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studeclunker
03-05-2007, 10:53 AM
The 259 in my Champ has been running exceptionally well for the past few weeks. Yesterday, it started making some odd sounds. First the occasional squeal. I thought it was the throw-out bearing at first. Then it whinnied when I started down the driveway. Yeah, whinnied, like a horse. Then it started squealing intermittently again. I got about a mile down the road and it started chuffing and losing power. It's been getting steadily worse. I can't even get it into third now. Oh, it'll shift in from top range on second, there just isn't enough power in the engine for the load. When going up the hill to my house I'm usually able to do so in second. Now it barely makes it in first.

The oil looks fine. It's not overheating. The choke baffle is wide open. What the heck is it up to this time[?]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

gordr
03-05-2007, 12:54 PM
First question: are you sure it hasn't got a brake locked up? That might account for the noise, and the apparent lack of power.

Assuming brakes check out OK:

1. Remove fan belt and check bearings in both alternator/generator and water pump. A bearing on the way can make noises like that. Check for both free rotation and side play.

2. If that checks out OK, pop off the distributor cap, and look for rust or lots of iron dust inside. Prestolites can suffer from advance weights swinging out too far and "milling" the inside of the cast iron case. Eventually, the iron dust will short the points. The engine might well appear to run better in the early stages, because it's getting more advance.

3. If distributor checks out OK, check the cam timing. Remove the valve cover on the left side, and remove #1 spark plug and insert a stick to determine the position of the piston (have a helper steady the stick so it doesn't bind and breaf off in the cylinder). Then turn the engine by hand until the IN OP1 mark on the vibration damper comes up under the pointer. If the clearance on #1 intake valve (second one in line) just goes to zero as the mark comes by, the timing is right, and you are done. OTOH, if the piston is near the top, and both valves are closed, you are on the compression stroke, and will have to rotate the engine another full turn to check valve timing. If the intake valve doesn't begin to close until well past the mark, your timing gear may have jumped. That sure will cause a loss of power.

4. Any chance that a baffle has come loose in the muffler, and nearly blocks the outlet? That MIGHT make squeaky noises as exhaust seeks alternate exits via leaks, and can really sap power. Try running the engine with the air filter off, and see if you get blowback or fuel "stand-off", like a little cloud of mist hovering over the carb inlet. If you see that, you could have an exhaust clog.

Hope this helps,

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

Roscomacaw
03-05-2007, 01:49 PM
I'm for Gord's idea of an internally failing muffler!:D

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

studeclunker
03-05-2007, 02:41 PM
I feel kind of like the bubble headed blonde in the sixties repair shop, "um, it's, kind of... well, like, making, like, well... funny noises. You know?"

I hate having to say things like that. I think you hit the nail on the head, Gord, for the squeak. So, that would dog it down, huh? I'll take the right front off, as that seems to be where it's all coming from. Just what I need.[V] Hmmm... You know, I could replace that muffler too...

Good news is that I got the parts from SI today to get Bess going again! [b]Woo, Hoo!:D:D

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

studeclunker
03-05-2007, 03:56 PM
Oh Joy![xx(] Oh ecstacy![xx(] Oh boy![:0][B)][}:)] IIIII'm in trouble![}:)][xx(]

Pulled that right front wheel off and gueeeeess what? The bearing is what the problem was. And just to make this prize a little sweeter, we're going to make that bearing race stiiiiick to the spindle! Oi.[V] Okay, I have pick-a-truck here (good thing no one wanted him). But Pick-a was a six. Are the spindles different? How about the brakes? They look the same, but are they[?][?] This is all I needed. Oh well. On the bright side, at least I'm not two hundred miles out in the middle of no-where. Oi, Vay.[:o)]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

Transtar60
03-05-2007, 04:41 PM
What year is your Champ(s)??
All the half tons are same regardless of engine, except there was a change during 8E production. And there are rights and lefts.
So if your parts truck is of similiar vintage, your good to go.

http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10056/5E13%20Pic%203.JPG
3E38
4E2
4E28
5E13
7E7
8E7
8E12
8E28
4E2
59 Lark
etc

studeclunker
03-05-2007, 06:21 PM
Thanks, Transtar. That's a great relief and load off my mind. I know that with the cars, there's considerable differences between the sixes and eights. Yes, both trucks are '62s. However, the V8 is an E7 and the six is an E5. Still compatible, I hope...

Anyone have any ideas on how to break loose this bearing race[?]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

N8N
03-05-2007, 06:27 PM
Ron,

if you mean the inner race is stuck to the spindle, you may be looking at swapping spindles. Even if you get it off, if it's spun hard enough to "weld" itself to the spindle, the spindle will be undersized and possibly weakened when you get it off. I'm sure you can find another spindle if you want to keep your other truck mobile.

good luck,

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

studeclunker
03-05-2007, 07:55 PM
Hmmm... good point Nate. Still, it wasn't quite welded on. I was able to turn it with a BIG pipe wrench. So I cut the race and drove the two sides apart with a cold chisel and it slid right off. I took the race off the other Champ and it fit right on. It might be a good idea to switch spindles. Right now though, the status quo will have to do. I put it back together before reading your post Nate.

Hopefully, that's the entire problem. You fellas are the cat's whiskers, you know that, dont you?
Thanks for the help!


http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

53k
03-05-2007, 08:32 PM
quote:Originally posted by studeclunker

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3]Hmmm... good point Nate. Still, it wasn't quite welded on. I was able to turn it with a BIG pipe wrench. So I cut the race and drove the two sides apart with a cold chisel and it slid right off. I took the race off the other Champ and it fit right on. It might be a good idea to switch spindles. Right now though, the status quo will have to do. I put it back together before reading your post Nate. ...

Even if it wasn't welded on, look for discoloration of the spindle. If it shows any, don't use it. It may be dangerously weakened.


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine

Transtar60
03-05-2007, 09:33 PM
Yep Clunker both trucks have the same spindles
Remember there is left and rights.
Like I said earlier, at least '57-63 are same, whether V8 or 6.
Studebaker should have taken this approach with their cars.
Would have saved them stocking all those extra parts. Like using Dana 44s for everything carwise instead of having Dana 27's,Dana 23s and Dana 44s



quote:Originally posted by studeclunker

Thanks, Transtar. That's a great relief and load off my mind. I know that with the cars, there's considerable differences between the sixes and eights. Yes, both trucks are '62s. However, the V8 is an E7 and the six is an E5. Still compatible, I hope...

Anyone have any ideas on how to break loose this bearing race[?]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?


http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10056/5E13%20Pic%203.JPG
3E38
4E2
4E28
5E13
7E7
8E7
8E12
8E28
4E2
59 Lark
etc

Roscomacaw
03-05-2007, 11:27 PM
Well, in a sense, you've edookated me a bit, Clunk. If'n any of my Studes lets out with a Whinney, I'll know not to horse around with the exhaust system! It'll be off to the races for me![:0][:p]:D

Mr Ed! Oh Mr. Ed!!![:I]

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

Dick Steinkamp
03-05-2007, 11:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

Well, in a sense, you've edookated me a bit, Clunk. If'n any of my Studes lets out with a Whinney, I'll know not to horse around with the exhaust system! It'll be off to the races for me![:0][:p]:D

Mr Ed! Oh Mr. Ed!!![:I]


I figured it was about time for us to get saddled with some of your warped humor, Biggs.

[:o)]

http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

studeclunker
03-05-2007, 11:58 PM
Ya know, Biggsie? I kinda knew you'd say something like that! (LOL):D:D As the truck made that sound I thought 'What the heck was that[?][:0] I knew they sponsord Mr. Ed, but really...'

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/studebaby/54wagonblue-2.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

Roscomacaw
03-06-2007, 12:20 AM
DS writes: "I figured it was about time for us to get saddled with some of your warped humor, Biggs"

Mr Ed says: "Nag, nag, nag... My humor spurs comments every time. The mane thing is you get a kick out of it, Dickey boy. I did a gallop pole the other day and the results were that folks were foaling all over themselves with laughter. Maybe you hadn't herd. Or maybe you've been too busy checkin' out some cute little Mustang.[}:)]

eh... ah, Wilburrr - be sure ta lock the Wagonaire's roof in the forward position. I'd hate to see you end up with a headless horse man.[8]

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

hank63
03-06-2007, 08:30 AM
"Occasional squeal, whinnied, more squealing followed by chuffing"
Mate, don't take your mother in-law, send her off in a cab.
/H

John Kirchhoff
03-06-2007, 09:52 AM
Hank, you Aussie's have a unique sense of humor which is somehting I can appreciate (My fiancee is Aussie). However, Mr. Biggs concerns and confuses me!!!!!

N8N
03-06-2007, 11:24 AM
Transtar60 - wouldn't it have been nice to have 11/10 inch finned drums on everything too!

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Dick Steinkamp
03-06-2007, 11:36 AM
quote:Originally posted by hank63

"Occasional squeal, whinnied, more squealing followed by chuffing"
Mate, don't take your mother in-law, send her off in a cab.


:D


(thanks a lot, Hank. I just spewed coffee all over my monitor [:0])

http://thenobot.org/images/s2d/s2d_01.jpg

Roscomacaw
03-06-2007, 11:58 AM
LOL!!! Same here! Mopping up desktop.[xx(]Thanks Hank!

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle
http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/906179/2006/12/7/truckonhill3.jpg

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

Transtar60
03-06-2007, 02:01 PM
quote:Originally posted by N8N

Transtar60 - wouldn't it have been nice to have 11/10 inch finned drums on everything too!

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Or 12/11 or 13/12 in the case of trucks 1/2 and 3/4 ton N8.


http://racingstudebakers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10056/5E13%20Pic%203.JPG
3E38
4E2
4E28
5E13
7E7
8E7
8E12
8E28
4E2
59 Lark
etc

studeclunker
03-17-2007, 02:16 AM
Ok, official diagnosis: fouled plugs caused by too large 4bbl. and bad right outside bearing.

Cure: New plugs and bearing. Truck has been christened; Mr. Ed.

A horse is a horse, of course, of course...[:o)]

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/december%2006/HPIM0234.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Home of the incredible Mr. Ed!
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?