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drnittler
04-19-2007, 08:36 AM
Hi, Can anybody tell me a good number for a champion spark plug for my 62 289 V8? Thanks. Dave

David G. Nittler

41 Frank
04-19-2007, 08:40 AM
Champion H-14Y

N8N
04-19-2007, 09:01 AM
Autolite 437 or Bosch WR9FC (latter is a resistor type plug; 437 is a direct interchange)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

drnittler
04-19-2007, 09:24 AM
What is the modern number for the Champion H-14Y

David G. Nittler

N8N
04-19-2007, 11:01 AM
H14Y, or something that has H14Y in it (i.e. RH14YC is a resistor type copper core plug with the same specs as the old H14Y)

I've heard that H18Y is actually a better current plug for regular use, but I actually have been using the Autolite and Bosch numbers that I gave.

nate

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55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Chucks Stude
04-19-2007, 02:14 PM
Nate,
With the state of gasoline as we know it, do you feel that the Bosch, or Autolite is better than Champion? I need to do whatever, to help my hot idle. It keeps getting slower, the hotter it gets. I have a 62 GT, 4 speed w/AC.

Dwain G.
04-19-2007, 02:33 PM
In any Champion plug book from at least the last ten years, the correct plug has changed to RH18Y. Forget H14Y! They're past history, and they will foul out. Then you'll nod in agreement when you hear someone cussing those dxxx Champion spark plugs!

http://home.comcast.net/~jdwain/63.63.jpg
Dwain G.

ddub
04-19-2007, 03:01 PM
Same for a 259?

Don Wilson
53 Commander Hardtop
64 Champ 1/2 ton
Centralia, WA

JBOYLE
04-19-2007, 03:52 PM
Would these recommendations be the same for an R1 289?

63 Avanti R1 2788
1914 Stutz Bearcat
(George Barris replica)

Washington State

John Kirchhoff
04-19-2007, 04:33 PM
Several of you folks seem to dislike Champion plugs, but I prefer Champion over all others. Japanese motorcycle ignitions have always been like many modern car ignitions with dual lead coils. One coil fires both plugs simultaneously, which means one of the plugs is firing on the exhaust stroke and doubles the wear on the plug. In addition, motorcycle engines often turn double the rpms of a car engine, so a bike plug gets four times the wear as does a car plug engine with a distributor. *** bikes used to be notorious for having weak, low voltage ignitions and as soon as a plug built up a little internal resistance from use, they'd misfire. I found the worst of the lot was the Japanese ND and NGK plugs and would be sputtering within 5,000 miles. Germany's Bosch was better, Autolite better yet at 10,000 or more miles and Champion was by far the best of all. In fact, I'd usually run them to 15,000 miles and changed them not because of misfire or poor performance but just because I figured they needed it. To tell the truth, I never saw any improvment in performance when Champion switched to the supposedly better copper core.

Chucks Stude
04-19-2007, 06:04 PM
Don't dislike Champions, dislike the gas we have now. Instead of a spark plug, we need the ignitor that Emeril uses to light his Bananas Foster. The alcohol content is about the same.

N8N
04-19-2007, 10:16 PM
R1 engines specified a J12Y which is a shorter reach (3/8") than the H14Y (7/16") - BUT the R1 head castings are the same as a late V-8. Which is a better fit in your engine? if you are concerned to this level of detail best to check the depth of the threads in the head and then make your selection.

I've always wondered, did the R1 heads have the chambers machined back a little, or did Stude specify the J12Y plugs simply because there was no such thing as a H12Y?

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
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blackhawk
04-21-2007, 02:45 AM
quote:Originally posted by N8N

R1 engines specified a J12Y which is a shorter reach (3/8") than the H14Y (7/16") - BUT the R1 head castings are the same as a late V-8. Which is a better fit in your engine? if you are concerned to this level of detail best to check the depth of the threads in the head and then make your selection.

I've always wondered, did the R1 heads have the chambers machined back a little, or did Stude specify the J12Y plugs simply because there was no such thing as a H12Y?

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
Might have something to do with the R1 pistons being flat top instead of dished.

N8N
04-21-2007, 09:02 AM
FWIW I have the WR9FC's in my R1 right now simply because I neglected to source a set of the "correct" R1 spark plugs when I was ready to fire it up. I haven't noticed any bent electrodes, etc. If nothing else the 259s also used flattop pistons and those spec'd the H14Y or H18Y depending on year. I haven't really beat on it though; I suspect I will have to get some colder plugs at some point.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

blackhawk
04-21-2007, 06:21 PM
quote:Originally posted by N8N

FWIW I have the WR9FC's in my R1 right now simply because I neglected to source a set of the "correct" R1 spark plugs when I was ready to fire it up. I haven't noticed any bent electrodes, etc. If nothing else the 259s also used flattop pistons and those spec'd the H14Y or H18Y depending on year. I haven't really beat on it though; I suspect I will have to get some colder plugs at some point.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
It could easily be that the shorter reach of the plugs for the R1 has nothing to do with there being less clearance between the piston and head. I never paid any attention to the reach of the plugs. I thought the different plug designations for the R-series and regular V8's was because Studebaker wanted a cooler temperature range for the plugs in the R-series engines, not because there was less clearance.

The pistons in the 259 are flat on top but they do not travel as far out in the cylinder. The stroke is shorter on the 259 V8.

Dale

N8N
04-21-2007, 07:05 PM
I would ASSume that the 259 pistons, while not traveling as far, still come up as close to the deck as do the R1s (or at least within a couple thousandths, anyway) but honestly, I don't recall ever seeing a 259 with the heads off. I suspect that you are right however, as H12Y does not appear to exist.

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55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Chicken Hawk
04-21-2007, 07:35 PM
Deck height for the 259 is about three times what it is on the 289. roughly about .080" on the 259 and .025" on the 289.

Ted


quote:Originally posted by N8N

I would ASSume that the 259 pistons, while not traveling as far, still come up as close to the deck as do the R1s (or at least within a couple thousandths, anyway) but honestly, I don't recall ever seeing a 259 with the heads off. I suspect that you are right however, as H12Y does not appear to exist.

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Lark Parker
05-26-2007, 09:43 PM
When I was looking for the best reach/fit I noticed that the AC 46S was a better thread fit than the Champion R14Y. (The AC thread gave almost flush level fit at the head surface.) and the Champion was a wee bit shorter. I can't find any info to compare the heat range between these two types. Anyone have a comparison?

(I already have a lot of the 45 and 46S plugs)

And yes, the "one" thread difference does matter to me.<g>

Lark Parker aka Trim Trader

hawk gt 62 rhd
05-27-2007, 01:51 PM
I had plug problems too
It is not really the problem with a certain manufacturer,but with the knowledge if they are cold or hot.
That is why NGK is forbidden because their high numbers are cold and their lows are hot
Now I have in my car Bosch w5 bc driving on LPG and that is ok by the colour of the plugs.
When I bought it there was w6 bc, but then driving on petrol 95 leadfree.

53k
05-27-2007, 03:15 PM
quote:Originally posted by John Kirchhoff

Several of you folks seem to dislike Champion plugs, but I prefer Champion over all others. Japanese motorcycle ignitions have always been like many modern car ignitions with dual lead coils. One coil fires both plugs simultaneously, which means one of the plugs is firing on the exhaust stroke and doubles the wear on the plug. In addition, motorcycle engines often turn double the rpms of a car engine, so a bike plug gets four times the wear as does a car plug engine with a distributor. *** bikes used to be notorious for having weak, low voltage ignitions and as soon as a plug built up a little internal resistance from use, they'd misfire. I found the worst of the lot was the Japanese ND and NGK plugs and would be sputtering within 5,000 miles. Germany's Bosch was better, Autolite better yet at 10,000 or more miles and Champion was by far the best of all. In fact, I'd usually run them to 15,000 miles and changed them not because of misfire or poor performance but just because I figured they needed it. To tell the truth, I never saw any improvment in performance when Champion switched to the supposedly better copper core.

Interesting. When I had an '85 Subaru Turbo Sedan it came with NGKs. I swapped them out for the counter part Champions (I had always been big on Champions). The car ran much worse and got poorer mileage. I bought new NGKs and all was well. I had the same experience in Echo engines (Mantis tiller and Echo string trimmer). Both ran much better on NGKs. Having said that, I gave up on Champions in my Studebakers after a friend gave me a set of Autolite 437s for my R-2 Avanti when I was having so much trouble with fouling on our Potomac Chapter Route 66 trip in 2003. Again, problem solved. Since I have put 437s in my '64 Daytona Wagonaire (259), my '64 Daytona convertible (289) and my '53 Commander (232).


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine

MagikDraggin
05-28-2007, 04:36 PM
When I replaced the RH18Y Champion plugs in my GT Hawk 289, the new number came up as "857". Each plug-box was stamped with the number along with the discontinued number in small print beneath it.

Karl

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v147/MagikDraggin/Other%20Stuff/IM000986-reduced.jpg?
1962 GT Hawk 4sp

Lark Parker
04-04-2008, 07:36 PM
Anyone know what plug was specified for the R4 engine?

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n4/larkparker/Miscellaneous/caryreduced.jpg Lark Parker
If at first you don't succeed -- you will get a lot of advice.

wally
04-04-2008, 11:04 PM
I like Autolites because of the price(caso) and the numbering system they use to identify them. They seem to perform well enough, though the black coating on the bases is prone to rusting. I always use antiseize on them.

"You Can't Have Everything--Where Would You Put It?" ---comedian Steven Wright

laughinlark
04-04-2008, 11:06 PM
I ran Autolite 82 for years when I first started driving in the late seventies. Then the number changed to 85's. I've run them in all my Studies ever since. Even my 289 with flat top pistons.

Gordon

http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t60/laughinlark/gordsjsmk-1.jpghttp://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t60/laughinlark/11-28-07130-1.jpghttp://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t60/laughinlark/all283.jpg

JDP
04-04-2008, 11:42 PM
R4 takes UJ 10Y Champion, 43S AC, 74 Autolite Of course you'll need matching racing fuel with the 12-1 compression. :)

JDP/Maryland

Lark Parker
04-05-2008, 07:36 AM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

R4 takes UJ 10Y Champion, 43S AC, 74 Autolite Of course you'll need matching racing fuel with the 12-1 compression. :)

JDP/Maryland



Thanks JP, I couldn't find it.


http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n4/larkparker/Miscellaneous/caryreduced.jpg Lark Parker
If at first you don't succeed -- you will get a lot of advice.

Flashback
04-05-2008, 11:58 AM
I know the original question was what plugs are for a 289-62 year model. I agree with the answer H14Y. I can understand why the confusion on plugs. My 53 shop manual says H-10 for the 232 and the 54 Motors manual says H-10 for 53 and H-11 for 54. The 61 Motors manual say H-11 for everything from 53 to 57 standard V-8's I have an old 61 tune up chart that say's H14Y for 53 to 61. My 53-54-and 55 owners manuals don't say.Question is what plug do all you say for 232 and 259 engines.

Tex in Alabama
53 C Coupe

Tex E. Grier

53k
04-05-2008, 10:01 PM
quote:Originally posted by Flashback

I know the original question was what plugs are for a 289-62 year model. I agree with the answer H14Y. I can understand why the confusion on plugs. My 53 shop manual says H-10 for the 232 and the 54 Motors manual says H-10 for 53 and H-11 for 54. The 61 Motors manual say H-11 for everything from 53 to 57 standard V-8's I have an old 61 tune up chart that say's H14Y for 53 to 61. My 53-54-and 55 owners manuals don't say.Question is what plug do all you say for 232 and 259 engines.

As I posted before, I use Autolite 437s in my '53 232, my '64 259 and my '64 289. I also used them in my formerly owned '64 R-2 Avanti.


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine
1962 Gravely Model L (Studebaker-Packard serial plate)
1972 Gravely Model 430 (Studebaker name plate, Studebaker Onan engine)

Thomas63R2
04-05-2008, 10:51 PM
It is unlikely that anyone would notice any difference in the way their Stude runs with the newer copper core plug vs. an old style plug. What the copper core allows for is fewer spark plugs to cover a wider range of applications. The job of a spark plug is to run hot enough at low rpms to avoid misfiring, and to not run overly hot at wide open throttle to avoid pre-ignition detonation. Thats it.

There are some temperature range differences in spark plug interchanges between different manufacturers - the interchanges broadly overlap, but rarely have the smae exact low and high temperature in their range. Part of what would affect which plugs would work best for any individual car is the local fuel blends. Some areas use oxygenated fuels, some areas blend additive ingredients differently. Gasoline is not homegenous from coast to coast.

That said, I think most Studes get driven too seldom, and for too few miles for most owners to really notice any brand differences.

If your Stude runs hot at idle and low rpms do not blame that on the spark plugs. If, and this is a big if, everything else is up to snuff in the cooling system etc., then a more likely cause of a hot running engine at low rpm is the ignition advance curve. With modern fuel blends most older engines run happier with more ignition advance dialed in more quickly. If you advance curve is too slow (or frozen), this will cause needless heat.

Thomas

Long time hot rodder
Packrat junk collector
'63 Avanti R2 4 speed

LarkVIII
04-06-2008, 06:39 PM
I've tried the Autolites and the Champion H14Y and wasn't satisfied,too cold-switched to the H18Y's and my engine ran much better. Plugs are cheap,experiment around and find what works best in your machine


quote:Originally posted by N8N

H14Y, or something that has H14Y in it (i.e. RH14YC is a resistor type copper core plug with the same specs as the old H14Y)

I've heard that H18Y is actually a better current plug for regular use, but I actually have been using the Autolite and Bosch numbers that I gave.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel


63VY4 Leakin' Lena Hagerstown MD