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lube_sales
07-13-2006, 01:51 PM
I have a 66 Daytona Sports Sedan with 47,000 miles, 4th owner. This car has never seen snow, and has always been garaged. The last owner was a great older gent, cared greatly for the car but did not drive it much if at all. The car has all original paint, interior, vinyl roof, chrome and drive train. I had it judged at Spokane and it took 2nd place on points. I drive it every where. My questions is do I repaint it. I lost most of my points on the small dink and scapes a car gets over these many years. I have spent alot of time with rubbing compounds and waxs and it has brought the paint back to life. But it still has the age marks ( no rust). Will painting it add value or take it away? I must admit I have some pride on it's looks w/o painting it, but want to do the best for my sweet little 66. It is Algonquin Green with a white Vinyl roof, V8 auto, White interior with front bench seat, not buckets.
Thanks Ted Dirksen

Roscomacaw
07-13-2006, 03:00 PM
Ted,

Painting it will probably ADD to the value. It'll maybe you get a 1st as well. But if the idea of it's original paint means something to you than leave it be.;) The car, I assume, is in your hands because you like it. Trophies mean nothing unless they give YOU pride. If a trophy means more than your sentimental take on the car, paint it.[^]

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

JDP
07-13-2006, 03:25 PM
Unless the paint was really bad, you should not have lost enough points to keep you out of first. I'd look hard at the judging sheet and fix some of the other minor issues. i.e. you can lose as many points for the lack of decals or the wrong hose clamps as you'd lose on less than perfect paint.

Arnold Md.
Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 R1 GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
62 Lark 2 door
60 Hawk
51 Commander

ROADRACELARK
07-13-2006, 03:33 PM
Ted,
It's always fun to brag,,,"this is the ORIGINAL paint Studebaker put on the car in 1966" yes it may have a nick or two but hey,,,you would too after 40 years;). My 63' Avanti (Mr Biggs knows this car) STILL has it's original interor (except for carpet, headliner panels and visors). Yes there is a couple of small "imperfections" but it IS a driver and after 43 years...I think it speads for itself;). Anybody can go to a trim shop and exchange their visa card for a new interior. That's hard to do with the original!
Dan

Road Racers turn left AND right.

studegary
07-13-2006, 04:52 PM
I would not repaint your car. It is only original once. If you got an International Second Place, and lost some points for things other than the paint, the paint can't be too bad. Concentrate on correcting the other items and perhaps touch up the worst of the paint imperfections.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY
1954 Commander Starliner (restomod)
1959 DeLuxe pickup (restomod)

lube_sales
07-13-2006, 05:05 PM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

Unless the paint was really bad, you should not have lost enough points to keep you out of first. I'd look hard at the judging sheet and fix some of the other minor issues. i.e. you can lose as many points for the lack of decals or the wrong hose clamps as you'd lose on less than perfect paint.

Arnold Md.
Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 R1 GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
62 Lark 2 door
60 Hawk
51 Commander


Yes you are right I did loose points for Radial tires, hoses clamps and what I can not believe worn interior, which I had a hard time believing, since the interior is so nice. Also lost points for truck mat which is original but a little oily and dirty. The tires are due to ease of driving and the hose clamps because I had a bad expeience with the old style wire type clamps, do not trust them. Again Thanks for all of your comments and I think I will keep the original paint and just keep waxing it.

JDP
07-13-2006, 05:10 PM
Trunk mat is $40, clamps and decal around $20, on the interior check the windlace around the doors for fraying.Keep the paint and detail it for a first place.

Arnold Md.
Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 R1 GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
62 Lark 2 door
60 Hawk
51 Commander

tstclr
07-13-2006, 06:01 PM
That sounds like a cool colour combo. Do you have any pics? Where in Canada are you located?
Todd
Ingersoll, Ontario


63 Lark 2dr Sedan

mbstude
07-13-2006, 06:24 PM
Doc Cade has a NICE 63 Wagonaire, OHV 6 engine, 3 speed tranny with no OD. The car had 5300 or so original miles, (it's the closest to a NOS car I've ever seen) and because of a few little dings and scratches, they repainted the whole car. It still looked and shined like new. But, with the Cades, it doesn't matter, they might buy another with even less miles tommorrow. Who knows!? lol... (I think they bought a fire truck from the Asa Hall collection that has very few miles on it.)
But, then again, they drive their cars (about 60 or so) all across the country.

Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut. Hazlehurst, Georgia
63 Daytona HT (project, OHV 6 engine, soon to have dual exhaust)
51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g>)
MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
Click my name and check out "Links".

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/rainyday.jpg

Swifster
07-13-2006, 08:13 PM
The other thing to consider is the cost of that paint job. While the paint and labor to paint are minimal, the cost to prep the car, as well as removing all the trim, is very time consuming (and costly). Depending on the shop and your level of expectation, a good quality paint job will run you from $3000 to $6000.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Lakeland, FL

1964 Studebaker Daytona

Michigan Speed - www.michiganspeed.com
Club Hot Rod - www.clubhotrod.com
LS1 Tech - www.ls1tech.com

Guido
07-13-2006, 09:23 PM
quote:Originally posted by mbstude
(I think they bought a fire truck from the Asa Hall collection that has very few miles on it.)

Matt, you are correct, Dr. Cade got one of Asa's fire trucks and I got the other which has about 5600 miles on it. It was bought new by the local fire company that was literally just 400 yards down the hill from Asa's dad's house.

However, my original '46M-16 fire truck just turned 2350 miles. Just think, that averages out to less than 40 miles per year. It still has the original tires on the rear, but the fronts got rotted and were replaced.

Gary

Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

1946 M-16 fire truck
1948 M-16 grain truck
1949 2R16A grain truck
1949 2R17A fire truck
1955 E-38 grain truck
1957 3E-40 flatbed
1961 6E-28 grain truck
1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck
1962 7E-7 Champ pickup
1962 GT Hawk 4 speed
1964 Avanti R2 4 speed
1964 Cruiser
And various other "treasures"
Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond & Louisa, Va.

Roscomacaw
07-13-2006, 09:25 PM
Yeah Tom, that's a valid point. Cost of a worthwhile repaint isn't gonna be cheap.
I stand by my initial comments that a repaint would add value to the car. That WAS the pointed question he asked and I addressed it from a "resell" position, not from a judging or nostalgia position. Note further that he states:"I lost most of my points on the small dink and scapes a car gets over these many years."
Maybe he COULD offset that block of points by correcting other things and maybe he got the wrong judge(s) on the wrong day. Clamps, radial tires, hoses and the like - pretty cut & dried items. But unless it's gross, the grade of deterioration of cosmetic stuff is subject to a range of opinion.
If I'd been the judge, and knew that it was original paint, that would have been a plus in my eyes. But compared to what most of us agree is the OVER-restoration of these South Bend beauties, it's hard to tell the guy with the mirror-smooth black paint job that the road-rashed car sporting it's original finish is superior![}:)]




Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

mbstude
07-13-2006, 09:40 PM
quote:However, my original '46M-16 fire truck just turned 2350 miles. Just think, that averages out to less than 40 miles per year.

They really had a lot to do at the fire station. Lots of fires to put out...
I think Stephen (Dr. Cade's son) said that the truck they bought was a 53 model. He said it was nice. But if the Cades bought it, it's gonna be nice.
BTW, here's our rusty old 49 fire truck:
http://community.webshots.com/photo/543822171/1543830023074401068VJVphe#
It was originally used in Pennsylvania.

Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut. Hazlehurst, Georgia
63 Daytona HT (project, OHV 6 engine, soon to have dual exhaust)
51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g>)
MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
Click my name and check out "Links".

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/rainyday.jpg

Swifster
07-13-2006, 09:49 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

Maybe he COULD offset that block of points by correcting other things and maybe he got the wrong judge(s) on the wrong day. Clamps, radial tires, hoses and the like - pretty cut & dried items. But unless it's gross, the grade of deterioration of cosmetic stuff is subject to a range of opinion.
If I'd been the judge, and knew that it was original paint, that would have been a plus in my eyes. But compared to what most of us agree is the OVER-restoration of these South Bend beauties, it's hard to tell the guy with the mirror-smooth black paint job that the road-rashed car sporting it's original finish is superior![}:)]




Miscreant at large.



Bob, I agree with you. And so does the group that runs the Pebble Beach show. They consider unrestored cars to be greater than a restored one (provided it's still nice). They also do not knock off for road rash if the car goes through the parade process through town the night before the judging. A great way to reward a driver.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Lakeland, FL

1964 Studebaker Daytona

Michigan Speed - www.michiganspeed.com
Club Hot Rod - www.clubhotrod.com
LS1 Tech - www.ls1tech.com

Guido
07-13-2006, 10:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by mbstude

BTW, here's our rusty old 49 fire truck:

Matt,

How about trading or selling some of the equipment off the truck so I can finish mine up. At Asa's sale they sold the stuff at his dad's house on Saturday and saw a wooden ladder there. One of the fellows I was with is a 30 year VFD vetern. I commented that it looked like a fire ladder, but he didn't agree. Turns out it was, but at that time I had no intention of buying the fire truck.

Gary

Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

1946 M-16 fire truck
1948 M-16 grain truck
1949 2R16A grain truck
1949 2R17A fire truck
1955 E-38 grain truck
1957 3E-40 flatbed
1961 6E-28 grain truck
1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck
1962 7E-7 Champ pickup
1962 GT Hawk 4 speed
1964 Avanti R2 4 speed
1964 Cruiser
And various other "treasures"
Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond & Louisa, Va.

lube_sales
07-13-2006, 11:13 PM
I am in Stony Plain Alberta just west of Edmonton. Send me your e-mail address and I can send you some pics.
Thanks Ted


quote:Originally posted by tstclr

That sounds like a cool colour combo. Do you have any pics? Where in Canada are you located?
Todd
Ingersoll, Ontario


63 Lark 2dr Sedan

JDP
07-13-2006, 11:35 PM
It does not always happen, but some judges just love Survivor cars. I once won a best of show Avanti award with my old 40,000 mile 64. One judge was picking at tiny flaws in the paint when the other said "yes, but's it's factory Studebaker paint !" I think they took off maybe 2 points for my paint, but zero for authenticty.

Arnold Md.
Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 R1 GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
62 Lark 2 door
60 Hawk
51 Commander

lube_sales
07-14-2006, 07:24 PM
quote:Originally posted by JDP

It does not always happen, but some judges just love Survivor cars. I once won a best of show Avanti award with my old 40,000 mile 64. One judge was picking at tiny flaws in the paint when the other said "yes, but's it's factory Studebaker paint !" I think they took off maybe 2 points for my paint, but zero for authenticty.

Arnold Md.
Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
64 Daytona HT


Good to hear, I will keep the car as is and baby the paint. I really do love this little girl and want to do the best for it.
Again Thanks for all who helped

Ted
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 R1 GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
62 Lark 2 door
60 Hawk
51 Commander

mbstude
07-14-2006, 09:05 PM
Guido: We actually have intentions of restoring (well, making it a usable driver) someday. We had a 51 Maxim (sp.) that was HUGE up until about last year. I hated to see that one go, but I guess Studes have a special place in people's hearts around here, unlike Maxims.
In case I see something, what exactly do you need for yours?


Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut. Hazlehurst, Georgia
63 Daytona HT (project, OHV 6 engine, soon to have dual exhaust)
51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g>)
MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
Click my name and check out "Links".

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/rainyday.jpg

Guido
07-15-2006, 05:56 PM
quote:Originally posted by mbstude

Guido: In case I see something, what exactly do you need for yours?

Matt,

I need any type of accesories for the truck, Indian tanks, axes, ladders, etc.

Gary

Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

1946 M-16 fire truck
1948 M-16 grain truck
1949 2R16A grain truck
1949 2R17A fire truck
1955 E-38 grain truck
1957 3E-40 flatbed
1961 6E-28 grain truck
1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck
1962 7E-7 Champ pickup
1962 GT Hawk 4 speed
1964 Avanti R2 4 speed
1964 Cruiser
And various other "treasures"
Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond & Louisa, Va.

rockne10
07-15-2006, 08:38 PM
AACA judging has a separate "Preservation Class" for original unrestored cars. But then, you could be in competition with a 54,000 mile 33 Rockne. It gets real subjective and I wouldn't want to be the judge.

Brad
Pine Grove Mills, Pa.
33 Rockne 10
51 Commander Starlight
53 Commander Starlight
previously: 63 Cruiser, 62 Regal VI, 60 VI convertible, 50 LandCruiser

8E45E
07-20-2006, 01:59 PM
[Again Thanks for all of your comments and I think I will keep the original paint and just keep waxing it.


Good move, Ted! That is a nice car as it is! Will we see you in Red Deer for the Super Run?

Craig

avantilover
07-21-2006, 12:16 AM
Speaking of original paint, is the same paint formulation that Studebaker used available today, seem to recall it containing melamine or maybe that's wrong, some special ingredient to give it extra strength or shine.
[?]


John Clements
Avantilover, your South Australian Studebaker lover!!!
Lockleys South Australia

mbstude
07-21-2006, 08:41 AM
Hey, wanna se some great original paint? Check out my buddies 1938 Commander State sedan. The fenders were repainted several years ago. All other paint is original.
http://community.webshots.com/myphotos?action=viewAllPhotos&albumID=552423391&security=zsIHSg

Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut. Hazlehurst, Georgia
63 Daytona HT (project, OHV 6 engine, soon to have dual exhaust)
51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g>)
MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
Click my name and check out "Links".

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j209/mbstude/rainyday.jpg