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Champion51
03-27-2006, 06:05 PM
:) Goodafternoon Studepeople! My manual and the wiring diagram are completely void of "turn signal wiring". Need HELP pleeese! Now, took a peek through the window on the steering column and leading into the turn signal are seven wires. Haven't a clue what any of 'em do. All appear to be 16 gauge and they are black, orange, blue, green, red, yellow, and I think brown. On the motor side of the firewall the green and red wires appear and are disconnected (they probably go to the front). The yellow and brown wires head down and under the car towards the rear but are disconnected as well. Rest of tailight wiring has deteriorated or been ripped out. Also, I currently have 3 wires, a #16 green, a #14 black and a #14 red going from the front left junction terminal across to the right side junction terminal for the headlights and park light. Do I need a separate wire across from the left to right to carry the signal light current or is that done with the #16 green park lamp wire? In other words when the park lamp is on and I activate the signals, does the current travel through the very same line and over-take the park lamp function? There was no indication that a fourth wire was ever installed from left to right to activate the right side turn signal.
Could a good soul please describe the wiring chart, bearing in mind you are dealing with a "mechanically challenged" person. What wires(color)go where and are there any wires that change color in-line? The horn uses a #14 blue, but would it be this blue one that heads directly into the turn signal switch? Couldn't see another loose blue wire in the column.
Thank you so much in advance and I will be eternally indebted and grateful to you! :D

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

N8N
03-27-2006, 06:52 PM
have you looked in the "accessories" section of the wiring diagrams? before 1956 I think directionals were optional so they weren't included in the main wiring diagram.

I was going to direct you to the correct diagram on Chuck Collins' site, but I can't seem to connect to it at the moment...

nate



--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Champion51
03-27-2006, 07:17 PM
Thanks Nate. The main wiring diagram seems to show the wiring for all the other options, ie; cigar lighter, fog lights, clock, electric wiper, top control for convertibles but they didn't bother with the turn signals. Don't have an accessories wiring diagram in any of my three manuals. On E-bay I have seen service manuals for sale from vendor called EZ1-Wire. Would this info be in a service manual? Hopefully, some knowledgeable person will be able to help me out with this wiring predicament.

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

Kurt
03-27-2006, 07:22 PM
Did you look in the 52 section of the manual? That is where you will find the diagram. I went through this very same thing not long ago.

gordr
03-27-2006, 07:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by Champion51

Thanks Nate. The main wiring diagram seems to show the wiring for all the other options, ie; cigar lighter, fog lights, clock, electric wiper, top control for convertibles but they didn't bother with the turn signals. Don't have an accessories wiring diagram in any of my three manuals. On E-bay I have seen service manuals for sale from vendor called EZ1-Wire. Would this info be in a service manual? Hopefully, some knowledgeable person will be able to help me out with this wiring predicament.

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada


Hold on for a while, Dave, and somebody here with access to the right information will post. Things don't always happen instantly here.:D

I think I'm on firm ground in saying that the blue wire in the column is NOT the horn. Most Studes up to '56 or '57 ran the horn wire down the interior of the steering column shaft, and it emerges at the bottom of the steering box. The horn button simply grounds it.

The front signals don't use the park lamp filaments. Cars with factory signals used a dual-filament bulb, just as they often still do now. If your car did not have factory signals, it may have single-filament bulbs, and single-contact sockets. I recommend you open a lamp to check. If that is the case, you ought to be able to find a double-contact "pigtail"; the fiber disc with the contact buttons in it. You can also get 6 volt dual-filament bulbs that have the bayonet pins on the same plane, same as single-filament bulbs, so that you can retro-fit dual-filament bulbs to the park lamp housings. I suspect that this retro-fit feature is WHY such bulbs even exist. Of course, you have to insert the bulbs the right way;)

Hope this helps.

So you are in Smithers, eh? I've passed through there a few times en route to Terrace.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

Mike
03-28-2006, 03:59 AM
It's shown separately, on the '52 drawing:
https://www.studebakerparts.com/studebakerparts/parts/html/images/52acc-wire.jpg .
The turn signal switch usually disconnects the brake light circuit from the selected rear light; and connects it to the flasher.
Independently, it connects the front turn signal lamp to the flasher.
There are usually six wires: brake light switch, flasher, and four lamps. The stock dash indicator lamps are wired parallel to the front lamps. I have wired them to the rear lamps, so I could tell when the brake lights were on, as well.
Mike M.

Champion51
03-28-2006, 12:12 PM
Thanks a lot guys. So good to know there's people out there willing to take the time to help out! This is a great forum and club to be part of.
The information you've provided gives me a good start. Have a full size diagram printed off now and just trying to figure it all out. There are a few conflicts such as the 5-wire multiple connector, the 5 post junction block, the 2 - 3 wire connectors and the multiple colored wiring that's baffling me. And unfortunately they didn't color-code the wires leaving the directional switch. I don't know what that 7th wire going to the dir.switch in my car is all about? But I think through isolation we can figure it out.
It does appear then that I need the additional wiring for the signals alone on the front end? There seems to be no connection to the headlight switch that controls the park lamps.
By the way, I do have the new dual filament lamps and I understand that one filament in the bulb is for the 'park' feature and the other is for the 'signal' feature.
As you can see, I am quite naive in the mechanical/electrical aspect of this project. I truly appreciate all the help. And yes, Gord if you are through here again, be sure to drop in. We run a B&B and our front room is done in Studebaker nostalgia. Called the Ptarmigan B&B.:D

