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diodorus
06-18-2006, 10:12 PM
I finally retrieved my 60 Hawk's 289 from the guy who sold me the car a few weeks ago. I had my doubts about the 289's state of health as the last owner replaced it with a 350. (I can't contact him either.) Well, after taking the motor apart down to the block (crankshaft still in place)I'm more confused than ever. I don't see anything wrong with it! No sign of heat damage, cyl walls smooth, heads and valves show no problems. So I guess the next thing I need is a compliment of gaskets and a manual or two. Here's where you guys come in. Where do I get those things? I'm new to the club and really don't know all the resources as yet. Of course any other words of wisdom at this juncture would be hugely appreciated Man that engine looked enormous hanging from that hoist.
jim

GTtim
06-18-2006, 10:24 PM
Studebaker International, SASCO, Fairborn, Stephen Allen are a few that have those parts. Look up at the top of this page, click on home, click on Valuable Links, Scroll down to (StudebakerVendors.com) click on that.

Tim K.
'64 R2 GT Hawk

PackardV8
06-19-2006, 12:06 AM
Can't tell from your post how many engines you have been through and don't know your financial situation, but the Studebaker V8 is incredibly tough and will pretty much run forever with an occasional oil change. Some random thoughts from way back when I had to re-use wear parts.

While the block is apart, it is a must to pull all the core plugs down the side and the two block drain plugs. Most every V8 has the lower water jackets full of mud, crud and rust. Rod it out, wash it out and then do it again. You'll be glad you did.

FWIW, no matter how good the heads look from the outside, I wouldn't put it back together without a valve job and new valve stem seals. Single most common cause of losing power is valves not completely sealing. Single most common cause of oil burning is perished valve stem seals.

Pull a ring, square it in the cylinder and check the end gap against specs. If it is close, and money is too, they could go back in after a quick hone. Clean the crank and bearings. Plastigage is cheap and accurate enough for your purposes. Check your readings against the manual.

Studebaker is one of the few engines with adjustable bearing thrust. Read the manual carefully and make it right.

Have fun and Good luck,



PackardV8

whacker
06-19-2006, 12:13 AM
There was very likely nothing wrong with the engine in the first place. For some reason, some people just like to pull them out and replace them with the inferior belly button, maybe just because of peer pressure from the hot rod crowd they run with. I'm glad to see this is starting to change now, and the off brands and even the occasional straight six or eight are becoming more popular. I hope the trend continues, I'm tired of looking at belly button motors.

Dick Steinkamp
06-19-2006, 12:23 AM
quote:Originally posted by whacker
I'm tired of looking at belly button motors.


Then don't look at them. Misery is optional ;)



http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

DEEPNHOCK
06-19-2006, 08:37 AM
(Mote: Snide reply to a snide comment follows)


yada yada yada
Give it a rest.
EVERY chance you guys get, you have to chime in with the same old rant.
You don't know why he changed the engine, or anything about that engine.
At least he kept the Stude engine, and the new guy wants to put it back in.
Great!
But leave the rest of the gang alone.....
If you don't like pretty gal with breast implants...fine. But quit posting about your hatred of them every time you see a girl with boobs.. It does get tiring, and you only are talking to your own circle. There are a lot of other people here too, and your comments can be quite offensive to them.
I'll sit down now and be quiet....sigh....
Jeff[8D]




quote:Originally posted by whacker

There was very likely nothing wrong with the engine in the first place. For some reason, some people just like to pull them out and replace them with the inferior belly button, maybe just because of peer pressure from the hot rod crowd they run with. I'm glad to see this is starting to change now, and the off brands and even the occasional straight six or eight are becoming more popular. I hope the trend continues, I'm tired of looking at belly button motors.

hank63
06-19-2006, 09:23 AM
In addition to all the other valuable points, you could get the valve-to-guide clearance checked and the valve spring heights measured (free & compressed heights). A tired valve spring or a worn valve guide are no fun at all if the motor is in the car. A lot easier to fix with the engine already pulled apart.
/H

DEEPNHOCK
06-19-2006, 09:28 AM
There are several very good Studebaker engine parts suppliers listed right here on the SDC website. Rebuild parts are readily available, and the price of those parts is pretty competetive with what you would pay an engine shop for parts (with their markup).
The Studebaker engine has some very desireable elements to it, and only a few quirks.
One: Crank End Play. On a Stude V8, you shim the crankshaft for proper end play. A superb feature that is lost with many of today's engine builders.
Two: Connecting rod pinch bolts. This method works just fine, but the engine shop needs to follow the correct procedure...to a "T"
Three: Crankshaft bolts. They are different between and auto trans engine and a manual trans engine. The bolts must be changed with the rear main cap off (or the crankshaft removed).
Four: Oil pan sealing. More engine guys get this one wrong and end up with a leaking engine that marks it's territory every time you stop.
Five: This should be a given, but it is super important. Have your block cleaned internally within an inch of it's pores. Make sure the rear cooling passages in the block get rodded, blasted, poked, scraped, D&C'd, baked, and super cleaned..
Other than that it is a pretty straightforward engine to rebuild.
Options?
Better performance will be enhanced with a reground cam (and reconditioned lifters) from the likes of Ted Harbet (via Phil Harris at Fairborne Studebaker). Get an aluminum cam gear from them for insurance, too. Plan on putting a replacement fuel pump on too, and buy your spare fuel pump right away...and carry it with you.
A good valve job is a given, but spend your money on new guides and valves before you spend a dime on stellite valve seats. Unless you lug the engine up a mountain with 5 passengers and a trailer...you'll never wear the seats out on the Stude heads...
Installing a 4 barrel carb and intake will pep up your performance. Several people can help you out getting this swap done.

Good luck with your project. Don't skimp on the engine rebuild.
Do it right the first time and it will probably outlast all of us!;)
Jeff[8D]


quote:Originally posted by diodorus

I finally retrieved my 60 Hawk's 289 from the guy who sold me the car a few weeks ago. I had my doubts about the 289's state of health as the last owner replaced it with a 350. (I can't contact him either.) Well, after taking the motor apart down to the block (crankshaft still in place)I'm more confused than ever. I don't see anything wrong with it! No sign of heat damage, cyl walls smooth, heads and valves show no problems. So I guess the next thing I need is a compliment of gaskets and a manual or two. Here's where you guys come in. Where do I get those things? I'm new to the club and really don't know all the resources as yet. Of course any other words of wisdom at this juncture would be hugely appreciated Man that engine looked enormous hanging from that hoist.
jim

bams50
06-19-2006, 10:46 PM
quote:Originally posted by whacker

I'm tired of looking at belly button motors.


Where does that name come from anyway? [?]

I drove race cars for 24 years- almost always in Chevys... some Fords, some Mopars... but dollar for dollar, Chevy has always been the hands-down king...[^]

While Chevys have my utmost respect, I'm interested in Studes now; but can't see any reason to dis the best performance bargain in the history of autos- whatever hood they're under!





Robert K. Andrews Owner- IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2358680/1

PalmerGA
06-20-2006, 12:13 PM
quote:Originally posted by bams50


quote:Originally posted by whacker

I'm tired of looking at belly button motors.


Where does that name come from anyway? [?]I believe the term refers to the common-place practice of putting a Chevy engine (especially 350s) into just about any kind of car that was ever made. They are affectionately call "Belly Buttons" because... everybody's got one.

P.S. Don't get me wrong - the Chevy 350 is a great engine, as is evident by their vast numbers produced.

Jim's pride....
1963 Daytona Convertible

bams50
06-20-2006, 02:46 PM
Ah... Now I get it...;)

Robert K. Andrews Owner- IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2358680/1

Roscomacaw
06-20-2006, 03:33 PM
Give the engine a complete inspection. Then address what's NEEDED, no more than that.
We just had a thread of discussion here about this very topic. If you've got deep pockets, that's nice - but not every Stude engine that's been run some needs TOTAL rehab as insurance. I'm sure the parts vendors appreciate that approach, but I'd rather spend my money on things the car/truck really needs than just buying peace of mind.[:X]

I once dragged home a 56 Power Hawk that I gave $25 bucks for. It was complete in every way but had been left out in the elements for several years before I came to it's rescue.
The hood had been left in the up position and so the leaves had really made a mess out of the engine and it's bay. Looked really nasty.
ASSuming it was a tired engine, I pulled a head off of it to see if I could use it on another Stude I had that suffered from a burnt valve. Imagine my surprize when I realized the engine was brand damned new inside!!!
Of course, I was scratching my head over this one - why would someone trash a complete car with a brand new engine in it??? But once I got the engine pulled, it was revealed to me why the car had been discarded - the front crossmember had come completely away from the frame rails.[:0]
The point I'm making is that you can't just assume that because someone took this engine out, it's in need of an overhaul. Maybe the guy just liked Chevy engines. Who knows?
Inspect your prize and see what it really needs, don't just throw cash at it for nothing. Unless, of course, that's what makes you happy.:D

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

dclewallen
06-20-2006, 06:11 PM
Biggs, As to the addressing whats needed statment. While my 232 is out of the car I thought I'd freshen it up a little. It doesn't smoke, I'm not sure about oil consumption it does leak some but even though it runs very good it has next to no oil pressure [cold or hot]? Are there any specific things on a Stude. V-8 to look at to cure this [its the original engine with approx. 50,000 mi.]. Thanks,

Darryl C. Lewallen

DEEPNHOCK
06-20-2006, 07:47 PM
I agree with the sentiment, but there is a huge difference between analyzing first hand a Stude engine (with thirty or forty years of experience under your belt) and advising a novice (or non engine guy) as to what corners could be cut without seeing, or knowing what that particular engine even looks like. Cutting a corner to save a buck on a Studebaker engine could well be money tossed down the drain.
Good basic analysis and careful preparation should be the mantra.
Otherwise we could be seeing the next belly button conversion started because the results weren't exactly as described....
Deep pockets? Nahhhh... You can pay now, or pay later...
Just do the job right the first time...
Get a Stude friend to look at your engine and give you some good, first hand advice... Not slamming the parsimonious nature of Stude lovers (I am one ;) )... Just looking out for the long term investment we make on our Studebaker engines. If we keep patching the old one's long enough, all that will be left to rebuild will be real trash. Then the prices will really go nutz...
Jeff[8D]



quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

Give the engine a complete inspection. Then address what's NEEDED, no more than that.
We just had a thread of discussion here about this very topic. If you've got deep pockets, that's nice - but not every Stude engine that's been run some needs TOTAL rehab as insurance. I'm sure the parts vendors appreciate that approach, but I'd rather spend my money on things the car/truck really needs than just buying peace of mind.[:X]

I once dragged home a 56 Power Hawk that I gave $25 bucks for. It was complete in every way but had been left out in the elements for several years before I came to it's rescue.
The hood had been left in the up position and so the leaves had really made a mess out of the engine and it's bay. Looked really nasty.
ASSuming it was a tired engine, I pulled a head off of it to see if I could use it on another Stude I had that suffered from a burnt valve. Imagine my surprize when I realized the engine was brand damned new inside!!!
Of course, I was scratching my head over this one - why would someone trash a complete car with a brand new engine in it??? But once I got the engine pulled, it was revealed to me why the car had been discarded - the front crossmember had come completely away from the frame rails.[:0]
The point I'm making is that you can't just assume that because someone took this engine out, it's in need of an overhaul. Maybe the guy just liked Chevy engines. Who knows?
Inspect your prize and see what it really needs, don't just throw cash at it for nothing. Unless, of course, that's what makes you happy.:D

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS