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robtc
12-02-2005, 02:51 PM
I just had the oil pan gasket and rear main and front main seals replaced. There is still some leaking from the front main seal.

I have read here that it can be difficult to get our studebakers to be leak free, but I was wondering what is an acceptable leak rate.

As the car (a 63 hawk) sat in the driveway, it probably leaked 10-15 drops in about 3-5 minutes.

thanks for the help.

CHAMP
12-02-2005, 04:31 PM
YOU MIGHT WANT TO CHECK THE FRONT DAMPER FOR WEAR. CHAMP:D

Roscomacaw
12-02-2005, 04:57 PM
You "HAD" them replaced? By someone who knows their way around a Stude engine or just some local mechanic?[}:)]

That said, the fuel pump can be an oil-leakin' son of a gun! It'll leak out the vent hole on top of the pump (OR at it's base if it's missing the gasket that's supposed to be there![:0]

Lookin' at drops on the driveway is not gonna tell you where the leak's coming from. You're gonna have to get up close and personal with a flashlight when you first park it to see exactly WHERE the oil trail comes from!:(

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

N8N
12-02-2005, 05:10 PM
If you're using the felt seal up front, I've heard it's useful to drill a small drain hole at appx. 5 o'clock on the retainer to allow the oil to drain out (I was told if you get it at exactly 6 o'clock that it might allow the seal to run dry if you let the car sit for long periods at a time)

Alternately, there are neoprene seals available, although none are a direct replacement - shims, silicone, etc. need to be used.

I'm told that one enterprising person is working on a stamping to replace the retainer that will properly hold a commonly available neoprene seal, but I don't know how far out that is...

good luck

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Mike
12-02-2005, 06:37 PM
There's a "C" shaped filler piece; at the front of the pan. The bottom 4 bolts in the timing cover go into it; and it holds the heavy piece of cork that seals the front of the pan. Often the bolt holes are stripped; and it isn't held in place very well. I understand it can be removed while the pan is off, without removing the timing cover from the engine. McMasters-Carr has thread repair kits.
Mike M.

Transtar56
12-03-2005, 09:14 AM
Oils still cheap enough,what are you worrying about the enviroment?

N8N
12-03-2005, 09:26 AM
In my case I have to do something; my front seal is leaking a quart every 100 miles or so :(

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

sasjdw
12-05-2005, 01:52 PM
On a related note, my Speedster w/ Auto trans also leaks transmission fluid. I called a local transmission repair shop that I have used before for servicing old transmissions (early 60's Ford) and he told me that he could replace the seals, but it would probably still leak if the car is not driven regularly. He further explained that since the torque convertor fills with fluid during driving and slowly drains down after the car is parked, a slight positive pressure develops inside the trans and the oil is 'forced' past the seals. Has anyone heard of this before? Now I'm not sure I want to spend the $$$ to fix the leaks. It is not leaking large quantities, it just drips a little, but over time, the trans gets greasy and dirty.

James D. Wilkerson

Roscomacaw
12-05-2005, 02:49 PM
Your "Trannie guy" knows not of what he speaks.[xx(][}:)];)

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

robtc
12-05-2005, 03:37 PM
I am not trying to be rude, guys and I appreciate everyone's input, but I was wondering if someone could actually answer the question that I asked. Again, I have heard that Studebakers tend to leak oil even after all gaskets, seals, etc., have been replaced properly. If that is true, what is a typical leak rate?

Roscomacaw
12-05-2005, 04:37 PM
A well-assembled engine shouldn't leak, period. Not at first anyway. But yes, they DO tend to develop leaks over time. There's a line we all use from time to time, with a wink or with tongue-in-cheek. It goes like this: "If it isn't leakin', it's probably outta oil!"
[}:)]

But 10 to 15 drops from a freshly replaced main seal is UNacceptable. That's why I asked as to the qualifications of the "mechanic" that did the work.[:I]
And that's why I said that it's time to do some investigative work on one knee to discern if it's REALLY the front main seal that's the culprit.

As another poster added, there's a cast metal filler block that would have been at least disturbed in the process of installing a new front seal. It's really easy to overtighten the four 5/16ths bolts that hold the timing cover to that block. Alot of unknowing sorts have just assumed you can romp down on those bolts with the same gusto as the other timing cover bolts.:( Not good! And once they're stripped, leaks will occur.
Further, if said mechanic reinstalled the timing cover and tightened all it's bolts up BEFORE reinstalling the crank hub - that can compromise the worth of a brand new front main seal.[V]

Another possibility - as I mentioned earlier - is that the fuel pump's leaking oil out it's vent hole. Most the "new" pumps I've bought lately have leaked almost from the start.[:0] But frankly, since I don't angst about spots on the driveway or the minor loss of oil over time, I don't worry about it.
I could resort to an electric fuel pump but I haven't yet.:D

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

robtc
12-05-2005, 04:41 PM
Mr. Biggs and all,

The last response was especially helpful. Thank you.

curt
12-05-2005, 08:52 PM
My fuel pump leaked oil big time, I replaced it last summer with an ORiley pump. No leak yet. Old pump pumped fine, it just should have been less agressive and only pumped gas. I might add the oil from a fuel pump goes all over the timing cover but favors the right side area, high oil and low oil, oil everywhere.

GTtim
12-05-2005, 10:32 PM
robtc, consider that when you are driving, the engine is leaking oil, the oil is being blown onto frame members and into crevices and is held there in little puddles by the wind. When you stop, drip-drip-drip begins and goes on until the little puddles are gone. So if you want to decide how much is acceptable consider how long it takes before you need to add a quart of oil or pint of transmission fluid. My Hawk leaks a bunch of transmission fluid and leaves puddles on everyone's driveway, but I only need to add a pint of fluid a year. The engine also drips some oil, but I only need to add a quart every two thousand miles. This seems acceptable to me. My point is that when the car is first parked it may seem like it is leaking a lot when that may not be the case.
Tim K.

Roscomacaw
12-05-2005, 10:55 PM
Tim's on the mark here.;) SO MANY times the rear main seal's grumbled about when in reality, it's the valve covers or the valley cover or even the distributor base that's leaking. The oil's too dumb to tell you where it flowed from, but if it ends it's trip back to mother earth by dripping off the rear of the oil pan, well! It's just gotta be that pesky rear main seal![xx(]
I recently looked at a V8 Lark that was leaving nice-sized pools under the rear of the engine when first parked. Predictably, this baby needed regular oil replenishment! The owner pointed to the puddles and groaned about having to replace that dad-gummed rear main seal.:(
Turns out, it was really the partial flow oil filter base that was leaking. It leaked at a pretty good drip rate and the oil ran rearward, along the left side of the valley cover, and then down the block's rear end.[}:)]
Point being (Tim's point) the stuff that drips off at rest is not a worthy indicator of just WHERE the leak actually is.[:I]

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS