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65cruiser
05-16-2005, 07:07 AM
Since I bought my Studebaker, I've been buying some tools I need to tune this thing up. I bought a new Craftsman Penske timing light and a used Snap On dwell/tach meter on Ebay.

How do I hook up the Snap On? There are three leads (I'm assuming these things are all alike). Red, Black and Yellow. I can guess where the red and black go, but the yellow?

Also, can someone explain Dwell in layman's terms? I'm assuming it doesn't mean I have to try and live in the distributor. Get it, live in, dwell, oh well;)

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

Justin53
05-16-2005, 07:35 AM
The yellow wire clips onto the ignition coil at the same termimal as the little wire that runs to the distributor. NOT the fat wire in the center that goes to the center of the distributor, but a thinner (14 gauge?) wire that screws onto a terminal to the side of the fat sparkplug-like wire in the center.

I just had a refresher in this tuning up my Stude. Good Luck

Justin

Sonny
05-16-2005, 02:00 PM
quote:Originally posted by 65cruiser

Since I bought my Studebaker, I've been buying some tools I need to tune this thing up. I bought a new Craftsman Penske timing light and a used Snap On dwell/tach meter on Ebay.

How do I hook up the Snap On? There are three leads (I'm assuming these things are all alike). Red, Black and Yellow. I can guess where the red and black go, but the yellow?

Also, can someone explain Dwell in layman's terms? I'm assuming it doesn't mean I have to try and live in the distributor. Get it, live in, dwell, oh well;)

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser


It's easy Mark, and I'm really glad to hear that you got a good dwell meter. A dwell meter is really the ONLY correct way to set points. As you guessed, the red wire goes to the positive terminal on the battery and the black wire goes to the negative terminal. As Justin has said, the yellow lead should be connected, (on a negative ground system), on the coil, on the negative post, (the same post that the distributor wire is connected to). On a positive ground system, it goes on the positive post on the coil.

Also, when setting dwell, you'll usually see a "range" suggested for the dwell, (i.e., 28-32 degrees), you always want to set the dwell "in the middle" of whatever range is suggested.

The concept of dwell is simple, when the points open and close, they allow the coil to energize, (build energy), and then release energy through the cap, rotor, into the spark plug wires to the spark plugs at the necessary rate and at the right time. How long the points stay closed is the DWELL, (or more correctly, dwell angle or dwell period).

The dwell numbers are given in distributor shaft degrees, because that's the number of degrees the breaker cam, (the big, oddly shaped piece in the center of the distributor that the points arm rubs against), rotates from the time the breaker points close until they open again.

Too much dwell can cause a late spark, rough running, restricted RPM, early point and condenser failures. Too little dwell causes a weak spark, overheated points, (making them "stuck" points), poor engine performance, and more.

I'd like to suggest that you don't waste your time trying to set bad points. You MUST start with a good set of points to get it right. Meaning, pull that point set out and look carefully at the point contact surfaces themselves AND VERY carefully check the little "block" or the little bit of material that actually rubs against the breaker cam. If the points have ever overheated or are well worn, that little bit of material will foil all your best attempts at keeping the car running right. On the cheap point sets, the rub material is plastic and actually melts. The rub block should have a pronounced "peak" where it touches the cam! Using a new or very good point set is simply cheap insurance.

What's a useable points set? The contacts should be perfectly flat, (no peaks or craters in either surface), have enough "meat", (thickness of the point contact surfaces), aligned as perfectly as possible, enough "meat" with a nice pronounced peak on the rub block, and no oil residue anywhere on the whole set.

Before I install the points I use compressed air to completely blow out any junk in the distributor. I spray the whole point set, distributor cap and rotor with something like "Brake Kleen", blow them off with compresses air too and rub a VERY tiny amount of dielectric grease, (available in tiny, single application packages at ANY FLAPS), on the breaker cam before I install the points.

Do NOT spray ANY cleaner into the distributor, it has bushings under the breaker plate and if it pools down there and you don't get it all out, you're screwed. Some of our distributors have an oil port built right into the outside of the di

65cruiser
05-16-2005, 02:48 PM
Sonny,

Thank you so much!:D I can't wait to get home today to set my dwell! Great information.

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

65cruiser
05-16-2005, 05:05 PM
Okay, I got home today, popped the hood on the Cruiser and hooked up all my new "toys". First, I checked my dwell. It was WAY off (still is). It's showing 41 and the shop manual calls for 31-34. I don't have new points yet (they're coming tomorrow). Then, I decided to check my timing. Wow, it was set at like 2" AFTER TDC when it should be 8 BTDC. So, I reset that. Of course, that screwed up the idle, so I set that.

Already, she runs like a scalded cat. Before, she had very little pickup, but I just attributed that to the little 194 six. Totally different now. I may have to retard the timing just a hair because under to the floor acceleration I get just a hint of ping for a second or two. I'm going to bet my gas mileage goes up too (which hasn't been good). I've only been able to squeeze about 16 mpg out of the old girl so far.

I'm having too darn much fun with this car:)

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

Sonny
05-16-2005, 08:26 PM
quote:Originally posted by 65cruiser

Okay, I got home today, popped the hood on the Cruiser and hooked up all my new "toys". First, I checked my dwell. It was WAY off (still is). It's showing 41 and the shop manual calls for 31-34. I don't have new points yet (they're coming tomorrow). Then, I decided to check my timing. Wow, it was set at like 2" AFTER TDC when it should be 8 BTDC. So, I reset that. Of course, that screwed up the idle, so I set that.

Already, she runs like a scalded cat. Before, she had very little pickup, but I just attributed that to the little 194 six. Totally different now. I may have to retard the timing just a hair because under to the floor acceleration I get just a hint of ping for a second or two. I'm going to bet my gas mileage goes up too (which hasn't been good). I've only been able to squeeze about 16 mpg out of the old girl so far.

I'm having too darn much fun with this car:)

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser


Great! Sounds like you've got it down already Mark! Just one little problem though, you can't get the timing right unless that dwell is right, that's probably why you have that touch of ping. What I didn't tell you is that the dwell, when expressed in degrees, ALSO means crank degrees. Dwell greatly effects engine timing.

The way to do a good tune up is to set dwell first, set timing next, adjust the carb last.

So, jump right back in there, even though they might not be the best points in the world, and "practice" setting the points. It's sort of a PITA on the 6 cylinders, (ya just can't see anything while you're doing it).

It takes a touch of finesse and practice, but the best way to set that dwell is get yourself a remote starter switch, (at the good ol' FLAPS), connect it to the solenoid, (two wires, one on the big positive post and one on the small post on the front of the solenoid), pull the coil wire, loosen the screw on the points until you can JUST open/close the points to make the adjustment, stick a flat screw driver down in there in between the two little "raised buttons" on the breaker plate and the tiny slot in the end of the points, hit the remote starter and twist the screw driver slowly one way or another until you get the dwell right on, (I'd set 'em at 32).

One BIG note, when you set the dwell then retighten the screw on the points, make SURE to check the dwell again. The dwell's been known to change when ya tighten that dam screw down. I've actually had to set them a touch low or high to get the right dwell when I tighten them down, it's not all that unusual.

Also, while I'm thinking about it, try not to have the screw so tight on the points while you're adjusting them that you move the breaker plate too, that can drive ya nuts. ;)

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

65cruiser
05-16-2005, 08:52 PM
Guess what else I discovered? You can't set the dwell on a 6 cylinder. Only the gap. Once the gap is set, that's what sets the dwell--there is no further adjustment. If the dwell is off, then you have to check the gap again. I took that right out of the shop manual. So, if my dwell is off, my gap is probably wrong. So, tomorrow I'll be going through all of that, replacing the points, then rechecking the timing.

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

Sonny
05-16-2005, 11:04 PM
quote:Originally posted by 65cruiser

Guess what else I discovered? You can't set the dwell on a 6 cylinder. Only the gap. Once the gap is set, that's what sets the dwell--there is no further adjustment. If the dwell is off, then you have to check the gap again. I took that right out of the shop manual. So, if my dwell is off, my gap is probably wrong. So, tomorrow I'll be going through all of that, replacing the points, then rechecking the timing.

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser


Mark, I gotta tell ya, ya just tickled the HELL right out'a me with this one! Carefully read what you wrote. That's what we've been talkin' about partner, setting the points gap sets the dwell. Thing of it is, you can set the gap with a feeler gauge and that does set the dwell, but to set the gap with a feeler gauge you do almost the same procedure as you would if you're setting the dwell with the meter. The dwell meter gives you a hundred times more accurate way to set the gap. ;)

I DO have to say that setting the point gap with a feeler gauge is a LOT more of a PITA than using the dwell meter. You MUST get that gap with the feeler gauge perfect to come close to how accurate the dwell meter can get it. But in fact, that may not even be enough. The static procedure used to set the gap with a feeler gauge requires you to set the rub block on the points arm right on one of the corners of the breaker cam. Thatís fine, except that the point gap is now set perfectly for that one corner, no help if you have wear on the others, OR if thereís a little wobble in the distributor shaft.

The dwell meter gives you a dynamic look, or setting, of all the corners. It will also show you if you have excessive wear in the distributor shaft by a fluctuating needle on your meter as you turn the engine to set the dwell.

I'm just pickin' on you a little Mark, [:o)], but I'm damn sure proud of you for tackling something, (and doing it right), that most avoid like the plague, or just think they know how itís done. You hang right in there partner, you're learning fast, pretty soon you'll be tellin' people how to set the dwell/gap, gap/dwell, the RIGHT way![^]


Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Danarchy
05-16-2005, 11:20 PM
Electronic Ignition. (Pertronix,Crane,MSD....) Still looks original, No more headaches! :)

Dallas,Texas

65cruiser
05-17-2005, 07:58 AM
Sonny,

I'm happy for the great explanations I've gotten here. It's been years since I fooled with a points car. The last one I had was back in 1975 (1966 Ford Econoline). I finally put electronic ignition in that one, but prior to that my dad always helped me tune it up. Now, he doesn't remember how to do it:)

The shop manual is the greatest little book. It explains everything SO well (just not how to hookup the dwell meter). I've not replaced or adjusted the points yet. I think I'm going to do a complete tune up (plugs, points, dist cap & rotor, etc) just so I know where everything is on this car. I have no idea when these pieces were replaced. I do have a slight low speed miss at idle, but don't know if that's in the ignition or the carb. I'll find it.

ANYWAY, I reset the timing last night and got that right on the money. I know I'll need to check that after I reset/replace the points, but the car runs a lot better (not that it ran badly before). I don't see any distributor wear (based on the dwell reading I'm getting now--it's steady as a rock), but obviously the points are mis-adjusted.

According to my shop manual (remember this is a McKinnon engined car), the V8 distributor has a "window" to adjust the dwell. Imagine that! Now I know why everyone talks about Delco window distributors on the other newsgroup[^] And I thought only computers had windows[}:)]

Danarchy mentioned a Pertronix and to be honest, I'd given that some thought until I started reading about people having trouble with them and having them die on the side of the road. I see a few people that carry points in their Pertronix cars in case the unit dies. Why bother? At least if the points puke it's an easy fix (something I can do from the side of the road).

Which brings me to my next point [enter dreamlike state]...why I bought a Studebaker. Beside my love for the cars, I wanted something "fixable". Cars today may go for 100,000 miles and need nothing, but when that baby finally dies it's gonna cost you some jack. My son's Camaro puked a few weeks back. Blew out the computer and one injector (had to replace three). Cost $425 at the shop. There was no real way to troubleshoot that problem. When you have more than one thing go south, you're scr*wed. Found out the injector shorted, which blew the computer. The shop actually blew TWO computers before they figured out it was the injector. Glad that wasn't me. Before that, my Cadillac developed problems in the computer that took me nearly a month to get worked out.

When I open the hood of the Stude, I just stand there in amazement. An engineering marvel in its simplicity. Fuel pump? Right there, within easy reach. Spark plugs? Hey, I can see em! Distributor? Yep, easy reach. Water pump? I could change it by feel and wouldn't even have to pull the radiator.

Yes, it's old and some people call it an old man's car. But, there's not a day goes by that I don't get several thumbs up, a honk, or people asking me about the car. It makes people smile. Heck, it makes me smile everything I put the key IN THE DASH WHERE IT BELONGS and start her up.

And, you know something else? I bought this car on February 28th. I drive it every day to work (almost 4,000 miles so far). It went to South Bend and back. Completely trouble free. No trouble, nada. I maintain it meticulously and have no worries about this car leaving me stranded.

Okay, I'm done now[8D]

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

hank63
05-17-2005, 08:42 AM
Mark, you've hit the nail on the head with your comments about "modern" cars. I think of 'em as "Plastic Fantastic Electronic Money Generators" (for dealers & makers).
Buy a new car today, and you end up "married" to the autorised dealer. He has the necessary diagnostic equipment, unique to "your" model. They don't repair either, it's only "the whatsit is no good, we'll put a new one in for you". Must be a genuine part or your warranty goes south in a big way. So, the owner keeps putting his hand into the pocket on a regular basis.
Thankfully, the classic cars are always there - no plastic, no electronics and no depreciation.
/ H

Sonny
05-17-2005, 01:06 PM
quote:Originally posted by 65cruiser

Sonny,

I'm happy for the great explanations I've gotten here. It's been years since I fooled with a points car. The last one I had was back in 1975 (1966 Ford Econoline). I finally put electronic ignition in that one, but prior to that my dad always helped me tune it up. Now, he doesn't remember how to do it:)

<BIG SNIP OF THE GOOD STUFF TO SAVE ROOM>

Okay, I'm done now[8D]

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser


I know EXACTLY what you mean about the old cars, simplicity at it's best! In fact, (and VERY unusual for this time of year), I drive my '60 Lark as a daily driver too. I LOVE it, and all the fun and people interested in it just add to the enjoyment.

For some reason I thought your car was a '64. But no problem, everything we've talked about applies to that McKinnon too. The best part is that window Delco, soooooo easy to adjust. For that ya just get a 1/8" allen wrench, (longer wrench is better), pick that window up, stick that allen wrench in the screw on the points and voila, quick and easy!

BTW, I always take the little tab off the "window" that keeps it from coming all the way up/off. Just give the metal window an extra tug when you pull it up, and break off the little tab that's sticking out. Then, just slide it back in the cap when you finish adjusting, it'll stay there no problem. It's kind of a pain to hold it up to find the screw and just easier while you're adjusting. If you scout around a bit, you can find the old-style tool made just for adjusting the window distributors. It has a screw driver type handle, with a wound-wire shank and an allen wrench built right on the end. I've seen them in a couple of the FLAPS.

Old man's car? Those thumbs up that you get mean that a LOT of people would love to be IN that "old man's car"! Pull it up in front of ANY country club in the world, and right next to the most expensive new car in the world, which one do you think would draw the biggest crowd? [:I]

Keep us updated on the progress will ya? That's MY favorite thing about this place, I really enjoy listening to everyone's progress reports!!!



Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Sonny
05-17-2005, 01:25 PM
quote:Originally posted by hank63

Mark, you've hit the nail on the head with your comments about "modern" cars. I think of 'em as "Plastic Fantastic Electronic Money Generators" (for dealers & makers).
Buy a new car today, and you end up "married" to the autorised dealer. He has the necessary diagnostic equipment, unique to "your" model. They don't repair either, it's only "the whatsit is no good, we'll put a new one in for you". Must be a genuine part or your warranty goes south in a big way. So, the owner keeps putting his hand into the pocket on a regular basis.
Thankfully, the classic cars are always there - no plastic, no electronics and no depreciation.
/ H


Hank, I laughed so hard my sides hurt!! Toooo funny! From now on I'm gonna refer to the new cars as a PFEMG!!! Man did you EVER hit the nail right on the head. That's the car maker's plan, Get 'em, KEEP 'em paying! They make TONS more money fixing your car than they do selling it to ya! I know what you're gonna do, just like I'm gonna do, keep driving my Studebakers, right on past ALL those dealerships. Thanks for the great laugh!:D:D:D



Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

65cruiser
05-17-2005, 03:55 PM
I think I confused you Sonny with the comment about the window on the distributor. The V8s have those, but my 194 six does not. So, technically, I can't adjust the dwell, just the point gap. So, when I check my dwell now and see that it's off, that tells me my gap must be wrong.



________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

JDP
05-17-2005, 04:45 PM
No, you are adjusting the dwell everytime you adjust the point gap. Just because you can't do it with a allen wrench through a window does not mean you are not setting the 'dwell' by messing with the gap.

Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
64 R2 4 speed Challenger (Plain Wrapper)
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
55 Speedster
50 2R 10 truck

65cruiser
05-17-2005, 04:56 PM
Right, when I set the gap, it effectively sets the dwell. *If* the dwell is off at that point, I need to recheck my gap--right?

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

Sonny
05-17-2005, 06:40 PM
Yep, that's right, when you set the gap, it effectively sets the dwell. Conversely, when you set the dwell, it effectively sets the gap. Gap=dwell or dwell=gap. [^]

We'll say it this way, using your dwell meter, just make sure the dwell is right and I guarantee that the gap will be perfect!! ;)

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

65cruiser
05-18-2005, 08:31 PM
It's a done deal. Today I went to FLAPS and bought points, plugs, condensor, distributor cap and rotor. I wasn't really sure about the cap and rotor but thought I'd just start with all new. First I gapped and replaced the plugs. They were pretty rusty on the outside--looked like they hadn't been changed in a long time, but they were in good shape. Then the cap and rotor. The rotor towers were rusty inside, so I was glad I replaced that piece. I had to cleanup the ends of the spark plug wires as they were corroded too, but in too good a shape to replace. The points were in pretty good shape, probably could have filed and regapped them, but I replaced them anyway and saved the old ones "just in case". I set the gap, buttoned it all up and hit the key. She fired right up. I set the idle and checked the dwell. It was dead on, right around 32 (manual calls for 31-34). I checked the timing. I was a bit too far advanced, so I reset that then took her for a spin.

What can I say. Runs like a new Studebaker ought to run and gave me a darn good bit of satisfaction too:D

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

tbredehoft
05-18-2005, 11:05 PM
Having lived through this pretty good course in dwell/gap, is there a dwell meter which will work on a six volt engine? or is there a way to power one with 12 volts to work on a six volt system?

I'm not at all sure my .015 feeler gage is anywhere near accurate, and the range from .013 to .018 seems pretty sloppy, anyway.

Tom Bredehoft
'53 Commander Coupe
'60 Lark VI

Sonny
05-19-2005, 01:19 AM
quote:Originally posted by Tom B

Having lived through this pretty good course in dwell/gap, is there a dwell meter which will work on a six volt engine? or is there a way to power one with 12 volts to work on a six volt system?

I'm not at all sure my .015 feeler gage is anywhere near accurate, and the range from .013 to .018 seems pretty sloppy, anyway.

Tom Bredehoft
'53 Commander Coupe
'60 Lark VI

That's a good question Tom. I can tell you that my dwell meter will work on 6 or 12 volts and it works on positive ground systems.

I have a "fancier" meter, it's powered by the car battery. The reason I bring that up is because I've seen some inexpensive, "self powered" dwell meters that have just two connections, one to any ground and one to the post on the coil. Since a dwell meter is really nothing more than a "duty cycle meter", as long as it has a 6 cylinder scale, I don't see why it wouldn't work.

I just honestly dunno the answer to that one, but I will say this. My meter was about 25 or 30 bucks, measures dwell, rpm, voltage, with scales for 4,6,8 cylinders, uses 6 or 12 volts, and trust me, I use every function on the thing, continuously switching functions, when I'm doing a tune up. I highly recommend that you just find one that doesn't require any futzing around while you're trying to get that tune up tuned in. ;)

I'm with you, I use the feeler gauges just to get the car started then set the dwell. The MAIN reason I like the dwell meter is that it's actually dynamically checking distributor condition too. If dwell varies more than 3ļ from idle speed to 1,750 engine rpm, the distributor is worn, OR, if, (while you're trying to set the dwell), the needle constantly fluctuates, OR, if the needle fluctuates ANY time the car is running "on speed", it could be bad points, (point bounce, weak arm), or again, worn/bad distributor.

After the first 200 miles or so on a new set of points, the point gap often closes up due to initial rubbing block wear. For best performance, I recheck the dwell about then, but that quick initial wear is the reason that I've seen factory manuals recommending 0.003 in. more gap on new points, IF you use a feeler gauge to set them. Since changing the gap affects the ignition timing, the timing should be checked and adjusted as necessary after each point replacement or adjustment.

Here's some incentive to get that dwell/gap right on, (also consider the fact that the ignition system must complete a full "cycle" each time a spark plug fires). On a 4-cylinder, 4-cycle engine, 2 of the four plugs must fire once for every engine revolution. If the idle speed of an engine is say, 800 rpm, the breaker points open and close two times for each revolution of the engine. For every minute the engine idles, the points open and close 1,600 times (2X800=1,600). That's just at idle, Now, double it for an eight cylinder! Can ya picture what those points look like at 60 mph? [:0]


Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

65cruiser
05-19-2005, 07:20 AM
FYI, there are some good deals on dwell meters to be had on Ebay. I bought a really nice Snap-On for under $30.00.

________________________
Mark Anderson
http://home.alltel.net/anderm
1965 Studebaker Cruiser

Roscomacaw
05-19-2005, 09:15 AM
I'm running Pertronix modules in my Studes. There was an instantly noticeable difference when I went to them in the way the engine's start cold. And I didn't add the modules because the points had failed or were old - just because I wanted a better spark.
I've not had a failure - yet - in a couple of years of driving with them. And I look at it like this..[:I] Most folks will only sound off when something goes WRONG. When it goes as expected, you don't hear them crowing around town that they can't get over the fact their engine's still running after converting.[}:)]
Sure, I carry points and condensor as a hedge against possible failure. But I also carry a water pump and fuel pump too - and it's been years since I've had to use one of my spares.
Think of it like this - with a few spares in a shoebox, you're MILES ahead of the guy next to you in a Toyota! If HE has something go south, he's gonna be down AT LEAST a few hours (if not days or weeks even) while it's diagnosed and waits for parts to show and a "technician" to affix them to the wound.[xx(]
Even an EXTRA Pretronix module looks downright CHEAP when compared to some electrical trinket for a Toyota (or a Ford even![8])
We "Masters of Frugality" (Studebaker Drivers) get SO caught up in pinching pennies that we get "pound foolish" about simple preparedness to ward off possible frustrations. I don't care if you're going cross-country or cross-town. Carry those few spares and be beholden to NO mechanics or parts store idiots:D: "Studeebaker - Studeebaker - say, who made them Studeebakers anyway? I can't seem to find 'em on my compooter."[V]

Miscreant at large.

JDP
05-19-2005, 02:10 PM
I like everything about the Pertronix except the failure rate. I've had two that just died without warning, one that would just cut off for a instant, scarying the crap out of me. I now carry a spare module when I travel.

Studebaker On The Net http://stude.com
64 R2 4 speed Challenger (Plain Wrapper)
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
55 Speedster
50 2R 10 truck

Sonny
05-19-2005, 03:00 PM
quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

I'm running Pertronix modules in my Studes......... <SNIP>
Miscreant at large.


We're talking "purity" here Bob. [^] Ok, ok, I'm just busting 'em a little, 'cause I agree with you, slappin' a Pertronix system in is a GOOD thing. But, here's one more way to look at it. As you know, doing a "real" tune up is, or is rapidly becoming, a lost art. Believe it or not, My own son had NO idea what setting the dwell on his SS Chevy meant! My fault I guess, I never really gave him a good tune up lesson, I just normally did it 'cause it was easier. I promise you, he knows how to tune now!

Well, if all of us just keep putting nothing but a Pertronix unit in, pretty soon you'll have to see if you can find ignition parts at a swap meet somewhere. PLUS, you'll be in the same boat as the Toyota driver, except that you know how to replace the module! Hell, have you seen what new ignition parts are going for now? I had a HELL of a time, (AND it was expensive as hell), trying to find a vacuum advance. Everywhere I went, "It's a "special order" for antique parts"! A simple, stupid vacuum advance for an '86 Ford is a specialty item now? I STILL can't believe it.

One other way to look at it, if you do put a Pertronix unit in, you can't check dwell 'cause, "What the hell, why would ya wanna anyway? The module chip takes care of it!" Well, the Pertronix unit is so good, it doesn't care if the distributor shaft is wobbling, it triggers the ignition anyway, (unless of course it's soooo bad that it touches the module! [:p]). When I slap a dwell meter on it gives me more than just the information it displays on the meter.

Anyway, "Where's a happy medium?", I dunno, I use Pertronix too, love 'em, BUT, we gotta keep the torch going to keep the art of tuning the oldsters from becoming lost, and damn it, it IS an art. Anybody up for dual points? [8D]:D


Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

studeclunker
05-19-2005, 08:49 PM
My last new cars were an 85 Cougar (Merc./Ford) wagon and a Dodge Aries (90) wagon. Both of them were shop hounds.:( The Dodge was more painless than the Furd product. Chrysler really lost thier shirt on that maintenance contract.:) After the Aries I swore that there would be no more new cars for me. [V] Things would be easier if financing was available for professionally restored classics. Then again... do I really need the payments?[8)] Well... I do need the reliability.[:I]

Lotsa Larks!
Studeclunker
A.K.A: out2lunch

hank63
05-20-2005, 11:03 AM
Sonny,
I don't know what you can get done in USA, but about 5 years ago I had a defunct vacuum advance unit and no new or NOS replacements available. In the end, I found a chap in Christchurch, New Zealand, who restores these. He pulls 'em apart, re-plates the metal and replaces the diaphragm with a hi-temp mtrl. Not very expensive, either. Don't know if he's still in business, unfortunately.
/ H

Sonny
05-20-2005, 11:40 PM
quote:Originally posted by hank63

Sonny,
I don't know what you can get done in USA, but about 5 years ago I had a defunct vacuum advance unit and no new or NOS replacements available. In the end, I found a chap in Christchurch, New Zealand, who restores these. He pulls 'em apart, re-plates the metal and replaces the diaphragm with a hi-temp mtrl. Not very expensive, either. Don't know if he's still in business, unfortunately.
/ H


Thanks Hank! Nice to know that we at least have some backup, but isn't it something that we have to find a guy who specializes in rebuilding something as simple as vacuum advances?

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com