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Burke
04-04-2007, 11:46 PM
Can someone explain the "R" designations on the Studebaker engines.
I have seen R1 up to R5 in different publications. I am assuming the higher the number the higher the engine performance.

Thanks

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 02:37 AM
Sorry, I have been searching for almost an hour to find our R1,R2,R3,R4 & R5 explanation post for you using the search engine which normally works great. But with all the Guys signature including all their 2R5 trucks they own, all that comes up on R5 is their posts.
It is very lengthy, but I could have written it by now. I'm too tired tonight, it's 12:39 maybe someone will find it or explain it tomorrow!

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 02:37 AM
Sorry, I have been searching for almost an hour to find our R1,R2,R3,R4 & R5 explanation post for you using the search engine which normally works great. But with all the Guys signature including all their 2R5 trucks they own, all that comes up on R5 is their posts.
It is very lengthy, but I could have written it by now. I'm too tired tonight, it's 12:39 maybe someone will find it or explain it tomorrow!

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

bob40
04-05-2007, 05:38 AM
From the Avanti.com site.

The Avanti R1 was a 289 cubic inch carbureted version with a 4 barrel and the R2 was a 289 cubic inch version equipped with a supercharger. The R3 was a special performance supercharged variation displacing 304 cubic inches and very few of these were built. The R3 version came with a bored out 304.5 cubic inch V8 stuffed into the engine bay, modified suspension and 4-wheel disc brakes. Responsibility for the aggressive engine development plans fell into the hands of Andy Granatelli of Indianapolis 500 fame. Like the earlier 289 cid R2 version, the R3 was also supercharged, fully blueprinted to racing specs and hand built by Paxton. There were also R4 and R5 performance variations, but none of these were sold to the public. The experimental "Due Cento" with the only R5 dual supercharged engine built by Paxton reached 196.62 mph.

R4's were a non-supercharged version of the R3's. Approximately 140 R3/R4 engines were made. Only a fraction of these still exist. These engines display many serial number irregularities: some prototypes were not numbered; very early ones have RS stamped on the block; two experimental numbers are EX2123 and EX2132; one prototype number is RS1021; and others start with B1 and go as high as B153.

bob40
04-05-2007, 05:38 AM
From the Avanti.com site.

The Avanti R1 was a 289 cubic inch carbureted version with a 4 barrel and the R2 was a 289 cubic inch version equipped with a supercharger. The R3 was a special performance supercharged variation displacing 304 cubic inches and very few of these were built. The R3 version came with a bored out 304.5 cubic inch V8 stuffed into the engine bay, modified suspension and 4-wheel disc brakes. Responsibility for the aggressive engine development plans fell into the hands of Andy Granatelli of Indianapolis 500 fame. Like the earlier 289 cid R2 version, the R3 was also supercharged, fully blueprinted to racing specs and hand built by Paxton. There were also R4 and R5 performance variations, but none of these were sold to the public. The experimental "Due Cento" with the only R5 dual supercharged engine built by Paxton reached 196.62 mph.

R4's were a non-supercharged version of the R3's. Approximately 140 R3/R4 engines were made. Only a fraction of these still exist. These engines display many serial number irregularities: some prototypes were not numbered; very early ones have RS stamped on the block; two experimental numbers are EX2123 and EX2132; one prototype number is RS1021; and others start with B1 and go as high as B153.

Transtar60
04-05-2007, 07:50 AM
Ok I'd like to see the parts numbers for the rear disc brakes on the R3 Avantis.[}:)]

http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10056/5E13%20Pic%203.JPG
3E38
4E2
4E28
5E13
7E7
8E7
8E12
8E28
4E2
59 Lark
etc

Transtar60
04-05-2007, 07:50 AM
Ok I'd like to see the parts numbers for the rear disc brakes on the R3 Avantis.[}:)]

http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10056/5E13%20Pic%203.JPG
3E38
4E2
4E28
5E13
7E7
8E7
8E12
8E28
4E2
59 Lark
etc

Dick Steinkamp
04-05-2007, 09:22 AM
The Avanti.com site is down, but if that is actually their explanation, I think they could do better.

I'm no Avanti expert and no Jet Thrust expert, but...

What suspension modifications?

What 4 wheel disc brakes?

Didn't R4's have 2 four barrels?

Wasn't an R1 different from all other single 4 barrel carburated 289's? (and how do you spell carburated?)

Was the supercharger the only difference between an R2 and a normal 289?

Were no R4's actually sold to the public? How did Paul get his?





http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
04-05-2007, 09:22 AM
The Avanti.com site is down, but if that is actually their explanation, I think they could do better.

I'm no Avanti expert and no Jet Thrust expert, but...

What suspension modifications?

What 4 wheel disc brakes?

Didn't R4's have 2 four barrels?

Wasn't an R1 different from all other single 4 barrel carburated 289's? (and how do you spell carburated?)

Was the supercharger the only difference between an R2 and a normal 289?

Were no R4's actually sold to the public? How did Paul get his?





http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

N8N
04-05-2007, 09:50 AM
I believe the "suspension modifications" were backdating the upper inner control arm shafts, bushings, and upper control arms to the solid threaded steel type as used on the first cars to use that suspension layout (I want to say '51 Commander?)

I don't know about four wheel disc brakes - I have not seen any. Bob Kapetyn might be able to answer this, as I believe that he owns a factory R3 Avanti.

you are right, R4 = dual quads on an R3

yes, the R1 had higher compression pistons and several other unique parts (oil pan, windage tray, harmonic balancer, dual point distributor)

R2 = R1 with blower and different heads (lower compression) and sealed carburetor, slightly different fuel pump - otherwise pretty much identical

I don't know that any R4's were sold to the public *factory installed.* Paxton Products was more than happy to sell "crate engines" however.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

N8N
04-05-2007, 09:50 AM
I believe the "suspension modifications" were backdating the upper inner control arm shafts, bushings, and upper control arms to the solid threaded steel type as used on the first cars to use that suspension layout (I want to say '51 Commander?)

I don't know about four wheel disc brakes - I have not seen any. Bob Kapetyn might be able to answer this, as I believe that he owns a factory R3 Avanti.

you are right, R4 = dual quads on an R3

yes, the R1 had higher compression pistons and several other unique parts (oil pan, windage tray, harmonic balancer, dual point distributor)

R2 = R1 with blower and different heads (lower compression) and sealed carburetor, slightly different fuel pump - otherwise pretty much identical

I don't know that any R4's were sold to the public *factory installed.* Paxton Products was more than happy to sell "crate engines" however.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

JDP
04-05-2007, 09:56 AM
"What suspension modifications?

51-52 steel front suspension bushings

What 4 wheel disc brakes?

Just wrong

Didn't R4's have 2 four barrels?

No, two fours.

Wasn't an R1 different from all other single 4 barrel carburated 289's? (and how do you spell carburated?)

Yes, different cam, 10.5-1 compression, much more.

Was the supercharger the only difference between an R2 and a normal 289?

No, the R2 was pretty much a lower compression R1 with a added blower.

Were no R4's actually sold to the public? How did Paul get his?

No R4 Avanti's were sold, one R4 Lark type was, but many engines were built and installed later.


64 Commander-64 Daytona
64 GT R2 clone-63 GT R2
63 Avanti R1
63 Daytona convert-63
63 Lark 2 door
62 Lark 2 door
60 Lark HT-60Hawk
59 3E truck
52 & 53 Starliner
51 Commander

JDP
04-05-2007, 09:56 AM
"What suspension modifications?

51-52 steel front suspension bushings

What 4 wheel disc brakes?

Just wrong

Didn't R4's have 2 four barrels?

No, two fours.

Wasn't an R1 different from all other single 4 barrel carburated 289's? (and how do you spell carburated?)

Yes, different cam, 10.5-1 compression, much more.

Was the supercharger the only difference between an R2 and a normal 289?

No, the R2 was pretty much a lower compression R1 with a added blower.

Were no R4's actually sold to the public? How did Paul get his?

No R4 Avanti's were sold, one R4 Lark type was, but many engines were built and installed later.


64 Commander-64 Daytona
64 GT R2 clone-63 GT R2
63 Avanti R1
63 Daytona convert-63
63 Lark 2 door
62 Lark 2 door
60 Lark HT-60Hawk
59 3E truck
52 & 53 Starliner
51 Commander

Skip Lackie
04-05-2007, 10:01 AM
Here's another version of the answer. And if you don't like it, you can edit it yourself!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studebaker_Avanti

Skip Lackie
Washington DC

Skip Lackie
04-05-2007, 10:01 AM
Here's another version of the answer. And if you don't like it, you can edit it yourself!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studebaker_Avanti

Skip Lackie
Washington DC

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 01:12 PM
Yes thank you Skip, this is WAY better! It has much more accurate info. than the Avanti.com site, it is totally WRONG!

I know we had big discussions on the various high performance Jet Thrust Lark/Hawk engines and the Avanti engines, right here somewhere. I just could not find them. This is more concise though. Just click the button called "POWER"! [^]


quote:Originally posted by Skip Lackie


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studebaker_Avanti


StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 01:12 PM
Yes thank you Skip, this is WAY better! It has much more accurate info. than the Avanti.com site, it is totally WRONG!

I know we had big discussions on the various high performance Jet Thrust Lark/Hawk engines and the Avanti engines, right here somewhere. I just could not find them. This is more concise though. Just click the button called "POWER"! [^]


quote:Originally posted by Skip Lackie


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studebaker_Avanti


StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

bob40
04-05-2007, 03:39 PM
Hey...I just copied and pasted.

bob40
04-05-2007, 03:39 PM
Hey...I just copied and pasted.

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 05:50 PM
Sorry Bob; I didn't mean to imply it was your bad, just wanted to set the record straight for the newbe! [^]


quote:Originally posted by bob40

Hey...I just copied and pasted.


StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 05:50 PM
Sorry Bob; I didn't mean to imply it was your bad, just wanted to set the record straight for the newbe! [^]


quote:Originally posted by bob40

Hey...I just copied and pasted.


StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

Dick Steinkamp
04-05-2007, 06:31 PM
quote:Originally posted by N8N

I believe the "suspension modifications" were backdating the upper inner control arm shafts, bushings, and upper control arms to the solid threaded steel type as used on the first cars to use that suspension layout (I want to say '51 Commander?)




Did all 63 and up Studes have these or just Avantis, or just those with JT engines, or just those with the "package"?



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Dick Steinkamp
04-05-2007, 06:31 PM
quote:Originally posted by N8N

I believe the "suspension modifications" were backdating the upper inner control arm shafts, bushings, and upper control arms to the solid threaded steel type as used on the first cars to use that suspension layout (I want to say '51 Commander?)




Did all 63 and up Studes have these or just Avantis, or just those with JT engines, or just those with the "package"?



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 06:35 PM
The only ones I know of that have that Dick, would be the (9) R3 Avantis, they also had Flanged rear axles.


quote:Originally posted by Dick Steinkamp

Did all 63 and up Studes have these or just Avantis, or just those with JT engines, or just those with the "package"?

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

StudeRich
04-05-2007, 06:35 PM
The only ones I know of that have that Dick, would be the (9) R3 Avantis, they also had Flanged rear axles.


quote:Originally posted by Dick Steinkamp

Did all 63 and up Studes have these or just Avantis, or just those with JT engines, or just those with the "package"?

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

N8N
04-05-2007, 07:31 PM
However, if you have access to an early parts car, I believe those parts would fit all later Studes, and probably would last longer than the rubber (if kept regularly greased...)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

N8N
04-05-2007, 07:31 PM
However, if you have access to an early parts car, I believe those parts would fit all later Studes, and probably would last longer than the rubber (if kept regularly greased...)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel