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View Full Version : Ever try brush painting your old stude?



14x7
07-05-2009, 09:39 PM
If I would brush paint ,should I thin the paint down?

JDP
07-05-2009, 09:49 PM
Search the forum for roller paints job, or google links like this.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Paint-Your-Car-With-Rustoleum/

JDP/Maryland

bridgegaurd
07-05-2009, 09:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by 14x7

If I would brush paint ,should I thin the paint down?
Painted many a claimer with a brush and a roller, but never a stude.

But some rat/rust rods are painted with a roller. here's how.

http://www.instructables.com/id/The-Poor-Mans-Paint-Job-or...-How-to-paint-your-c/

You do know you just sent a massive shudder through the brain cells of the stude gurus don't you.

tbredehoft
07-05-2009, 10:29 PM
I painted my 55 President with a roller, while I am not pleased, it is because of my choice of paint. The paint I used was RustOleum Painter's Touch Gloss. The problem I encountered was that it was too thin. I put eight coats on, it didn't build enough for me to wet sand it enough to get a flat surface, it appears etched, tiny pits.

If I had a full bodied paint, it would have sanded well and would take a polish. Use automotive quality paint. Put it on heavy and wet sand, buff and polish it. I had zero runs, just too thin a paint. Check out the online resources, do what they say, it will work.

[img=left]http://www.alink.com/personal/tbredehoft/Avatar1.jpg[/img=left]
Tom Bredehoft
'53 Commander Coupe (since 1959)
'55 President (6H Y6) State Sedan
(Under Construction 617 hrs.)
'05 Legacy Ltd Wagon
All Indiana built cars

jclary
07-05-2009, 10:38 PM
When I was a kid in the late '50's, an elderly farmer who went to my church showed up in his A model ford sporting a new black paint job he had done with a brush. Looked great from about a quarter of a mile away!

John Clary
Greer, SC
http://i518.photobucket.com/albums/u346/jconln/HPIM0372-2.jpg
Life... is what happens as you are making plans.
SDC member since 1975

bams50
07-05-2009, 10:52 PM
You've got to be kidding! I read part of one of those "instructables" and just cringed. Might be a good process for a lot car or logging truck, but the thought of people thinking it's a viable way to make a car look well-repaired and lasting makes me [xx(]

Brush paint if you like, but no way am I buying that it'll look decent, let alone good... brusher beware[B)]

Robert (Bob) Andrews- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys)
Parish, central NY 13131
http://www.patrioticon.org/images/flag3-1.gif

S2DSteve
07-06-2009, 12:36 AM
Just read an article in an older (06'?) issue of Hot Rod in which they used regular Rustoleum enamel to paint a falcon with a roller and foam brush. They declared it a cheap (under $100) but labor intensive way to get a decent paint job. Not "show" quality, but several notches above a typical cheapie spray job.

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u57/S2DSteve/Family12-1-2.jpg
Steve Hudson
The Dalles, Oregon
1949 "GMOBaker" 1-T Dually (workhorse)
1953 Commander Convertible (show & go)
1953 Champion Starliner (custom/rod project)
1954 Champion Coupe (daily driver)
1960 Hawk (future project?)

JDP
07-06-2009, 01:01 AM
quote:Originally posted by bams50

You've got to be kidding! I read part of one of those "instructables" and just cringed. Might be a good process for a lot car or logging truck, but the thought of people thinking it's a viable way to make a car look well-repaired and lasting makes me [xx(]

Brush paint if you like, but no way am I buying that it'll look decent, let alone good... brusher beware[B)]

Robert (Bob) Andrews- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys)
Parish, central NY 13131
http://www.patrioticon.org/images/flag3-1.gif


Take another look

http://www.performanceforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67200168





JDP/Maryland

clonelark
07-06-2009, 01:43 AM
Yes, but very little thinner, and i wouldnt use metalic paint, but you will have a LOT of color sanding to do if you want to get rid of the brush strokes. Try it on a seperate small panel first and let it dry completly then color sand and buff to see how much work your in for. I'd use a good quality brush also to keep the hair from falling out.

http://i42.tinypic.com/2889kr8.jpg

bob40
07-06-2009, 06:09 AM
Go ahead and try it.Read the tutorials listed above and give it a whirl.
SD2Steve's comment about it can be better than a cheapie spray job is on
the money.

Ralphie
07-06-2009, 06:39 AM
I hate to be discouraging, and I haven't seen the object/the car in question, but I think maybe you would be better off waiting until you have the opportunity to do things more in the ways of spray painting the car.
If you are building a hot rod, and you want a kind of rough finish, you could go for primer only, or a semi gloss solution.
IF this is a hot rod, you should build the car YOUR way, cause that's what hot rodding is all about.
Still, you don't want to use your money and a lot of working effort to kind of decrease the value of the car, would you..?
If you can't really afford the paint job now, focuse on other things the car may need for now:-)
Good luck!

"There are two speeds in life - flat out and faster"(Burt Munro)

1953 Starliner("hot rod" project)
1953 Regal Commander Starlight Coupe(original).

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii248/Superformance1/Nylakkaforan-1.jpg

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii248/Superformance1/PrveturSouthPointOH-1.jpg

DEEPNHOCK
07-06-2009, 07:06 AM
Here's two threads on the subject, with some pic's.

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13083&SearchTerms=roller,paint

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10662&SearchTerms=roller,paint




quote:Originally posted by 14x7

If I would brush paint ,should I thin the paint down?

sweetolbob
07-06-2009, 09:15 AM
All we're talking about here is an application method.

No matter what application method you use, most any problem can be corrected if you are willing to spend the time with wet sanding and recoating.

So if you are truely a CASO, then go for it.

For me, I'll take my Devilbuss PLUS gun. It's a one time purchase but it will lay a smooth film of automobile paint that requires minimal sanding and overspray is almost non-existant.

If you love to wet sand than use a brush or roller. If you like to do other things with your spare time buy a good gun and be done with it.

Bob


http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh263/sweetolbob/P1000416.jpg?t=1227109182

jnormanh
07-06-2009, 09:28 AM
To do a decent paint job requires many hours of labor and prep. If you then use Rust Oleum or some other general purpose enamel from the hardware store, and spend dozens of hours sanding and buffing, maybe you can make it look okay.

You'll also have a paint job which will never look as good as real automotive paint, and which will not last. It'll water spot, be damaged by tree sap and bird droppings, will scratch and chip easily.

If the object is to get a good job at the lowest cost, do all the prep and priming yourself, get it as near perfect as you can, and then take it to a pro to be sprayed. You can probably get some place like Earl Scheib to spray it for a couple hundred dollars, but YOU take them the paint. Their stock paint is garbage.

You can buy enough DuPont Nason, with reducer and hardener for about $200, and you'll have something which will look great and last.

jimmijim8
07-06-2009, 09:36 AM
Earl Scheib or Maaco would be better. Will paint any car 249.00. Go to Big Lots and get some rattle cans. jimmijim

robtc
07-06-2009, 11:58 AM
Let me speak from experience. I have painted a 63 GT Hawk and I am working on a '55 Champion now. Both with Rustoleum paint. Both with a roller. It is very labor intensive. It takes a lot of coats to do it right. It must be sanded after every other coat or so. If you want to use automotive paint you could do so. It woudn't change the fact that it is labor intensive.

On the up side, it can be done in one's garage without a fan, without any breathing equipment, and you can do as much or as little at a time as you want. It is also very easy to touch up later if something gets dented and body work is needed.

I am fairly certain that those that say it is a lousy way to apply paint and would never work have never actually tried it. The method of application of paint doesn't matter so long as the prep work underneath the paint is done well and the coats are carefully sanded.

I doubt it would be used for a Pebble Beach car, however, if done properly and with the same quality paint as a Pebble Beach car, this method of application can be as good as any other.

Again, the method of application makes no difference IF the prep work is done properly. Since high quality paint jobs are generally color sanded anyway, just look as this method as requiring a bit more color sanding.

For those of you that say that this method could never work, why not try it first? Don't just slap some paint on a rusty panel though. Do the proper prep work and then follow the proper prcedure of application and sanding. If you are willing to be honest with yourselves, you may be pleasantly surprised.

fmarshall
07-06-2009, 12:06 PM
My girlfriend painted her escort with a brush. I was amazed how well it turned out. She put some sort of oil in the paint that the guy at the hardware store recommended. It made the paint lay flat, leaving no brush strokes. If she would have color sanded and polished it, it would have been really nice for the price.

In fact, it turned out so nice that I took my Avanti to a body shop :)

========================
63 Avanti R2, 4-Speed, 3.73 TT
Martinez, CA
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd211/fmarshall_bucket/sigpic.jpg

DilloCrafter
07-06-2009, 12:37 PM
Eastwood is advertising a new HVLP gun aimed at hobbyists. It doesn't need but 4cfm, as I recall, so even a smaller compressor would do.

Painting with a brush? Only the sides of a "woodie" with a China bristle brush and a good spar varnish, like Epifanes Wood Gloss!

http://simps.us/studebaker/misc/images/Avacar-hcsdc.gif[/img=left]
Paul Simpson
"DilloCrafter"

1955 1/2 Ton Pickup
[i]The Red-Headed Amazon
Deep in the heart of Texas

jclary
07-06-2009, 12:42 PM
So let's see...I spent a career selling multi-million dollar paint systems. We're talking about color change systems, computerized catalyst and resin ratio delivery systems, electrostatic bells, internal mix, external mix, air atomizing nozzles, HVLP systems, air assisted airless systems, airless systems, robot mounted automatic spray guns, hand held spray guns, and powder coat systems. We used terms like Zahn cup viscosity readings, mil thickness, refraction measurements, flow rates, and transfer efficiency. Then there were the spray booths, like down draft, cross draft or semi-down draft with their respective cfm requirements along with filter micron efficiency. In addition there are the curing ovens...convection, UV, and infrared, or a combination...and now I learn that all we really needed was a few pieces of sand paper, a can of rustoleum and a few brushes...DANG!:(

John Clary
Greer, SC
http://i518.photobucket.com/albums/u346/jconln/HPIM0372-2.jpg
Life... is what happens as you are making plans.
SDC member since 1975

go-studebaker
07-06-2009, 01:15 PM
Hi Guys,
I am pretty sure that just about all cars that were in the teens and before were all brush painted by Studebaker. I think they heated the paint up for this.

You probably need to talk to a guy who is about 150 years old now to get the low down on the finer points of getting this done. There was a fantatic brush painted 1917 in Australia, that fooled quite a few people who thought it was spray painted when it was actually brush painted the old way

Regards
Greg

Greg Diffen
Australian Stude nut living in Warwick, United Kingdom

1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 Dutch delivered
1937 Dicator sedan. Australian Body by TJ Richards
1939 Packard Seven Passenger monster UK delivered
1939 Commander Sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards
1939 Commander Swiss Cabriolet by Lagenthal
1961 Hawk
1963 Daytona Hardtop
1988 Avanti Convertible

studegary
07-06-2009, 01:43 PM
I have spray painted an uncountable number of cars. I have brush painted one vehicle. That was my Zip Van. I used enamel. I did not thin it. I used a high quality, natural bristle brush. The Zip Van looked much better than it did before. It was not show quality, but decent.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

jmccarrol@hotmail.com
07-06-2009, 01:45 PM
I painted my 52 Champ with the roll method using a flat paint. It was called Tremclad Rust paint. Probably very similar to Rustoleum.
I got the directions from THE HAMB web site. Google it and go to archives. The great thing about the paint is that it seems to settle so as long as you get any runs out, the next day the paint is uniform. Another great thing about it is that if you get grease, on the paint, you can use mineral spirits or good old windex glass cleaner to remove it as well as insects you kill as you drive. Just be prepared to wet sand between coats. I think I stopped at five.
You can see my results if you search in (please be kind) thread. Use 20% thinner. The fellow on the HAMB went the shiny paint route and says it has held up for years.

jmccarrol@hotmail.com
07-06-2009, 01:52 PM
Sorry people, to see pictures of my car search under My 52 Studebaker Champion. This was done three summers ago and
I'm quite pleased with the results. Joe

jclary
07-06-2009, 01:55 PM
:)Well, folks, there is another method I failed to cover. It is e-coating (or EPD) a process in which the parts are immersed in a liquid coating solution (actually a colloid) similar to the plating process. If I am not mistaken, Snapper lawnmowers are still painted this way. I toured their Georgia plant years ago with one of our engineers. We were asked to develop a method to automatically proportion the pigments and solutions to add back to the tanks as the coating was deposited onto the parts being painted. Some companies converted to powder-coating due to the fact that the e-coating systems still had environmental issues and the control costs that accompany them. Another "street" name for this process was called "dipping" and it was used in the past. I was told that my Father's forty Chevy was painted by "dipping.":)

John Clary
Greer, SC
http://i518.photobucket.com/albums/u346/jconln/HPIM0372-2.jpg
Life... is what happens as you are making plans.
SDC member since 1975

jnormanh
07-06-2009, 06:09 PM
I don't think a '40 Chevy was dip painted. AFAIK, the last dip painted cars were the Ford Model T. You could have any color you want, said Henry F, as long as it was black. They had one big dip tank filled with black paint, and great care was taken that the runs were on the non-exposed sides.

bams50
07-06-2009, 07:42 PM
quote:Originally posted by jclary

So let's see...I spent a career selling multi-million dollar paint systems. We're talking about color change systems, computerized catalyst and resin ratio delivery systems, electrostatic bells, internal mix, external mix, air atomizing nozzles, HVLP systems, air assisted airless systems, airless systems, robot mounted automatic spray guns, hand held spray guns, and powder coat systems. We used terms like Zahn cup viscosity readings, mil thickness, refraction measurements, flow rates, and transfer efficiency. Then there were the spray booths, like down draft, cross draft or semi-down draft with their respective cfm requirements along with filter micron efficiency. In addition there are the curing ovens...convection, UV, and infrared, or a combination...and now I learn that all we really needed was a few pieces of sand paper, a can of rustoleum and a few brushes...DANG!:(


LOL! This thread just shows we're living in a crazy worldhttp://www.thelincolnforum.net/phpbb3/images/smilies/017.gif

As I said, one can certainly brush-paint anything- just understand that, contrary to what some of those internet sites try to say, it will not be anywhere near the shine, look, quality, or durability of the correct way. It may not matter, and that's fine... but to tell those that don't know otherwise is just setting them up for a big disappointment.

It HAS been entertaining, though!;)

Robert (Bob) Andrews- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys)
Parish, central NY 13131
http://www.patrioticon.org/images/flag3-1.gif

Retired
07-08-2009, 03:47 PM
The Japanese developed the black paint with a dryer compound that enabled Ford to reduce drying time thus speed up production. It's been a mystery why other colors wern't available with the drying compound.

Richard

Nitram
07-08-2009, 08:10 PM
Has anyone followed this thread?
Scroll down till you come to a fella named 69chargeryeehaa.
He describes his method in detail.
Check out his photobucket pics.

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=2331682&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1

Canadoug
07-08-2009, 11:45 PM
sure.practice on your brother-inlaws car first.

dictator27
07-09-2009, 11:10 AM
Prior to 1920 all cars were varnished. Multiple coats (up to 15)were required to achieve depth of colour. Each coat required 2 to 3 weeks to dry and had to be hand rubbed between coats. In spite of that, they tended to have a matte look to the finish, and the colour faded rapidly once exposed to the weather.

Obviously, this created major production bottlenecks, which would be why Ford went to its "any colour as long as it is black" between 1916-22. On either side of that they were available in a variety of colours. Ford found that two coats of black covered satisfactorily.

Starting in 1920 some auto makers started using a lacquer paint, and in 1923 some GM divisions began using Du Pont Duco lacquer which required fewer coats, a shorter drying time, was harder, shinier, and didn't was off when subjected to soap and water. By 1925 virtually all auto makers had shifted to Duco. In 1926, Du Pont introduced Dulux enamel which became the auto paint of choice until about 1960.

It appears that Studebaker used both lacquer and enamel paints for a time. The owners manual for my Dictator, printed in 1926, gives separate care intructions for them.

Terry

PS No, I'm not 150 years old - although sometimes it feels like I am![xx(]

gordr
07-09-2009, 11:30 AM
Well, just to be different, I spray-painted a car with one of those pint-bottle insect-sprayer attachments for a vacuum cleaner. I invented the HVLP spray system and never even knew it! It actually turned out not too badly, and would have been real fine if I had not used the existing vacuum cleaner hose, which deposited scattered blivets of lint and fluff in my shiny new paint.

This was an Austin 1100, BTW. I also brush-painted a Studebaker, two coats, no color sanding, and it looked like it.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

DilloCrafter
07-09-2009, 12:27 PM
Gord, do you have any pictures of that interesting system you described? That might be fun to see.

http://simps.us/studebaker/misc/images/Avacar-hcsdc.gif[/img=left]
Paul Simpson
"DilloCrafter"

1955 1/2 Ton Pickup
[i]The Red-Headed Amazon
Deep in the heart of Texas

JBOYLE
07-09-2009, 12:39 PM
A friend of mine (with several volunteers) painted an entire B-47 Stratojet with a roller.
It's on static display at an air force base and the EPA-types won't let them use sprayers outdoors.

It did a pretty nice job.

63 Avanti R1 2788
1914 Stutz Bearcat
(George Barris replica)

Washington State