PDA

View Full Version : Edelbrock Stude. intake



dclewallen
08-26-2005, 12:07 PM
I recently e-mailed Edelbrock [used the contact icon on their web site] and asked if they would consider tooling up and producing a new aluminum intake for the Studebaker V-8. I recieved a encourageing reply from a Chris Wiesinger who said he would fill out a new product suggestion form with a copy of my e-mail. If anyone else is interested in this I would suggest they to e-mail Edelbrock. Who knows, if they see an interest they might build it. Theres always a chance. Thanks

Darryl C. Lewallen

Mike Van Veghten
08-26-2005, 12:50 PM
Probably won't happen, not enough quantity.........but I put in my request.

Transtar60
08-26-2005, 01:20 PM
So did I!!!!

Friday is for tilting at windmills<G>

60Lark
08-26-2005, 02:32 PM
I would buy one if they made one, so I to eMailed them

Studebaker Fever
60 Lark
51 Champion
Phil

Dan White
08-26-2005, 06:36 PM
Darryl where do you put in the request on the Edelbrock site?



Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

laughinlark
08-26-2005, 07:04 PM
I just sent them one. I hope I went to the right spot. I went to their home page clicked on intakes then tech support & comments. [8D]

laughinlark

dclewallen
08-26-2005, 08:08 PM
edelbrock@edelbrock.com

Darryl C. Lewallen

Sonny
08-26-2005, 08:50 PM
quote:Originally posted by dclewallen

edelbrock@edelbrock.com

Darryl C. Lewallen


I sent my request! :D

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Dan White
08-26-2005, 09:21 PM
I put mine in as well. It might be worthwhile for someone, like Darryl, to be the point person and find out how many manifolds it would take for Edelbrock to be interested in doing this. Then if there is enough interest we could see if we could get enough preliminary commitments. I heard some years ago that Edelbrock did a under radar effort for some Graham heads! So it is possible it could happen, Graham's are sure more rare than almost any Stude.

Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

Kdancy
08-28-2005, 06:00 PM
Just put mine in!! Might mention that I had an e-mail conversation with them about this same subject over a year ago. If enough show interest they might consider it.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
61 Cursed Purple Hawk
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT

Swifster
08-28-2005, 06:31 PM
I think the better way to go is to find out the amount needed to produce a run and then handle it with a group purchase.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Mike Van Veghten
08-29-2005, 09:27 AM
Lets get an actual e-mail list of some kind together.

I'll try to find out what their minimun quanity is and who to talk to.

I can walk it in the front door and maybe have a face to face with someone.

Roscomacaw
08-29-2005, 12:31 PM
I'd take one - or two[}:)]

Miscreant at large.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President 2-dr
1955 President State
1951 Champion Biz cpe
1963 Daytona project FS

Swifster
08-29-2005, 01:08 PM
I'll take two please. I'd also like two sets of those new highflow Studebaker aluminum heads too!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Dan White
08-29-2005, 02:51 PM
This is the response I got from Edelbrock, not a real surprise! Not sure we could even get an order for 100? Maybe you could talk one of the guys into getting a Studebaker at Edelbrock and doing the job under the table?

Thank you about your inquiry about an intake for a Studebaker, at this time
there are no plans to make this intake. We can fill out a new product
request form, but to be honest it does not look good because of the quantity
of these motor still around.

To produce a new or special intake manifold, it will require $100,000.00
for tooling engineering, casting & R&D testing to build this intake and we
will have to be guaranteed to sell at least 200 a year. I'm sorry to be the
bearer of bad news, but at this time it does not look to good for producing
a Studebaker manifold.

For any replies please include the ORIGINAL Email.
Thanks - Gregg Suyenaga Edelbrock Tech Dept.


Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

Kdancy
08-29-2005, 03:06 PM
Same reply I got. I really don't think 100 would be a problem at all. But the 200 a year might be.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
61 Cursed Purple Hawk
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT

DEEPNHOCK
08-29-2005, 04:08 PM
I have to laugh a bit here.....
Edelbrock would end up selling a low production run at around $350 each to sart....(based on some of their other manifolds)
I have sold almost every 4bbl manifold I modify, and it has taken almost a year to reach the 80 mark.....
And there are those that complain that $100 is too much money;)
You (we) would be better off working with a low volume specialty foundery to make up some sand casting intakes...
(Or just buy the adapters and modify a Chrysler)
Jeff[8D]


[quote]Originally posted by Kdancy

Same reply I got. I really don't think 100 would be a problem at all. But the 200 a year might be.



DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk
http://community.webshots.com/photo/42559113/426827941Lsvfrz
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

Mike Van Veghten
08-29-2005, 04:24 PM
I know a small aluminum foundry owner in Manhatten Beach, Ca.

What would you (any of you) honestly be willing to pay for a dual plane, level (may not fit C-K), fits standard head...manifold.

I have no idea what it would take to build the forms, but would be willing to learn.

Dan White
08-29-2005, 05:12 PM
Mike:

I think if you take out the C/K crowd the numbers would be too small to go ahead with the project.

Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

Sonny
08-29-2005, 05:19 PM
quote:Originally posted by Kdancy

Same reply I got. I really don't think 100 would be a problem at all. But the 200 a year might be.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
61 Cursed Purple Hawk
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT


I got the same bad news. Grrrrr..... I get tired of hearing about cost of the engineering and R&D and tooling and testing and yah-ta, yah-ta, ad nauseum..... They MADE Studebaker intakes for YEARS, just go to the frappin' shelf, get the molds, put em' in the fancy machines that they have now and build us a few hundred of EXACTLY what they were selling to us for years, that's REALLY all we're asking!!! It ALL boils down to X number of units per year, times how many years we can line their pockets, and you're right, we can't support their business/profit plan indefinitely. They would never DREAM of helping out a few hundred old car poeple, no sense wasting our breath any more.

All of the big companies suck when it comes right down to anything approaching REAL customer appreciation/service, I actually thought Edelbrock was different. It's the same old story, Vic Edelbrock, the guy who always portrays himself as "one of the guys", couldn't give a damn less about old cars, hell, ANY car for that matter. If Edelbrock Mega Corporation was popping out metallic nut suspenders for farm animals, Vic Edelbrock would be just as happy making millions selling nut suspenders! I get the message, "Can't promise to load up Vic's pockets for years? Well screw ya......"

We've been supporting THEIR butts for years, I don't wanna hear any more about being too big to help us out. I'm just gonna remember the reply from "the bearer of bad news", next time I need car parts.....

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Mike Van Veghten
08-29-2005, 05:41 PM
That (C-K fitment) can be worked out..

Second question - are you interested in performance or weight removal?
This is a design question.

I'll try to talk to him in the next coupla weeks and see what his thoughts are.

dclewallen
08-29-2005, 06:04 PM
I'm with Sonny's idea of Edelbrock just remaking the aluminum intakes they already have the molds for [a vintage series maybe]. Performance is great but a little weight off the engine couldn't hurt either In my case fitting under the hood of a C/K is a must.

Darryl C. Lewallen

Sonny
08-29-2005, 06:19 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mike Van Veghten

That (C-K fitment) can be worked out..

Second question - are you interested in performance or weight removal?
This is a design question.

I'll try to talk to him in the next coupla weeks and see what his thoughts are.


What?!?! We gotta pick just one[?][:p]:D

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Sonny
08-29-2005, 06:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by dclewallen

I'm with Sonny's idea of Edelbrock just remaking the aluminum intakes they already have the molds for [a vintage series maybe]. Performance is great but a little weight off the engine couldn't hurt either In my case fitting under the hood of a C/K is a must.

Darryl C. Lewallen


Ya know what really gets me about the whole thing Darryl? They sell intakes for AMC cars! Yep, how many 401 Ramblers do you think are still blasting around the good earth?

Something just occurred to me.... Mebbe these companies don't know, like a LOT of other people don't know, how many Studebakers are actually still around! That, and the fact that ONE single manifold would cover every single Stude V8 from 1951 up to 1964! Lessee, somewhere around 14,000 nation club members, (with at LEAST one car), AND all of the people who aren't in the national club! I'm willing to bet that Studebaker owners are the fourth largest buying group, and just behind the "Big Three".

Mebbe the "Prez" or somebody in the SDC should do like all of the other national car clubs do, send letters to all of the companies where we could use a break in the price and let them know of what our potential buying power is. Ya never know unless you ask the question....


Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Dan White
08-29-2005, 07:23 PM
Lets give the Edelbrock guys a little room. I am sure they think this is some joke, Studebaker has been out of business for over 40 years (I am not counting the Canandian stuff, not that there is anything wrong with that). However, they are making intakes for Pontiac Olds and Buick and those engines have been out of production since the late 70's. They just need a little information. Maybe some of the club members in CA could meet with them as Mike has suggested. Propose the updated vintage manifold idea, or even propose that they loan the club the tooling and we have manifolds made "under license" from Edelbrock at the casting company of our choice. There is something to be said about the design aspect however, Edelbrock has some of the best stuff going on how to design a manifold for the best flow characteristics and maybe they could do a little updating.

Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

60Lark
08-29-2005, 10:33 PM
What about Offenhauser, do they still make a Stude intake, if so how are they compared to Edelbrock ?

Studebaker Fever
60 Lark
51 Champion
Phil

N8N
08-30-2005, 04:18 AM
Heh... Offenhauser claims they make everything they ever did, or at least if you order it they will dust off the patterns. However, they apparently don't have any records of ever having made a Stude intake, despite the fact that I sold one to Dave Thibeault earlier this year :)

I don't think it would fit under the hood of a 53-55 C/K, otherwise I'd still have it. Actually I'm kind of regretting trading it now, my Lionel Stone manifold doesn't fit quite right.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Kdancy
08-30-2005, 05:48 AM
I would personally prefer a "modern" design aluminum casting. Otherwise, I'll just stick with the adaptor plates and mopar 318 intake. I'm saving a LS polished intake for my 53 because of the low hood line.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
61 Cursed Purple Hawk
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT

Swifster
08-30-2005, 08:21 AM
This could be the real reality when it comes to Edelbrock. I think they may have cleaned house at some point and the old molds for the Studebaker stuff may have been pitched. They may not be B/Sing about tooling if this is the case.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Mike Van Veghten
08-30-2005, 09:40 AM
Edelbrock, I believe never made Stude V-8 manifolds.

The Offy manifold is designed after the 232 heads. Ports are too small to be considered much of a performance manifold. I know, I have two of'em. Extrude Hone charges over $600 to open an aluminum V-8 manifold, (as of about 6 weeks ago). About 2 years ago, I went to talk to the guys at Offy. Nice guys, one even had some old Hawk parts at home. They told me that as some of the older patterns (mostly wood) get dryrot or bad in some other way....they are just trashed. If the part was still cast and slod, a new pattern was made. If there was no (or few calls) for a bad pattern......it's just history.

I got the chance to talk to the guy that has the alum. casting shop last night. Not cheap.............. We figured afterall the design, molds/patterns, scrap, machining, etc. For 100 manifolds, the cost would be in the $650+ each range.

I also found out from a reliable source that Lionel Stone "makes" very little on his manifolds.

Looks like adapters or custom like Alex M. did. I'm going to try to cut up a current manifold for it's plenum and runner stubs, make my own runner to flange section. Shouldn't be too hard. I just haven't found a used manifold with a small enough plenum and runner to match the Stude inches and RPM.

Kdancy
08-30-2005, 12:05 PM
Looks like adapters or custom like Alex M. did. I'm going to try to cut up a current manifold for it's plenum and runner stubs, make my own runner to flange section. Shouldn't be too hard. I just haven't found a used manifold with a small enough plenum and runner to match the Stude inches and RPM.
[/quote]

Mike, enlighten me on the plenum VS runner = Stude CI and RPM

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
61 Cursed Purple Hawk
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT

Mike Van Veghten
08-30-2005, 03:00 PM
Kerry,

Both the plenum and the runner size is/are based upon the cubic inch and the basic (cruise) vs. max. (all the way up!) rpm of a given engine. Depending on the manifold, cruise...like the dual plane types. Max. rpm, like the X design manifolds.

I don't know all the math on plenum size, but I do know how to figure runner volume. The "basic" sizeing of the port is obviously based upon the runner size in the head. Then there's an add in as far as the amount of taper in the port, and just like headers...the length of the port. I've seen Pro Stock manifolds with no taper in the port runner and some with a huge (3 or 4 degrees) amount in the port runner. No clue which works better on a small engine. My guess is a small (1, 1 1/2 degrees) angle would be good.

But again, on the plenum size....I do know the larger the volume, the higher the rpm the peak torque will occure. Given our comparitivly tiny engine size, the plenum should be....small. Small block Ford, small Chevy/Chrysler size that's based on the 265, 273, 289, 318, maybe 327. That's part of my current problem, all the manifolds I like (X style manifolds), the plenum's too big. 350, 7500rpm sized. I've looked at Ford and Chrysler manifolds, nice plenum size.....but the runners come out from the side of the plenum, hard angles to hook to the Stude head.
What I may end up doing is, getting a more current X type manifold and add some weld material to the ports and interior of the "box" to make it more fitting a smaller engine and 6000rpm. I tried getting Hogan (sheet metal manifold maker) to build me a plenum. They laughed at me!! "Sorry, we can't do that" was the answer.

Hope that helps some.

Mike

dclewallen
08-30-2005, 03:37 PM
Mike, I like your idea of a face to face with the guys at Edelbrock. Maybe,likes been said, They see this as a joke and don't realize that potentialy they could sell as much if not more than say the AMC intakes they do offer. One could also find out if the original patterns have been trashed and if not the minimum order # needed to reissue. Thanks

Darryl C. Lewallen

Transtar60
08-30-2005, 04:45 PM
Theres gotta be at least a 1000 Studebaker V8's out there still that belong to people who would like a little more power or little less weight or both. Maybe 10x that number. I know I have 3 in licensed driven vehicles and 12 or so more in various states of projects.

I got the same letter Dan spoke of. Maybe this engineer doesnt realize there are more than 10 or 12 Stude V8's still extant.

N8N
08-30-2005, 05:36 PM
I was told that the late Offy manifolds still used the small carbs but had larger runners for the 224/259 heads. Mine seemed to match a "normal" Stude gasket OK and showed no signs of having been "hogged out." I was also told that those were more rare than the early 232 style manifolds.

Did I mention I'm regretting trading it?

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
62 Daytona hardtop
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

Transtar60
08-30-2005, 06:33 PM
Well I wrote the engineer and he is well aware of Studebakers as some one at Edelbrock is a SDC member and perhaps reads this forum . Negative comments in this thread evidently wont help our cause.

dclewallen
08-30-2005, 06:46 PM
I just recieved another e-mail from Edelbrock that informed me of the right and wrong way of approahing this and that they read the posts on this topic even the ones that weren't complimentary [of which the e-mal had a copy] and suggested in order to get possible results a more positive approach toward Edelbrock by way of dirrect letters to Vic Edelbrock with a more positive spin would be better. [I inquired about the address] I was also informed that after researh the gentleman [Greg Suyenaga] determined that indeed Edelbrock never produced an intake for the Studebaker V-8 and if in the 50's they had the patterns used then could not be used in todays manufacturing process and Edelbrock did not do the casting back then. So I guess that means ? Thanks

Darryl C. Lewallen

Swifster
08-30-2005, 07:15 PM
Was there a negative spin towards Edelbrock in all this? Actually, I'd like to think that with their company as the first to come to the minds of almost everyone here, that this would show how highly we think of them. I was only half kidding about the heads. How great would it be to have heads and an intake??? So did I miss something? Was there another thread or threads that had uncomplementary comments about Edelbrock?

While I'm using a GM engine in the current project, I've started making an earnest effort to start locating parts for a '64 Challenger or Commander project. As mentioned, I'd buy 2 of each.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Transtar60
08-30-2005, 07:28 PM
See Sonny's post on page 1. Maybe that could maybe construed as negative.

Sonny
08-30-2005, 09:20 PM
quote:Originally posted by dclewallen

I just recieved another e-mail from Edelbrock that informed me of the right and wrong way of approahing this and that they read the posts on this topic even the ones that weren't complimentary [of which the e-mal had a copy] and suggested in order to get possible results a more positive approach toward Edelbrock by way of dirrect letters to Vic Edelbrock with a more positive spin would be better. [I inquired about the address] I was also informed that after researh the gentleman [Greg Suyenaga] determined that indeed Edelbrock never produced an intake for the Studebaker V-8 and if in the 50's they had the patterns used then could not be used in todays manufacturing process and Edelbrock did not do the casting back then. So I guess that means ? Thanks

Darryl C. Lewallen


Darryl, I'm sure that Greg's feelings have been hurt and I'm probably the main reason he counseled you on "the right and wrong way of approaching this". I apologize to you profusely for being put in the middle, (he never answered the email I sent to him), and for you having to field the hits that I made. However, (and this is NOT aimed at you in any way Darryl), this for Greg....

I'd say that we TRIED the nice approach, what does Greg call all of the members who wrote nicely to him to begin with, asking for help getting a manifold built? If he thought it would be better for Vic Edelbrock to make this decision directly, perhaps he should have sent all of our nice inquiries right along to Vic instead of effectively ending our hopes that Edelbrock would do anything for us by being "the bearer of bad news" to all those who sent their nice requests? Hell, I even made an offer to him to deliver an engine(s) to use as test beds, as they so needed. I would relish ANY help getting Edelbrock to see how serious we are and see a positive approach to the problem from Edelbrock itself.....

Also, I'm not sure how long Greg has been at Edelbrock, or where he did his research, but if someone from Edelbrock is reading this, please relate to him that I would like for Edelbrock to make me TWO of these manifolds. This is just one of the THREE styles of manifolds that Greg determined that Edelbrock never produced for the Studebaker V-8, (I'll just have to look a little harder for the pictures I have of the OTHER two styles that they didn't produce.....). See why a fella can get pissed with customer service? :(:(

http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/normal_6X101.jpg

Darryl, once again, I'd like to apologize to you, (actually to everbody on the forum), I never intended for ANYone to get put in the middle. I'm truly sorry because you're a hell of a good guy. That, and I do not want to ruin any chances that we might have for getting help from Edelbrock. Doggone it, if SOMEbody from Edelbrock is reading this, I even apologize to THEM for getting pissed at Edelbrock in public. BUT, instead of lurking, mebbe coming out of the shadows and taking us seriously, really helping, is another right way to approach this.

I would be MORE than happy to write a nice, positive request directly to Vic, hopefully we got an email address to do so. But by God, if a company has a motivated, savvy customer rep., that person would recognize that so many nice requests from Studebaker owners isn't any fluke or a joke, it just MIGHT be more business....


Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Swifster
08-30-2005, 09:21 PM
Well, I can understands Sonny's frustration if there were molds to use. If Edelbrock never made these parts back in the day, or if they had and stuff had been pitched in a house cleaning, then I would think that they (Edelbrock) wouldn't get that upset over a lack of understanding. I would say that if there is a SDC member there, a little bit of communication and explaination would go a long way.

I have one of there catalogs that I got at the NMCA event at US-131 Dragway in Martin, MI. I know I'll be using some of their stuff on my Daytona. It would be great to be able to use their stuff on the next project.

On the realistic side, one can never under estimate the cost of the R&D. They would need a typical engine (or two) to test with, as well as maximizing their product to the current available heads. Worse than not having a part would be having a part that's a waste of time. I like the idea of a face-to-face with the Edelbrock people as well.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Sonny
08-30-2005, 09:34 PM
quote:Originally posted by Transtar60

See Sonny's post on page 1. Maybe that could maybe construed as negative.


Yepper, it sure could be Charlie. [:I] I let my flapper engage when I should have had the clutch pushed in. [B)] Sorry 'bout that fellas. No excuses, but I have, and a number of others have, been trying relentlessly to get a number of companies like Edelbrock to help us out. After numerous turn-downs, the turn down from Edelbrock kind of lit me off. Sorry 'bout that again....

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

chad cassady
08-30-2005, 10:31 PM
Hey guys, I have to add my two cents to this as well. Ive been watching yall talk about this for a while and stayed out of it, but cant anymore. What bothers me is the approach that some people are taking and the response from the edelbrock guy. First off, with my experience with edelbrock and the "tech help" How long have people been using edelbrocks and carters for blow thru? After waiting on hold for tech support at least 20min each time I called, they snubbed their noses at me, told me it wouldnt work and even stalled when I asked for at least some guidance on jetting. Look at some of the blow thru newsgroups. Youll see alot of pissed off and frustrated folks getting this type of "help" from them. Definitely not a good experience with this company. And then watching them deal with all the collective interest in a new product that your emailing them in mass!!! And they have the balls to come back with a "be nice or we'll say no" type of answer??? Last time I checked this is a bunch of potential customers they are dealing with. And Id bet a lot of money that all of us both have brandX vechicles and like to aftermarket them as well. Believe it or not there are other options besides Edelbrock and thats a very important point that it seems to me they have forgotten. If they want the SDC community to bend over backwards and say please, deliver to them test engines and then pay thru the nose for a "low-production" expensive edelbrock product that they have dragged their feet over, this stude driver will take a pass. Id rather gather up 2 or three intakes, go hook up with mike, and learn to make my own damn intakes. If my first experiences with edelbrock didnt seal the deal in my mind about how much this company's "corporate culture" truly is different from its advertised, "multi generation small, grass roots company", then this outrageous behavior has done it. It seems to me that Edelbrock has forgotten that it has competition in the aftermarket biz. But then look at what they focus on... mass production of basic parts with exotics thrown in here and there that they can be sure that theyll be able to sell for a lot of $$. I can tell you right now, after this no way, no how am I gonna buy, recommend or suggest Edelbrock parts. If anybody needs help with any alternative, Im up for it.
P.S. Whoever is in direct contact with the edelbrock pointman on this one, ask him to cc this to Mr. Edelbrock.

Swifster
08-31-2005, 12:17 AM
First, I'll just say that blowing off steam helps nothing. I fail to see how that was constructive.

Second, I think we could all agree this isn't the 1950's, and Edelbrock is not a cottage business anymore. If they even think of this for more than five minutes, be thankful. Most large companies wouldn't take the time to discuss anything with 100 part runs. Ideally, a cottage business is exactly what's needed for this type of request.

Third, the purchase of Carter by Edelbrock occured long after Studebaker production ceased. Just about anyone you get on the Tech Line would most likely not even have been born when R2 and R3 Studebaker's were produced. These weren't the same carb's used, and Studebaker was the last to use a blow-through system with a carb from a US manufacturer. How many do you think have the knowledge to pass on words of wisdom from 41 years ago? I would think Gail Banks would be a better source of that type of information.

Modifying any car can have issues. Even when using current technology like I am, there will be problems. In some cases you have to come up with the solution for your situation. This is called hot rodding ;). 40 years ago there was no tech line.

Venting your frustrations in this way is not productive on numerous levels. Along with taking aim at a company that may or may not help, it looks bad in trying to get another vendor interested in supplying anything either. Even in a club setting, dealing with vendors require everyone to act with a certain amount of, for a lack of a better word, 'professionalism'. Even if dealing with valid complaints, you'll do better with honey than vinegar.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom - Sterling Heights, MI

Ancient Chinese Proverb: "Injection is nice, but I'd rather be blown!"

1964 Studebaker Daytona - Laguna Blue, Original 4-Spd. Car, Power Steering, Disc Brakes, Bucket Seats, Tinted Glass, Climatizer Ventilation System, AM Radio (136,989 Miles)

Transtar60
08-31-2005, 07:03 AM
Theres an old saying thats applicable.
"If you dont have anything good to say, say nothing"!!!!!

PalmerGA
08-31-2005, 01:08 PM
quote:Originally posted by Transtar60

Theres an old saying thats applicable.
"If you dont have anything good to say, say nothing"!!!!!
I'd like to add my two cents worth, but....

;)

'63 Daytona Convertible

dclewallen
08-31-2005, 04:21 PM
Got another e-mail from Edelbrock. The intake pictured is for a Cadillac and "Vic does not read any e-mails from outside the company so thats why letters are better". Then failed to give an address for sending letters?

Darryl C. Lewallen

dclewallen
08-31-2005, 04:50 PM
I did find this address on my own, Edelbrock 2700 California St. Torrance, Ca. 90503. I believe I write Vic a letter and let him know there are alot of us out here who would be very interested in new intake. Who knows????

Darryl C. Lewallen

chad cassady
08-31-2005, 05:17 PM
Swiftster, I think your right, it is hot rodding. Trial and error, success and failure are what its about. (at least for me). Im not trying to vent or blow off any steam in what I said. Its the approach that bothers me. If they have no interest in selling a certain product, then when did it become the consumers responsibility to persuade or convince them to? I would be very suprised if there were no other manufacturers/entrepeneurs in the world who would be interested in helping find a modern solution to this problem, be it a massaged remake of the original, an adapted system off of another brand or a full blown modern design for our engines. The main point that I am focused on is the approach/attitude towards Edelbrock and, in turn, their replies. I think that other options probably can be found and pursued besides Edelbrock and that a "thank you for your response, we'll contact another manufacturer" type of message would not be out of order.

Stude4x4
08-31-2005, 08:58 PM
What model Edelbrock are you interested in? Also have you considered the Weiand Stealth manifold? It has been my passion for years to hi-perf the Stude V8 and have done my share. Presently running the Lionel Stone manifolds, one of which I had to modify to make it fit. I am serious about the possibility of setting up to produce aluminium manifolds and also aluminium heads. But because of initial costs there has to be a genuine interest out there in Studedom. I have a small machine shop and am capable of modifying the small Chrysler intakes to fit the Stude. Anybody?

Varozza

60Lark
08-31-2005, 09:04 PM
I would want to know a little more as to what I would be purchasing, but I would be seriously interested

Studebaker Fever
60 Lark
51 Champion
Phil

JDP
08-31-2005, 09:06 PM
Why do we need another manifold ? We have the aluminum R3 manifolds, Dave T Bow has another style and the stock cast iron job works great.The old Offy's sell for less then a new job would cost on ebay too.

Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
64 R2 4 speed Challenger (Plain Wrapper)
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk

Transtar60
08-31-2005, 09:50 PM
JDP
Yeah but you have to have all the rest of the R3 stuff to use the R3 manifold? Heads etc??
The modified cast iron work ok but heavier than Aluminum.
Havent seen T-Bows manifold or heard about it.

T-Bow needs to do more advertising<G>. I'm still wondering about the new distributors you mentioned awhile back.

Sonny
08-31-2005, 10:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by dclewallen

Got another e-mail from Edelbrock. The intake pictured is for a Cadillac and "Vic does not read any e-mails from outside the company so thats why letters are better". Then failed to give an address for sending letters?

Darryl C. Lewallen


Thanks Darryl. Greg still won't talk to us here huh? Caddy my ______! It's a Studebaker intake and I'll find the pictures I have of the other ones they made. In fact, it's actually all a moot point anyway, instead of bothering Vic, we've found the answer to the Edelbrock/intake problem.......

http://racingstudebakers.com/v-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=197

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Transtar60
09-01-2005, 07:36 AM
Well Now Sonny. How long has this effort been underway???.

gotti210
09-01-2005, 10:17 AM
okay guys lemmee see if i can help you guys out a lil bit here

sonny will vouch for me im only 29 but a damm good shadetree and very educated in things that go vrrooooom and how to make them go vrrrooooom

im was gonna put a bbc in my 50 but a few cruise nights ago i ran across a guy that had a complete red ram hemi w/ a push button torque - flite

so i started doing my homework and talking with some of my mopar friends and they recommended a company for aftermarket parts
called hot heads research and racing inc.
(www.hothemiheads.com)

now some one has to make their intakes - valve covers and whatnots weather its inhouse or some outside caster and machine shops
my suggestion talk to someone there about maybe starting production on stude intakes and possibly some aluminum heads and other vrrrrrrroooooom goodies

this may be a good lead into goodies and it may be a shot in the dark but i know they manufacture hard to find & never before made stuff for hemis

they were the first person to pop into mind cause like some of the other threads here ive had run ins with edel too and wont do bus with again

gotti210
09-01-2005, 10:24 AM
bravo sonny i like it
lemmeee know what plays out on this cause my cousin is in the process of pinning down a 50 champ four door and on his wish list is a stude v8 so i know we would buy at least one



everything needs to go vvvvrrrrrroooooom

oldcarfart
09-01-2005, 11:38 AM
I cannot fathom a bunch of CMF stude owners buying $500.00 intake manifolds.

Sonny
09-01-2005, 12:00 PM
quote:Originally posted by Transtar60

Well Now Sonny. How long has this effort been underway???.


Heck, take a look at the racing forums, there's at least 5 guys who've been busting their butts for some time now, looking for and contacting different companies for upgrades, heads and intakes have been the priority. There's actually a bigger effort in progress for new heads.

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Sonny
09-01-2005, 12:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by gotti210

bravo sonny i like it
lemmeee know what plays out on this cause my cousin is in the process of pinning down a 50 champ four door and on his wish list is a stude v8 so i know we would buy at least one



everything needs to go vvvvrrrrrroooooom


Thanks gotti! I'm really glad to see that there really is interest in getting upgraded parts. Hell yeah, we'll keep everybody up to date. Hey, even easier, just keep an eye on the racing forums and you'll have the whole story!

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Sonny
09-01-2005, 12:35 PM
quote:Originally posted by oldcarfart

I cannot fathom a bunch of CMF stude owners buying $500.00 intake manifolds.


If everybody orders a couple they're a LOT cheaper. [^] That and they're not just copies of old technology.

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Mike Van Veghten
09-01-2005, 12:56 PM
What about the heads (R3 type) that Nimish (spl) was going to cast? Did he ever do that?

Sonny
09-01-2005, 01:12 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mike Van Veghten

What about the heads (R3 type) that Nimish (spl) was going to cast? Did he ever do that?


No, but there's been talking with Nimesh. I know that there's been information exchanged. It's a danged shame, Nimesh can make a pair of stock Stude heads flow better than R3 heads, but there's only one Nimesh and I think he's decided that he wants to basically reduce his Studebaker participation.

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Transtar60
09-01-2005, 02:33 PM
quote:Originally posted by oldcarfart

I cannot fathom a bunch of CMF stude owners buying $500.00 intake manifolds.

Heck Calvin I'm about the pennypinchest Studebaker driver there is and I would buy one. I'd be happier if it was a lot less but heck you can't take it with you.

Besides we are only cheap when buying stuff.<G>

JDP
09-01-2005, 03:26 PM
You can buy the aluminum manifold from vendors with standard ports, not just R3 style.

Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
64 R2 4 speed Challenger (Plain Wrapper)
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk

dclewallen
09-01-2005, 03:33 PM
I'd like to have one of these new manifolds when they become available. Keep us posted with the specifics. Thanks alot

Darryl C. Lewallen

Mike Van Veghten
09-01-2005, 03:49 PM
JDP

What alum. manifolds with standard ports?

The one that Lionel sells doesn't have standard ports. Just the last 1/2" or so is reduced for standard ports. The rest of the port is the R3 port.

Offy...got two. They're small ports, 232 size.

The three-2 barrel version isn't a good one for real performance, but does look nice.

I do have a 4-71 blower manifold....early Cad version!

Stude4x4
09-01-2005, 03:58 PM
Who has tried adapting the small chrysler manifold? How does it work as far as room under the hood and performance? Which model manifold do you use? In my machine shop I can easily manufacture the adaptors if someone is interested. I am going to do it for myself I just haven't had the time to start. Let me know.

Varozza

Sonny
09-01-2005, 06:06 PM
quote:Originally posted by Stude4x4

Who has tried adapting the small chrysler manifold? How does it work as far as room under the hood and performance? Which model manifold do you use? In my machine shop I can easily manufacture the adaptors if someone is interested. I am going to do it for myself I just haven't had the time to start. Let me know.

Varozza


That would be Jeff Rice, Varozza. He's been working on and trying a LOT of different intakes and combinations, including machining adapters for Mopar and machining down the air-gap style intake. I'm workin' on an adapter for the early Stude two barrel intake, (also with Jeff's help), so we'll be able to mount a Holley 500 CFM two barrel.

Not bragging, just relating what's been going on, but Jeff, me, Kerry, Top Gun, Chad Cassidy, laughinlark, and a few others who've adapted the Edelbrock for boosted service and racing, as well as others interested in higher performance, have been working for almost a year now on trying to improve the whole top end of our V8. It'a all available for anyone to read about on the Racing Studebakers forums.

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Transtar60
09-01-2005, 08:36 PM
I'd be interested more in a specially cast aluminum manifold for 4V and with the injector bosses, more so than an adaptation.
The lower the cost the more I'd be inclined to buy.

Kenmike2
09-10-2005, 10:35 PM
Hi Guys
As you know from my ad in TW I'm in the manifold modifying business, converting the 2V to the AFB style 4V. In the course of business, I have gathered up a few WCFB 4V manifolds that I'm reluctant to modify and I also have on hand an original old stock Offenhauser aluminum manifold. It's been modified from it's original WCFB base to the AFB base on the throat sizes only. The mounting studs fell outside the casting so one must use an adaptor to get mount bolts installed. I've run it on my Avanti powered Cruiser and it works fine. Weighs a mere 6-8 pounds compared to the OEM unit at 30 pounds.
If edelbrock won't support, let's check out China. I get literature and business requests occasionally from casting houses looking for business.

dclewallen
09-11-2005, 01:15 PM
I'm real reluctant to put on my car or buy anything for that matter made in China. Maybe it's just me?

Darryl C. Lewallen

Mike Van Veghten
09-11-2005, 08:19 PM
I hate to say it....but with all the talk here...Hot Heads, Edelbrock, Offy, the shop I talked to, etc., China is the cheapest place it's gonna happen.
And someone STILL needs to design and build all the patterns. And not only JUST patterns, but a properly designed manifold. Not just 8 runners leading to the heads. And since it needs to be designed fresh....a "wet flow" bench needs to be used. Not a dry system that is 60 tech. and still seems to be used by some.

DEEPNHOCK
09-20-2005, 05:40 PM
I dunno about that anymore JP....
After watching the last three Offy intakes sell for more than $500 each on Ebay, the world may stop spinning after all;)
Jeff[8D]



quote:Originally posted by JDP

Why do we need another manifold ? We have the aluminum R3 manifolds, Dave T Bow has another style and the stock cast iron job works great.The old Offy's sell for less then a new job would cost on ebay too.


DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
'37 Coupe Express
'37 Coupe Express Trailer
'61 Hawk
http://community.webshots.com/photo/42559113/426827941Lsvfrz
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock