the OEM gun and hose assembly for better performance.

As you gain experience, you will find that your "weld grinding" requirements will diminish. Good luck, and good welding!:cool:

Thanks! In this case, operating a spoon for the first time isn't too far off. :-) My Hobart is set up to accept either the 023-025, or the 030, simply by reversing the feed reel. So I think the tip ok for both too, but I'll double check when I swap out the wire and see if there is an extra tip for the smaller wire.
I found only one reference to the gas setting in the Hobart manual, recommending 20psi unless wire manufacturer specified differently, and I see nothing about gas settings on my wire
spools. Does that sound right?
Thanks to all the rest of you with your replies, too. Much appreciated.

silverhawk1958
08-14-2011, 07:16 PM
I have a hobart as well (from before they were bought out), and you have to change the tip with the wire size, but your right, the feed reals will just need to be flipped. At least on mine.

1954khardtop
08-14-2011, 08:47 PM
20 psi would be a good starting point. As John C mentioned on an earlier post, any breeze will require higher gas pressure. A strong wind will give you fits. I bought several welding blankets and curtains to allow me to safetly weld inside on windy days.

bsrosell
08-14-2011, 10:13 PM
fortunately, am able to do all this in my shop, so one less variable (wind). Been watching U-tube videos all night, helpful, but obviously is a skill earned by practice. One thing I noticed is that all of the demos show butt-splices, where-as I was planning on over-lap splicing my floor panels and rockers (where possible anyway? maybe can't with the rockers, they'll get too high?)
Had not thought about it until now, but if you overlap, and well on top, do you ALSO go under the car and weld the OTHER side? (yes, I know I need to use welding primer, thanks to a helpful tip in an earlier post reply) Or is tha where dum-dum comes into play?
I don't know, watching all these guys do perfect butt splices makes me consider trying it even for my floor panels, but if my welds are not really good, someone's feet (mine?) might go through the floor unexpectedly while driving down the road one day. :- ) At least that rear foot well was an overlap even from the factory (w/ spot welds I suppose? ) I'll probably start with that one, go with the easy parts first.
Another weekend gone without touching the car. Sigh. But the price you pay for being determined to do it yourself I guess. Have to spend some time in "school" for a few days and nights first. Oh, silverhawk58, I checked and my Hobart (new last Fall, owned by Miller now) does NOT have more than one tip, only indicates flipping the feed reel for the thinner 023 wire, so I guess my one and only tip is what I've got for either. CORRECTION for future readers. I DID discover my Hobart 140 requires a 0.023 tip when using 0.023 wire, it just was not obvious to me in the manual. Thanks Silverhawk58 !!!! Who knows how long before I would have figured that out!!!!!

sweetolbob
08-14-2011, 11:04 PM
fortunately, am able to do all this in my shop, so one less variable (wind). Been watching U-tube videos all night, helpful, but obviously is a skill earned by practice. One thing I noticed is that all of the demos show butt-splices, where-as I was planning on over-lap splicing my floor panels and rockers (where possible anyway? maybe can't with the rockers, they'll get too high?)
Had not thought about it until now, but if you overlap, and well on top, do you ALSO go under the car and weld the OTHER side? (yes, I know I need to use welding primer, thanks to a helpful tip in an earlier post reply) Or is tha where dum-dum comes into play?
I don't know, watching all these guys do perfect butt splices makes me consider trying it even for my floor panels, but if my welds are not really good, someone's feet (mine?) might go through the floor unexpectedly while driving down the road one day. :- ) At least that rear foot well was an overlap even from the factory (w/ spot welds I suppose? ) I'll probably start with that one, go with the easy parts first.
Another weekend gone without touching the car. Sigh. But the price you pay for being determined to do it yourself I guess. Have to spend some time in "school" for a few days and nights first. Oh, silverhawk58, I checked and my Hobart (new last Fall, owned by Miller now) does NOT have more than one tip, only indicates flipping the feed reel for the thinner 023 wire, so I guess my one and only tip is what I've got for either.

The butt splices are quite easy to do and the only way I will do any floors. I'm an amateur that learned the way you are about to. Just take some clean metal and practice. You'll be surprised how quick you will pickup on the art. If it is tough, sign up for course at the local skill center/ college. The overlap maybe easier at the start but it leaves joints that can rust, and worse yet, they are impossible to do any decent body work on with a hammer and dolly.

Any store, like TSC, or any weld store handles the correct tips for your welder. Most use Tweco type tips and 0.023 is the most common size. Remember the tip is the contact with the wire and you want it as close to the wire size as possible.

JMAO

Bob

jclary
08-14-2011, 11:17 PM
Barry, allow me to first state a small disclaimer before you put too much stock in my opinion. Although my degree is in psychology, I spent a career selling industrial tooling. Painting equipment, pumps, air logic, air tools, industrial ovens, automated systems, etc. My welding, and body work experience was mostly learned in my back yard using many of the tools I sold. I figured that if I was going to sell the stuff, I might as well learn how to use it myself.

Since you are in Mn. where winters are pretty severe and roads get the salt treatment, I understand your concern about repairs. However, I don't think you should get too worked up about doing it "perfect" because that will drive you nuts. Rather, I suggest that you do what common sense allows and as your "comfort level" dictates. Butt welds are great for cosmetic areas like lower door skins and rocker panels. Even then, there are tools that will alow you to flange a panel for an overlapped butt weld. However, the floors will be covered and are a great area for learning. You will find places that were overlapped from the factory. You can do both. Sometimes you may want to pop rivet a piece in place and then follow with welds, Even screws for holding a patch in place will work until you get it welded. The key is how you protect it once the welding is finished. Make sure you clean the metal of rust and then you can seal it with a good epoxy primer, followed by a good modern under coating that will keep its flexibility and not dry out and crack like the original stuff they used to use.

I have used combinations of all the above. Some of my repairs are over twenty years old and I have not fallen through the floor yet. Of course, none of my cars have spent a winter in Minnesota either!

Just don't allow yourself to become immobilized with worry. Instead, wear yourself out working away, then, you'll have little trouble falling asleep at night.:):cool::)

Ray Stewart
08-15-2011, 08:56 AM
Cherokee Industries of Ord, Nebraska manufactures the "Accu-strike" welding helmet which has a chin strap which operates the welding lense. Open your mouth slightly and you are looking through clear lense, position your wire (tungsten), close your mouth and now you are looking through welding lense. I run a small custom stainless steel shop and, on assembly, make hundreds of tacks fitting parts. Best helmet ever made! At home, on the Studes, I use tig, butt weld, and have a thumb control on the tig torch (tried the foot control but so often you are in a spot where the foot control just will not work). When possible I lay/clamp aluminum bar either side of the weld area as it draws the heat and prevents warp. My welding rod of choice is coat hanger.

It's a hobby....enjoy!

bsrosell
08-15-2011, 08:50 PM
again, thanks for all the replies. Discovered at Northern Tool today that I DO need a 0.023 tip for my unit (not obvious in the manual!), thanks for the heads-up on that one. Never would have thought of it, just would have changed the wire reel.... Got myself a bunch of cut off disks, grinding wheels, and the 023 tips (already have the 023 mild steel wire). Watched a bunch of You-Tube vids last night (man they make it look simple! :-) So, ready to try again. Needed new cut-off wheels to cut strips of my old trunk lid to keep practicing, the "one" that came with the unit broke almost immediately.
Now I have good 3M cut off wheels (yes, I'm biased :-) Re: floor pans and undercoating, I used the 3M undercoating (even in our company store, that stuff is EXPENSIVE! wow!) on my Model-A Ford and have been very happy with it. I hate covering up the factory paint (ok, my repainting of that factory color) underneath, but in Minnesota, even in the spring there is residual salt on the roads for months after the snow has finally gone. So, probably will be part of the plan for the Golden Hawk too. (and much more likely to be driving that more than my Model-A !)

GEEMAC
08-16-2011, 01:12 PM
bsroless; if welding inside without fans or ect. 10 lbs on gas should be plenty. Mac

Pat Dilling
08-16-2011, 01:32 PM
I am also a new Welder owner. It is a 220v Lincoln, very nice. I have limited welding experience so I have enrolled in a beginning MIG welding class at the local community college. They have one in the evening this term. I figure this will be time well spent to learn to do things the right way before I develop any bad habits. Welding sheet metal for body repairs is one thing, and the consequences of screwing that up only costs you metal, time or an ugly job. When you start welding structural parts, a lousy weld raises all sorts of risks. The class costs about $150 plus about the same for books, I figure it will save me money and give piece of mind in the long run. Check out your local schools to see if they have something similar.

My first class is tonight, I am excited!

Pat

junior
08-16-2011, 02:33 PM
The class costs about $150 plus about the same for books, I figure it will save me money and give piece of mind in the long run. Check out your local schools to see if they have something similar.

My first class is tonight, I am excited!

Pat

150 bucks sounds like a great deal...have fun and enjoy the course. does this mean you're getting pumped to start working on the '54 wagon' project?

Henry Votel
08-16-2011, 03:03 PM
Hi Barry,

Late on viewing your thread. If you are interested in welding classes, i am a graduate of:

http://www.century.edu/continuinged/subjects/trades/welding.aspx

OTOH if you just want some thoughts and comments, maybe a test run on some welds I'd be happy to drop by. Let me know

Henry Votel
Forest Lake, MN
651-426-1610

jclary
08-16-2011, 03:21 PM
Hi Barry,

Late on viewing your thread. If you are interested in welding classes, i am a graduate of:

http://www.century.edu/continuinged/subjects/trades/welding.aspx

OTOH if you just want some thoughts and comments, maybe a test run on some welds I'd be happy to drop by. Let me know

Henry Votel
Forest Lake, MN
651-426-1610

Barry! This sounds like a great offer. Never, ever, turn this kind of offer down! Give Henry an opportunity to regret his offer!:):p:cool:

Paul Keller
08-16-2011, 04:08 PM
"Magnified" safety galasses are available at most industrial supply and some of the better hardware stores. Don't necessarily get the strongest (they typically range from 1.5 to 2.) - Get the one that is most comfortable to your eyes (otherwise, expect a nasty headache)
Paul TK

DEEPNHOCK
08-16-2011, 04:38 PM
All I can add here is to practice.
I practice about 5 times more than I weld.
And some days I just suck at welding.
The other days I am just plain bad:rolleyes::D
Jeff:cool:


http://youtu.be/mnQ91b6AJBE

oldcarfart
08-16-2011, 04:46 PM
get some magnified "cheaters" at your welding supply house, and Harbor Freight has some handy welding acces., don't forget the 20% coupon in everything and soon the coupon in Charmin.

oldcarfart
08-16-2011, 04:50 PM
50 amp RV ext. cord and change ends.

bsrosell
08-16-2011, 05:25 PM
Barry! This sounds like a great offer. Never, ever, turn this kind of offer down! Give Henry an opportunity to regret his offer!:):p:cool:

Just talked to Henry on the phone..... and I am the newest enrollee in the Century College Mig Welding class, hopefully to be a fellow alumni with Henry by October. ;-)
I made some improvements in my attempts today (with 023 wire now), but can see that there is more to this than I care to learn on my own. I want to do the best job possible on my Golden Hawk, and 300 bucks and a few nights in class sound like a good investment. Just wish I had thought to do it earlier this spring/summer, but other things I can do while I 'wait' to do my floors and rockers I guess...
Thanks guys! (and thanks Henry!)

tbirdtbird
10-07-2011, 12:35 AM
Lots of good replies here, all I ever use is .023 for MIG no matter how thick the metal I am welding (better penetration) , ya be sure to use .023 tip, ya gas pressure about 12-15 unless in wind, ya push don't pull, and lastly this didn't seem to come up:
Trigger the torch! No need to weld a continuous bead on thin metal. Pull trigger for a moment, lay down about a quarter inch bead, let go, re-trigger just before area looses all its redness, let go, etc etc, You are basically allowing the metal to cool somewhat between 1/4 inch weld beads, but doing it is such a way as to merge the small beads together. If you try to run continuous bead on most body work it will over heat despite low heat setting and .023 wire and burn thru. So, Trigger it!!

DEEPNHOCK
10-07-2011, 08:02 AM
I have a scrap piece of flat stock that lives on top of my mig welder.
EVERY time I start it up, I run a bead on that plate (clamped in the vice).
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me the gas is flowing and the O2 is purged from the line.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me the wire is rolling out smoothly.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me my auto darkening helmet is working.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me if my feed rate is good.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me my amp selection is proper for the bead size I am shooting for.
It tells me to practice more.
Jeff:cool:
PS: One thing that I do that bugs me sometimes...
I always snip the wire off before starting a bead.
I like the bead to have a clean start.
Hate it when there is a chunk of wire stuck to the bead.
Bad part is that there are always lil' snipped off pieces of wire to pick up after welding.

sweetolbob
10-07-2011, 10:12 AM
I have a scrap piece of flat stock that lives on top of my mig welder.
EVERY time I start it up, I run a bead on that plate (clamped in the vice).
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me the gas is flowing and the O2 is purged from the line.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me the wire is rolling out smoothly.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me my auto darkening helmet is working.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me if my feed rate is good.
It tells me to practice more.
It tells me my amp selection is proper for the bead size I am shooting for.
It tells me to practice more.
Jeff:cool:
PS: One thing that I do that bugs me sometimes...
I always snip the wire off before starting a bead.
I like the bead to have a clean start.
Hate it when there is a chunk of wire stuck to the bead.
Bad part is that there are always lil' snipped off pieces of wire to pick up after welding.

That is the best summary you will see on starting to weld with a MIG on each occasion. Nicely summarized Jeff.

Bob

DEEPNHOCK
10-07-2011, 10:24 AM
Foreplay is all important!:p
Jeff:cool:


That is the best summary you will see on starting to weld with a MIG on each occasion.
Nicely summarized Jeff.
Bob

mmagic
10-07-2011, 07:16 PM
Thanks for all the tips. I'm another welding newbie! I started with floor and fender patches on my Champ for practice. I hope to graduate to my Speedster before year end.

For lap welds, HF has a cheap great flange/punch tool. I've been positioning my patches and sheet metal screwing through plug weld punches as needed then, removing them as I weld. HF also has inexpensive butt weld clips that I'm anxious to try.

Thanks in particular for the .023 suggestion that I will try immediately and the 220 volt extension cord source suggestion. My "toy" 220 volt HF welder was a gift that required some rebuild of the feed tubes to make functional. The welder despite being a cheapy has proven more than adequate for my needs.