PDA

View Full Version : 1961 - 1964 6 cyl ov engine



lvanw
01-01-2006, 02:38 PM
Hemmings Classic Car Magazine # 16 for Jan
has an four page artiocle on the OV6 stude engine
thought it might be interesting for stude owners with
six cyl cars
John

StudeDave57
01-01-2006, 06:01 PM
Not to mention the Stude notes on page 8 (about the museum) and 12 (about the '05 Crossroads Zone Meet), PLUS the 8 page Packard Hawk article and 6 page 'Designing the Fabulous Avanti' story, and 6 page Packard during WW2 article...
[8D]

StudeDave
San Diego, Ca

'54 Commander 4dr
'57 Parkview (it's a 2dr wagon...)
'57 Commander 2dr
'57 Champion 2dr
'65 Cruiser

62champ
01-02-2006, 03:49 PM
Am I the only one who has pretty impressed with Hemming's stab at a classic car magazine? Always like to pick up and thumb through on trips to the bookstore.



My brother's 7E7 - Restored by our Uncle in 1995
http://www.georgetown.txed.net/faculty/tippit/fuchs/Champ.jpg

raprice
01-03-2006, 07:42 PM
Champ,
No, you're not the only one. In fact, they already have a large following. I used to be a subscriber to Hemmings' "Special Interest Autos". That magazine was discontinued when Hemmings Classic Cars came out. It's a classy monthly magzine. What I appreciate in particular is the coverage they give to the independant car makers, including Studebaker. I get a number of automobile magazines and Hemmings is already one of my favorites.
Rog

Roscomacaw
01-04-2006, 04:13 PM
Maybe Bob Palma will back me up here or set me straight, but having just read this article about the OHV6, I have to wonder where the author got his "facts" from.

Right off, the article is titled "1961 Lark Six-Cylinder" While the majority of these 6s ended up in Larks, I doubt I could find any Studebaker literature that so addressed the OHV6 as a "Lark Six". This would have led to a conflict of purpose when these 6s found their way into Hawks and Champs![}:)]

Then he talks about the V8 getting all of Studebaker's attention in the early 50s. Actualy, the V8 served pretty well as it was designed - the only really BIG gaff initially was the problem with the camshaft. Once that was addressed, the engine was a durable, strong unit that didn't really NEED any modifications to it as it was. Granted, they did increase bore and stroke(s) starting in '55, but this wasn't because the engine was faulty in any way.
Besides that, the V8s initial design and development HAD to have been pretty well ironed out well before the '51 cars were designed. If that hadn't been the case, the 51s couldn't have been designed and tooled up for in time to make their debut in the fall of 1950. And there would have been REAL problems if that one-size-fits-all engine bay of the 51s had had to somehow ingest the old Commander 6 again![:0]
Anyway, the article alludes that this preoccupation with the V8 took attention off the venerable little 6 - a design which had been crafted from the beginning to power the lightweight wonder that was the new '39 Champion.
Yet the author gives the UNMISTAKABLE insinuation that the '61 engine's lineage starts with the 1951 L-head 6! What about the 6's being for 12 years before that???
There's also the statement that the earlier acquisition of the Packard Motor Car Co. and it's engine plant made possible "establishing a new production facility" cheaper and quicker for Studebaker. [:0][?]
All this is said or inferred on the first page.

Then under the header: "Engine Block", he again asserts that this is the new "Lark OHV engine". He says that this new Lark engine had a 3" bore and a 4" stroke. True enough. But there's never any mention that this was what the flathead had been as well.[B)]
The next section is"Cylinder Head and Valvetrain". He starts out talking about how the original head was designed in 1951 (again - what about '39???) and suffered from maladies that dictated an "Abnormal" amount of ignition advance as well as expensive, higher octane fuel. [?][?][?] this section goes on to read in such a way that you think that ALL the trial & error mods and the ultimate design arrived at were done to the flathead engine of 1951.:( Never ONCE is there a mention of OHV or overhead valve orientation. The accompying power comparison chart leaves you wondering just which engine he's talking about - or is it both???[:o)] There's also never any mention of the L-head's eventual increase to 185cu.in. along the way from '51 to '61.

Further sections tell of using some part of the V8's vavletrain, cam development, manifold development and changes to the oiling system, yet there's not a whisper about the adoption of a full-flo filtration to be seen.[V]
It goes on to tell the virtues of the little OHV - both in economy and performance. But a FORTY-FIVE percent increase in gas mileage for an OD-equipped car over the L-head version????? WOW! It purports that this was in South Bend traffic conditions. And I have to wonder how often they even got into OD like that.

Finally, there's nary a note about the head's delicate nature. Not one.
The concluding paragraph says that in spite of the Lark's economy being enhanced by this advanced 6, and in the face of competition from "the other Detroit automakers" it was not enough to reverse the eventual fate of the once proud Studebaker. And here I thought they'd built most of their cars in South Bend![xx(]



Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
195

BobPalma
01-05-2006, 04:02 PM
:) StudeBob's observations are certainly correct; the notations he makes are accurate. Not too much stuff that is blatantly inaccurate, but a whole lot of material that is right on -or just over- the edge. Weird indeed. [:o)]

As Bob says, it makes you wonder where this guy did his research. [?] Some things just don't make any sense, as if the 1951 Champion engine was at all different from the 1950 version, etc. (I wouldn't worry too much about the failure to mention full-flow, however, since the early OHV sixes weren't full-flow, either.)

As late as 1959, full-size Dodges and Plymouths were soldiering on with L-head sixes...as did base Ramblers as late as 1965! So Studebaker wasn't clinging to the L-head design all that much longer than some other manufacturers...in Detroit or Kenosha!

Overall, an odd mixture of fact and hyperbole that should have been run past a more knowledgable Studebaker person to be cleaned up and clarified before being published. [8] Good observations, Bob/Biggs.

BP

rockne10
01-05-2006, 08:53 PM
Hemmings' editor is a friend of mine. You guys going to send him a letter or should I refuse him his next beer?:D

Roscomacaw
01-05-2006, 11:08 PM
Tell me where to send the letter.[}:)]

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

rockne10
01-06-2006, 08:48 PM
His name is George Mattar and I have taken the liberty of forwarding this thread to his email.

BobPalma
01-06-2006, 10:22 PM
:) Let's not ride George too hard on this. He did a nice job on the one-page "Weekend Warriors" featuring The Plain Brown Wrapper in Hemmings Muscle Machines awhile back. [:I]

BP

rockne10
01-07-2006, 07:48 AM
George and his associates at Hemmings have been very kind to Studebaker, and orphan marques in general.

In our own club we have members who have had decades to absorb knowledge about our favorite vehicle.

We should certainly appreciate the writers who take some time in the four weeks between issues to put our marque before the public.:):):) That four week pressure is intense!

Roscomacaw
01-07-2006, 12:44 PM
I've been encouraged by HCC's inclusion of orphan vehicle coverage in their publication. It's downright refreshing to see an "old car" magazine pay as much attention to "them what was" as much as Furd & Chebby.:D
That said, "being kind" is nice - being accurate would be better. The author of that OHV6 article is a name I sure don't recognize from the Studebaker world. And while he may have been diligent in tracking down his "facts", it wouldn't hurt Hemmings to run such articles by ACKNOWLEDGED Studebaker tech-sperts to avoid spreading mistruths and better inform their audience.
Granted, the misinformation included in the OHV6 article is probably not going to drive anything to ruin at this point in time. But future writers will, no doubt, reference this little nugget of "facts" when writing something else - maybe an overview of late 20th century, 6 cylinder powerplants or such.[:I] This is how bogus facts and urban legends gain credibility.[}:)] And we Studebaker folk know ALL TOO WELL that ersatz info is tough to turn around![:0][xx(]

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

studegary
01-07-2006, 03:50 PM
When I politely wrote corrections to one of the new Hemmings magazines about a Studebaker article, I received a nice reply that included the statement that they would run future Studebaker articles past me. I have not heard from them since.

52hawk
01-07-2006, 05:52 PM
Next month they'll do an article on the ford engines in Studebakers. Or maybe a story about the '57 GT hawk...
On a note of thanks though,every time I read this forum,especially Mr Biggs and Studegary,and all you guys, I get more appreciation for how much I don't know!!! Keep up the good work.Studegary,since they haven't contacted you,how about supplying them with a link to this forum,maybe they would take the time to log on here and check out their facts???

Home of the Almostahawk