TELL ME ABOUT THE 51 COMMANDER AUTOMATIC TRANNY!

[51studer]

I hate transmissions and have no luck with shops working on them. My truck has been in the shop twice with it's tranny and I haven't seen it for 2 months. I hate auto shops also, I am constantly getting crapped on by them. I need to know if this transmission is easy enough to work on myself, if not, where in California can I take it, and can you tell me any good information about it.

[N8N]

What transmission do you have? I wasn't aware of a stock '51 truck being available with an auto, but then again I'd be willing to be surprised. Anyway, if it is a later FOM or Powershift look for someone familiar with 60s Fords, they are similar. If the early style DG tranny that was also used on Jaguars so I'd look for a shop that's worked on a lot of British stuff for that one.

good luck

nate

--
62 Daytona hartop
64 Daytona convertible (in boxes)

http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

[Roscomacaw]

Stude trucks didn't get the option of an automatic tranny until about 54 or 55. BUT, in the event someone transplanted one to your truck, we'll have to know if it's REALLY a '51 Commander automatic or a later Flight-o-matic. The later tranny (which was used in some Stude trucks)is basically the same as a Ford-o-matic of the same era. The earlier Stude auto was a superior tranny to the Flight-o-matic. In fact, it's superior ways (making it more expensive) were the reason the cheaper Flight-o-matic was switched to in '56.
That earlier tranny was built FOR Studebaker by the Detroit Gear division of Borg-Warner. That Stude dropped that tranny in '56 means that there's damned few tranny mechanics around that still know how to work on them. There WERE a couple European car makers that built the thing under license thru the early 60s - but again, anyone who worked on them back then is likely not doing so now.[V]
There ARE still a few specialized guys that will take them on for overhaul, but they've got months for turnaround time and they don't work CHEAP.[xx(]
It's NOT easy to work on and I recommend you think about a tranny swap as an alternative. There's adaptor kits to hang a GM 700R4 or 200R4 on a Stude V8. This might be the way to go. Besides, you'd get overdrive in the deal. Figure a built tranny and the adaptor kit will set you back about 11 or 12 hundred bucks. And you'll have to engineer a rear mount and an adapted drive shaft as well. [:I]

Miscreant at large.

[cosmo]

well i took my 63 manuel trans to this trans shop in la. i was a little lerry about the place at first but they have this guy there i think his name is rick he did really good work on my trans. i didn't have any complants about it yet. www.aagearsandshafts.com talk to a guy named george. tell george that ray sent you " the guy who brought in the T10 trans" he will remember me i just tlked to him today.

[Roscomacaw]

Cosmo, there's a whole world of difference between automatic and manual transmissions. Then there's the little detail of where you live and where 51 Studer lives. The shipping costs on a tranmission would be outrageous![:0]

Miscreant at large.

[BRUCESTUDE]

I rebuilt a friend's '52 Commander engine a couple of years ago, and I sent his DG auto to a place in Tacoma, Wa.that specializes in old stuff. When I delivered it, he knew exactly what it was at first glance, a good sign! Anyway, it took a couple of months and cost $1400,[B)] it would have been closer to $1100 except the front pump was beyond machining and he had to hunt a good one down. Afterwards, the car ran and shifted excellent!
Of course, freight from Calif. would be prohbitive, so I'd call around to the different area chapters to find a shop, that's how I found this guy.(Casey's Trans-plant, Inc 253-584-8028, Tacoma, Wa.

Brucestude

[51studer]

Well You guys, thanks for the replys. I don't have a Studebaker truck though, I can dream. I have a 51' Studebaker Commander State. I am currently cleaning all of the mechanical parts that have set for 38 years with all the fluids left in everything. All of my engine parts are from LIONEL STONE (who is a great person). The process of cleaning all of the parts is tedious, but fun. Anywho, the tranny to my knowledge is one of the first trannys that Studebaker used as an "Automatic" that worked as a manual. It has 3 input shafts from the torque converter and supposedly can be shifted with no problem like a manual. It has an overdrive soleniod and a governor; Don't like the idea, but that's another story. Now that we all know what car I have and what year, and the tranny is original equipment, please someone help. Sorry about the truck thing, I was venting about my 73 Dodge truck tranny problem in the first post.

[Roscomacaw]

I think you're mistaken about that tranny. NO Stude automatic (including the Detriot Gear automatic that Stude used from 1950 to 1956) had overdrive. None. BTW, your tranny should be a DG-200 whereas the Champions had a DG-150. They were the same basic tranny 'cept that the 200 was a little beefier to handle the increased HP of the V8.
There's always been a bit of confusion over this early automatic and the standard shift W/OD that Stude used. This is because Studebaker referred to their OD tranny's as being "Automatic overdrive". It was "automatic" only in that all you had to do to get overdrive was to lift your foot off the gas pedal once you'd achived a speed of 30MPH+. You still have to work the clutch and shift the gears like almost any manual trans vehicle.
On this Detriot Gear automatic, it WILL have a thing called a "governor" on it and it MAY have an "Anti-creep" solenoid on it as well. NO overdrive tho. It's a 3-speed automatic that starts out in second gear unless you force a first gear start by starting out in the "low" range and then manually shifting to drive once under way OR by tromping the gas pedal from a standstill.
This IS a marvelous tranny when it works right. It had safetys built into it to avert the fears of folks who mistrusted automatics when they were still a novelty. For instance - what other auto do you know of that you can shift into reverse while you're doing 75 MPH on the freeway??? [:0] This is because this Detriot Gear (henceforth referred to as a DG tranny) has safety's engineered into it to prevent catastrophic things like self-destruction when reverse is accidentally selected. That was another reason for the Anti-Creep system. Folks were afraid that their car might wander into an intersection because they were used to being able to leave their foot off the brakes after they'd come to a stop with a standard shift car. The "Anti-Creep" system held the brakes applied until the accelerator was actuated.
It also features a "lock-up" torque convertor. This is to say it has a clutch of sorts INSIDE the torque convertor that gives basically direct drive once the car's in 3rd gear. This avoids the loss of power that a slippery torque convertor has. It makes the DG capable of delivering the same economy as a (non-OD) standard shift tranny can.
Anywho...... There are damned few shops that will even LOOK at a DG nowdays because they DON'T have the experience and they DON'T know where to get any parts.[V]
While parts are readily available - most shops aren't gonna go looking for them and even if YOU take them the stuff, since they're not versed in this tranny, they're still not gonna touch it.
There's a guy up by Sacramento that still does these. I'm sure there's a few more in this state. I know of two DGs recently done by the aforementioned repair guy (semi-retired) where the owners were happy with the work. The overhauls (he didn't have to remove them or reinstall them) cost in the neighborhood of $1500-$1700.[:0]

Miscreant at large.

[Commander51]

It's NOT easy to work on and I recommend you think about a tranny swap as an alternative. There's adaptor kits to hang a GM 700R4 or 200R4 on a Stude V8. This might be the way to go. Besides, you'd get overdrive in the deal.

Mr. Biggs

Any idea where to find those adaptor kits?? The prior owner of my DG200 poured money into it and it's still not right...
Thanks!

[Roscomacaw]

Myers Studebaker in Duncan Falls Ohio has GM trans adaptor kits. BTW, guys are using the GM[8D] 200R4 with success as well.

Miscreant at large.

[Transtar60]

Here are a few vendors

http://www.steeltechsolutions.com/

http://www.myersstudebaker.com/New%20&%20Repro%20items.htm

And theres another guy in Minnesota whos link I am always loosing.

[Transtar60]

Heres the third link:

http://www.transmissionadapters.com/studebaker_to_chev%20install.htm

I havent purchased any of these yet but soon!

[51studer]

Thanks all. Mr Biggs, you are very knowledgable thank you. I think I will look into the tranny adapters. Id like to get a 4 speed manual in there, maybe a 5 speed if I can. Does anyone know about that kind of swap. Maybe sometime I'll get the old tranny rebuilt but for as much as is costs, I'll go for a swap. Let me know guys.

[51studer]

Hey all. What do you think about just switching to a Studebaker 3 speed overdrive manual tranny I was just told by a couple of guys today that it would work just fine. Figure I want a manual anyway, most likely cost a bit less and a manual is much easier to work on.

[Sonny]

I'd say that would be a capital idea Studer! You can have a 4.09 rear end in the thing, it will pull like hell in the 3 low gears, but with that 3 speed w/OD, it'll cruise all day long at 60-65. The OD transmissions are fairly easy to come by, (plus you'll need a relay and a little wiring as it's an electric setup), and not too hard on the budget. [^] I would NOT use the plain 3 speed, [8] the OD is the key here.

Sonny

http://RacingStudebakers.com