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oldvinyl
10-22-2005, 02:27 AM
Hi To everyone, Aluminum Rods in general are not the prefered choice to use on the Street, However I have used Childs and Albert 150 series rods in my BB chev for around 25000 miles with positively no failures or distortion., C&A will build you a set of 150 series rods for the 289-304.5 Avanti R-3 engine. These rods will take 5000 HP and just do not break period. usually piston failures occur that create a situation that will break everything that moves, or not. The C&A rods may be slightly heavier than the stock rod,,, but it all really boils down to the engine balance proceedure. The Stude V8 can be really built nice. Cylinder heads can be made to flow very well. My engine has 1.89 inlets and 1.60 exhausts. Iam using a Victor Jr. SB 340 dodge intake W/ 750 holley dominator. Arias pistons and gapless TP rings. Dont be afraid of Aluminum Rods, Youll be using BB forgings due to the lenght requirements, The Stude also has built in Dwell angle that compliments the entire package. Remember the 6.inch SB chev rage of the late 70s???? Still used today, Stude had it all first. The conecting rod ratio is nearly perfection in the 289-304. It gives a more desireable piston speed at BTDC and ATDC much slower and this takes the snap out of the cycle. In simple terms it lowers tension/stress at lower to mid range power and thats why Studebakers ran so well. Some of the Studebaker Factory performance engines were way ahead of the stream of time. Chevrolet boasted 6500 RPMs all day long in their 302 Z-28 back in 68, Stude did more than that., and with longer strokes. I have seen other parts of the forums on stude Steel rods and if I were to build a decent street engine I would have the rods checked and bearings pinned, omitt the pinch bolts and use double spiral locs or circlips. the stock rods are light and reasonably tough, will take lots of abuse. Hope this helps , Tom.

DEEPNHOCK
10-22-2005, 10:41 AM
Hey Tom... Welcome to the forum!
(BTW, It's rod angle and not dwell angle, but we knew what you meant;))
Good info. Have you run a set of aluminum rods in a Stude engine?
I am curious to see how the offset journal part was handled in aluminum.
Jeff[8D]


quote:Originally posted by oldvinyl

Hi To everyone, Aluminum Rods in general are not the prefered choice to use on the Street, However I have used Childs and Albert 150 series rods in my BB chev for around 25000 miles with positively no failures or distortion., C&A will build you a set of 150 series rods for the 289-304.5 Avanti R-3 engine. These rods will take 5000 HP and just do not break period. usually piston failures occur that create a situation that will break everything that moves, or not. The C&A rods may be slightly heavier than the stock rod,,, but it all really boils down to the engine balance proceedure. The Stude V8 can be really built nice. Cylinder heads can be made to flow very well. My engine has 1.89 inlets and 1.60 exhausts. Iam using a Victor Jr. SB 340 dodge intake W/ 750 holley dominator. Arias pistons and gapless TP rings. Dont be afraid of Aluminum Rods, Youll be using BB forgings due to the lenght requirements, The Stude also has built in Dwell angle that compliments the entire package. Remember the 6.inch SB chev rage of the late 70s???? Still used today, Stude had it all first. The conecting rod ratio is nearly perfection in the 289-304. It gives a more desireable piston speed at BTDC and ATDC much slower and this takes the snap out of the cycle. In simple terms it lowers tension/stress at lower to mid range power and thats why Studebakers ran so well. Some of the Studebaker Factory performance engines were way ahead of the stream of time. Chevrolet boasted 6500 RPMs all day long in their 302 Z-28 back in 68, Stude did more than that., and with longer strokes. I have seen other parts of the forums on stude Steel rods and if I were to build a decent street engine I would have the rods checked and bearings pinned, omitt the pinch bolts and use double spiral locs or circlips. the stock rods are light and reasonably tough, will take lots of abuse. Hope this helps , Tom.


DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
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oldvinyl
10-22-2005, 04:08 PM
Hi Everyone, Thanks for the warm welcome. Con Rod Angle has been expressed in many ways. Duration is a time period. Rod lenth varies the time spent in motion in a given sweep, In our specific situation the Studebaker shines as in the critical part of TDC before and after, Shock loads are heavy on a short rod engine and this is why so many pistons come apart, skirt failure, ring lands so on. The Chrysler Hemi is a great example of good design. Installing 6.856 lenght rods in your BB GMC truck Tall deck 427 makes a stronger and more predictable engine. The shorter BB rods tend to take out pistons alot easier. Its easy to see what I mean. get a cardboard template and play with numbers, If you have a degree wheel this will help., build a cardstock mockup of a rod in say a 5.7 inch lenght, sweep it and watch the degree wheel, next with same stroke sweep a 6.5 inch rod, youll see that the piston sweep at about 20 degrees up is alot slower. this all translates to an engine that doesnt create extream forces on the assembly untill very high RPMs The design also aids in keeping valve train geometry cycle more effective at the upper end, Its like adding duration to the crank, not the cam. It really is a darn shame that the full potential of the Studebaker Novi was never seen, This was an incredible design and a few pushed over 800 HP. Its just not going to be very likely that an R series engine could ever match the way the Stude Hemi breathed.The novi bottom end was your basic stude, and here again was a fine example of smarts. Cylinder filling is highly promoted by slower sweep. The piston stays down a few milli-secs longer and if you are running a supercharger it should help you understand, also camshaft timing plays heavy here. normal aspirated 108-110 supercharged 113-114 is good. The stude seems to respond best to 108 and around 420-450 lift. Tom.

oldvinyl
10-23-2005, 12:44 AM
Jeff, I havent run C$A rods in my Stude, they will fit with little trouble. No wristpin or conrod problems period, C&A BB rods machined to a 2 inch journal size makes the rod even stronger, they were intended for 2.25 journals. Iam using a 3.25 stroke crank and any grinding for extra clearance will be minimal. The stude cavity is slightly larger than the SB chevy. Iam going to do a trial run soon. A bonus in Alloy rods lately is that a new breed of alloy has been patented that is 15% stronger than previous 7075 forgings. Cost is about $300. more per set. One new product is called Nasaloy. Its a very tough durable and stable alloy, I know that some companies are fiddling with it now. Tom

DEEPNHOCK
10-23-2005, 09:45 AM
Well, my question is still the same..
Stude rods have an 'offset' built iinto the bottom end to align the rod perpendicular centerline with the cylinder/piston. An aftermarket rod without this feature would put the rod off the cylinder/piston centerline a bit. I was just curious if anyone had run this type of rod for long duration (lots and lots of years and miles. To me it shouldn't be that big a deal, but, being the curious type... I want to know.
Jeff[8D]



quote:Originally posted by oldvinyl

Jeff, I havent run C$A rods in my Stude, they will fit with little trouble. No wristpin or conrod problems period, C&A BB rods machined to a 2 inch journal size makes the rod even stronger, they were intended for 2.25 journals. Iam using a 3.25 stroke crank and any grinding for extra clearance will be minimal. The stude cavity is slightly larger than the SB chevy. Iam going to do a trial run soon. A bonus in Alloy rods lately is that a new breed of alloy has been patented that is 15% stronger than previous 7075 forgings. Cost is about $300. more per set. One new product is called Nasaloy. Its a very tough durable and stable alloy, I know that some companies are fiddling with it now. Tom


DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk
http://community.webshots.com/photo/42559113/426827941Lsvfrz
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

Alan
10-23-2005, 01:26 PM
Jeff, the big end is .962 one side being .5295 and the other .4325 the small end has no ofset, so the offset is only .0485". the big block Chev. has so much mest on the big end it would be no problem.