PDA

View Full Version : Epoxy primer



Kdancy
03-07-2005, 06:37 AM
I just tried some epoxy primer from Midwest Chemicals
( www.midwestchemicals.com ) that I came across while doing a search. This formula is supposed to have greater adhesion properties than automotive primers and is used on many aircraft. I could not tell a difference in spraying it vs the PPG DP40 that I normally use. It cost about 30% less and can be bought in different colors. I used a product called Picklex20 for rust conversion first and then sprayed the primer on a 53 quarter panel for test purpose. Some of you might consider this product as it is unusual to find a better product that can save you money at the same time.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT

Sonny
03-07-2005, 04:13 PM
Thanks a million Kerry, I'm gonna give the paint and rust conversion a try. How well does the rust conversion chemical work? Can I spray it into the hard to reach areas? I'm thinkin' down inside the doors and some areas of the frame.

Sonny
http://RacingStudebakers.com

Kdancy
03-07-2005, 06:15 PM
An Introduction to Picklex Pro

PICKLEX PRO DO'S AND DON'TS

How to get the most out of Picklex Pro

by Fred Parr Jr.

written June, 2003


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let me begin with a brief history of how I came to discover Picklex Products and the testing that we've applied to the uses in cycle frame building and cycle frame painting.


Traditional product treatments of steel such as zinc phosphate or iron phosphate for corrosion preventing, welding and paint adhesion are already monitored by local, state and federal authorities and require permits and disposal of spent chemical solutions.


Totally impractical for the small frame shop as the costs for permits, licenses and zoning requirements for use and disposal would be in excess of their earning potential.


Here at Fred Parr Cycle Design, we have searched out solutions for this very same problem for more than 20 years.


Many of you know that my father was an employee of the Lockheed Skunkworks for many years and later became a member of the Hughes helicopter rotor head division in charge of hands-on prototype building the hi-tech rotor heads which were years ahead of their time and are now currently used in the Apache and used by the military.


Working with every metal, plastic, glue and chemical compound know to industry and many that were never released to the public, my father developed a knowledge of chemistry equal to or greater than could be attained be attending a doctoral degree course in chemical engineering in the specific uses of metal conversion and
hi-tech glues.


My father discovered that we were poisoning ourselves when we were treating the cycle tubing with phosphoric solutions. The combination of elements was creating a tiny percent of nerve agent, phosgene acid gas when we heated it to braze, often resulting in headaches, skin rashes or unexplained illnesses and both of us focused on better solutions. Back then, we did two things which I believe others have done also.


We created a smog hog which sucked all the fumes away from us without moving large quantities of air that would create overly rapid cooling of the parts being brazed. Bob Zumwalt Jr. later provided us with a fresh air system that allowed us to breath external air like an aqua lung and prevented the nasty elements from entering our tender lung tissue. A great solution at the time but not getting to the source of the problem...phosphoric and hydrochloric acids and heavy metals etc.


It wasn't until years later, in 2002 ,that I discovered Picklex Products. Picklex formula contains very small phosphoric acid, but it is water based product and non-hazardous in nature.

A totally new and unique chemical composition. Picklex has been tested by the E.P.A. and has been classified as non-hazardous and environmentally safe


This water based metal treatment is an environmentally friendly alternative and very effective replacement to or often exceeding the phosphate and chromate conversion treatment used in the past.


It removes scale and rust and deoxidizes and converts the substrate of the metal and as an extra bonus, leaves a protecting coating which seals the surface and increases the resistance to further oxidation. It increase the bonding of both the brazing and the welding processes. It also enhances both painting and powder coating, substantially providing years of protection unthought-of with previous processes... and so simple to apply.


Equal to or better than zinc or iron phosphate treatment on steel or chromate treatment on aluminum. Plant managers have testified that this process is easier to control and provides great results.


After full treatment, it has been established that the rinse water has been tested to contain no heavy metals and passes reclamation waste water in every category, simply flush it down the drain.


There are additional documents referring to tests done by companies such as General Motors and Rand-Scott and many oth

gordr
03-08-2005, 01:44 AM
Quote:
"My father discovered that we were poisoning ourselves when we were treating the cycle tubing with phosphoric solutions. The combination of elements was creating a tiny percent of nerve agent, phosgene acid gas when we heated it to braze, often resulting in headaches, skin rashes or unexplained illnesses and both of us focused on better solutions. Back then, we did two things which I believe others have done also. "

Uh-uh. Phosgene doesn't contain ANY phophorous. Its chemical formula is COCl2. You want to get a whiff of phosgene, burn some PVC plastic. If brazing the treated metal DID release phosgene, it was probably from chloride salts.

I'm not trying to say that phosphorous compounds are totally harmless, although it's worth noting that Coca Cola contains dilute phosphoric acid.

It sounds like this Picklex is nothing more than dilute phosphoric acid, likely with the addition of detergent or wetting agents, not much different from metal-prep and other similar products you can buy at the auto paint suppliers.

The quoted article goes on to say there are no heavy metals in the effluent left after picking steel. Well if there are no heavy metals in the etchant, and none in the metal, where would they come from? There's probably no cholesterol in the effluent, either.;)

I don't want to suggest that the stuff isn't a good product, but there seems to be a slight odor of BS in the hype that accompanies it.

If the Picklex does a good job for you at the right price, great, but as far as I can see from what they tell us, it doesn't really differ all that much from conventional products.

Thanks for posting the information, Kerry. I'll watch for this stuff when I'm at swap meets, etc., and try to get read off the label sometime.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

Kdancy
03-08-2005, 05:32 PM
http://www.picklex20.com Company web site.
I find it interesting that it was orginally developed to increase weld strength. I plan to test that in the near future.

53commander HDTP
53 Champion HDTP
64 Champ long bed V8
64 GT