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View Full Version : Do I need an electric fuel pump?



prager
09-27-2005, 06:58 PM
Hello all!! I am converting my 62 Lark to a chevy engine. I have the mounts from a 65-66 stude to chevy..I was told that the fuel pump on the chevy engine would not fit well with these mounts..be that as it will should I run an electric pump? And if so what kind would be a good one? I have a 600cfm Holley..Thanks!!!

whacker
09-27-2005, 10:51 PM
Yes. Get a Holley red and a Holley fuel pressure regulator. Follow the instructions.

DEEPNHOCK
09-28-2005, 07:50 AM
Just be sure to wire the electric fuel pump properly with a low oil pressure switch (so that the pump stops pumping if the engine is not running). We don't need to lose any Studebakers due to fires.
Jeff[8D]




quote:Originally posted by prager

Hello all!! I am converting my 62 Lark to a chevy engine. I have the mounts from a 65-66 stude to chevy..I was told that the fuel pump on the chevy engine would not fit well with these mounts..be that as it will should I run an electric pump? And if so what kind would be a good one? I have a 600cfm Holley..Thanks!!!


DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
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oldcarfart
09-28-2005, 08:40 AM
if you use the oil pressure switch remember to use a spring loaded toggle or push button bypass switch for carb priming prior to start.

Mike Van Veghten
09-28-2005, 09:34 AM
A note on the Holley pumps....
While some may work....for a long time.....most do not on the street. The design are so that they really don't like running a long time at a crack.
Also, what ever pump you use, install a good filter "BEFORE" the pump.

I've had very good luck with the Carter electric pumps over many, many years on the street. They are more designed for the street and long term running.

You still should also, as some have said, put a regulator near the carburetor. With a small gauge attached to the regulator, set to what you are using, doing with the car.

Alan
09-28-2005, 09:55 AM
I have had good luck with the AC also. The one on my 53 K has been there since the 60's.

Scott
09-28-2005, 11:02 AM
Is an electric fuel pump necessary when you have a carburetor at 600 cfm? If not, why use one at all? I've never understood the fascination with electric fuel pumps. They're annoyingly noisy, not stock, and just one more thing that could break.

I bought a 1947 Commander once that had an electric fuel pump with not many miles on it. I thought that was a good thing, but it was a complete failure. After I took it out and went back to the stock mechanical setup I had no more problems AND no more pump noise coming from the back of the car. Just becuase it's electric doesn't mean diddly as far as I am concerned.

Mike Van Veghten
09-28-2005, 11:14 AM
Good for you Scott.
I glad people can post their own way of doing things for others to read.

Alan
09-28-2005, 12:46 PM
What ever floats your boat or (Studebaker)

prager
09-28-2005, 01:46 PM
Ok, let me ask this question..Has anyone converted to a chevy, or maybe has a 65 or 66 with a chevy small block, does the Chevy mechanical fuel pump not fit well with the mounts or suspension? I had heard from somewhere that the fuel pump may hit something, or not clear, or something to that effect..Any truth to that? Thanks!!

Mike Van Veghten
09-28-2005, 01:56 PM
I would "assume" a mechanical pump would fit....isn't that what Studebaker used? I don't think they used an electrical from the factory.
I'd also "assume".....that a light hit with a grinder or file would help with most any interference of todays pumps.

I can't say on my Lark, I made my own engine mounting system and the mechanical pump does fit.

Alan
09-28-2005, 03:16 PM
Best person to ask is Jon Meyers in Ohio he sells the mounts and has lots of feed back.

Scott
09-28-2005, 04:54 PM
I am quite sure that the front end suspension components are the same between the Studebaker powered Larks and the 65's and 66's. If there is a difference I don't think it was done because of the position of the mechanical fuel pump. I have a '66 Cruiser and I had a 1964 Daytona. The engine bay looks the same to me.

Some people just feel better with an electric fuel pump. Heaven only knows why.

prager
09-28-2005, 09:27 PM
Thanks for the quick responce guys!! I would prefer to stay with a mechanical pump. I just wanted to make darn sure that it would work out as far as it fitting in..Thanks again guys!!

gordr
09-29-2005, 01:31 AM
If you get a Studebaker mechanical fuel pump for '65 or '66 Studebaker 283, it will fit. A CHEVY fuel pump that you commonly find at your local autoparts dealer may not fit.

I believe it has to do with the way the inlet/outlet nipples are "clocked".

In any case, it's close quarters in that department with the McKinnon block in a Stude.

In this instance, I'd go with the electric pump, since the correct mechanical pump is a scarcer item than the one which fits Stude V8s.

I'd go with a reciprocating bellows or diaphragm pump, like a Carter or Autopulse. Bolt it to the frame with a mount made of two pieces of old tire tread or conveyor belting so there is NO metal to metal contact to telegraph noise. Then ensure you have a ground wire for the pump.

Do provide some means to have the pump shut down when the engine is not running. People used to recommend a Vega oil pressure switch for this purpose, but I wonder if they are even stocked anymore? Probably the most foolproof method is to tee in a standard low oil pressure switch along with the gage, and wire it to the coil of a SPDT relay, so that when the ignition is on, and no oil pressure, the relay coil is energized. Moving contact of the relay goes to the electric pump. Normally-closed goes to the ignition switch (or any convenient 12 volt source that is controlled by the ignition switch). Normally-open connects to the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. That will allow the pump to run, despite there being low oil pressure, while the engine is being cranked. I just drew this wiring diagram out on a scrap of paper, and I can't see any "gotchas" in it.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

prager
09-29-2005, 08:57 AM
Thanks Gord!! I'm going just for kicks to find the mechanical pump, but if not, I'll use your electric plan..Thanks again!!

Scott
09-29-2005, 09:19 AM
I replaced the mechanical pump on my 283 (in my 1966 Cruiser) with an over the counter Chevy unit for a 283. It has no clearance problems. I don't think there is a difference in the casing with one for a "Studebaker" 283. It is possible, though, that the clearance is different on the 1962 Larks. I'm not as familiar aith them.

prager
09-29-2005, 01:09 PM
Scott..does your crusier have those stude to chevy wierd engine mount brackets? I am using those to change over the motor. Maybe my current pump will clear...If yours does, I'm hoping mine will do the same..

studeclunker
09-29-2005, 01:57 PM
Actually the difference between the '63-'66 Studes and previous Larks was cosmetic. According to the sources I have read in Turning wheels, the company could'nt afford to completely redesign the car in '62 (design year for '63-'64) so they just redesigned the outer 'skin' as it were. Yes the doors are considerably different, the sliding top and leak problem were added, but the cars were largely the same none the less. The idea was to present a more modern looking car. For instance, the front clip to a '62 will bolt right on to a '64. I haven't tried the champ yet... Gee what a thought? Maybe a Champ-ino? No, no, no, I've got it... A Caballero! Hey! I can't help that Detroit named all these cars in Spannish! :( But what the hey?;) Furd is named Ranchero (the rancher), Chebby named theirs El Camino (the road), Why not a Studebaker Caballero (Ka-bye-air-oh, Cow Boy)?:D
Oops![:I] Sorry, off track there.[:o)] Sometimes having a junkyard for a mind is a dangerous thing.[8)]

Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith

Scott
09-29-2005, 03:53 PM
I don't know, Prager. I'll take a look tonight and see if the brackets look "wierd". I know the actual motor mounts are regular GM mounts. I had to replace one and the local auto parts store had one. I'll also look and see how close they are to the pump.

Scott
09-29-2005, 09:37 PM
I just took a look a the mounts in relation to the fuel pump on my 66 Cruiser with the 283 engine. I wouldn't say the engine mounting brackets look wierd. They definitely look like they belong there. One bolt where the bracket attaches to the inner fender comes to a little less than 1/4 inch from the fuel pump case. It looks like enough room. What really surpised me is that it actually looks like the fitting for the fuel line going into the pump is resting on the cross member! If it's not touching, it's very, very close. I didn't see any abrasions, though and I have never noticed any clunking, even when my engine has been running rough. So, I guess that makes me wonder if Studebaker did use a slightly different pump shape than the standard Chevy one (or at least the standard replacement for the Chevy OEM pump). Hmmm.

prager
09-30-2005, 07:20 AM
Scott..thanks for checking that out..do you remember which motor mounts you used? I need to get a pair..Did you ask for the Stude, or is there just a generic Chevy I should ask for..Camaro, Monte? As far as the pump..sounds like I'm going to have to relly watch the clearance..Also on the frame mounts..Stude Intl.. has them in their catalog..I guess they really don't look "wierd" in the car, but when you look at them you can see the angle they jut out at to line up with the Chevy engine. Do yours have 3 bolts through the frame, and one through the center to the motor mount? Thanks

gordr
09-30-2005, 08:54 AM
Prager,

I haven't seen the repop frame brackets, but the stock ones are cast iron, and have holes for the 3 3/8" capscrews that hold them to the frame crossmember. The bracket is kind of like a 6" cantilever arm, which ends in a flat square pad about parallel with the 45 side of the engine block. The engine mount (insulator) has a recess in its outer side that sets down over that pad, and it's all held on by a long through bolt that runs parallel to the crankshaft, through holes in the pad on the frame bracket, and through "ears" on the base of the insulator. Look under the hood of any V8 Chevy to see how it bolts up. The round hole in the flat face of the pad on the frame bracket is not used.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

Scott
10-01-2005, 05:50 PM
Prager,

My mounts do have three bolts to the cross member (duh! I thought it was attached to the inner fender..) It's the same piece of metal the pump fitting seems to touch. I hope that helps.

prager
10-02-2005, 10:03 AM
Scott..yes that does help..Thanks to all of you guys for the help and advice..This site is a big help!!!