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

gordr
03-28-2006, 12:35 PM
quote:Originally posted by Champion51

Thanks a lot guys. So good to know there's people out there willing to take the time to help out! This is a great forum and club to be part of.
The information you've provided gives me a good start. Have a full size diagram printed off now and just trying to figure it all out. There are a few conflicts such as the 5-wire multiple connector, the 5 post junction block, the 2 - 3 wire connectors and the multiple colored wiring that's baffling me. And unfortunately they didn't color-code the wires leaving the directional switch. I don't know what that 7th wire going to the dir.switch in my car is all about? But I think through isolation we can figure it out.
It does appear then that I need the additional wiring for the signals alone on the front end? There seems to be no connection to the headlight switch that controls the park lamps.
By the way, I do have the new dual filament lamps and I understand that one filament in the bulb is for the 'park' feature and the other is for the 'signal' feature.
As you can see, I am quite naive in the mechanical/electrical aspect of this project. I truly appreciate all the help. And yes, Gord if you are through here again, be sure to drop in. We run a B&B and our front room is done in Studebaker nostalgia. Called the Ptarmigan B&B.:D

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada


Ill remember that, Dave. I remember flying out of Yellowknife on Ptarmigan Airways. There was an old tumbledown shed near the airport, and some wag had spray-painted on it the legend, "Ptarmigan Pterminal." I always got a kick out of that.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

N8N
03-28-2006, 12:40 PM
Dave,

if your car is an automatic, there should also be a wire to light up the shift quadrant.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Champion51
03-28-2006, 01:13 PM
Nate, I have a 3 on the tree so I'm really thinking that 7th wire is for the horn. I can't determine (at this point) what the blue wire is for. I do know that the horn wire is a #14 Blue. I'll look again, but I'm sure it is a #16 and why would it run into the signal switch.[?][?][?]

Gord, if you fly in, I'll pick you up in the Ptarmigan Ptaxi![8D]

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

cwinston
03-28-2006, 08:16 PM
Dave,

If we are on the same page, the blue wire you are looking at comes off the turn signal switch and branches off the main wiring bundle immediately after it exits the steering column and goes to the flasher socket. Just to make certain I wasn't misleading you, I toned it out with a multimeter. Here are some pics to help.
http://www.cjwinston.com/studebaker/1.jpg

http://www.cjwinston.com/studebaker/2.jpg

Champion51
03-30-2006, 02:00 PM
Thank you cwinston. Great pics. and they told a good story. It must of been trouble to pull your signal switch off the column. Thanks again so much for your efforts.
I followed that 7th blue wire out and it travels from the signal switch through the firewall and hooks up to one of the terminals on the O.D. kick-down switch. NOW FIGURE THAT ONE OUT ! It does not go to the flasher unit (but I have an orange one and a black one that do) and they belong there because they have a horse-shoe shaped terminal on the end of the wires.
My car wiring does not jive with the 52 diagram, but I've been able to determine a purpose and direction of the other 6 lines.
One very stupid question I have left is this. When the signal wires go to the left front end junction block, do they end there and does the "signal" current travel on the same line as the "park" wire across to the right side junction block? I would think that I need a separate wire all the way from the switch to the lamp fixture - but want to confirm this before I blunder into it.
Thanks again everyone for helping me out.


Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

Roscomacaw
03-31-2006, 11:52 AM
The signal circuit is seprate, all the way to the bulb (that is to say that it doesn't "share" a wire for the park lamps). The sockets have to have dual contacts in them to accomodate the dual filament bulbs and one contact powers the park lite and the other's for the turn signal filament.[8D]



Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

Champion51
03-31-2006, 01:00 PM
Thank you Mr. Biggs. That is what I figured - but just wanted to be sure.

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada

starlightchamp
03-31-2006, 05:41 PM
Look on the Flasher solenoid can's bottom and see X. L, P
The X terminal goes to the 6 volt hot lead coming off the ignition switch. It is a negative
6 volts. The wire from the L terminal goes to the signal switch center terminal.
The wire from the P terminal goes to each indicator light on the dash, one side of each socket which are wired together. From the signal switch, a "left" wire runs to the left, front and rear signal lamps and the left dash indicator lights other terminal. From the signal switch
a "Right" wire runs to the front , rear signal lamps, and the right dash indicator lights other terminal.. It's a simple schematic but not easy to describe.
Hope this helps.
Dick C.

Champion51
04-01-2006, 03:41 PM
Yes, your info was quite helpful Dick (Starlightchamp). Thanks so much - the picutre is gradually becoming clearer. Didn't even see those little letters on the flasher can. I understand and can follow the X and L terminals, but don't quite grasp what you are saying about the P terminal. If I'm on the same page, you are saying that there should be two wires in the pilot light housing and each housing has two separate terminals? On each, a wire going from the pilot light to the flasher (P) and another wire going from the pilot light which connects with a wire to the signal switch and a wire to the front-end signal lamp? According to the diagram, the rear-end is wired independently with a line from the headlight switch and a line for each signal lamp from the signal switch. Also coming from the directional switch is a line to the stoplight switch. My greatest confusion is with the pilot lights. I only have one line into each lamp and it sounds, like I've stated above, there should be two. If you could elaborate a little further it would be much appreciated. I know it's difficult to explain in words.

Dave D.
'51 4-dr Champion
Smithers, B.C.
Canada