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  • Electric Fuel Pumps

    I'm about ready to install an electric fuel pump on another one of my '64 Daytona v8's. In the past, I've continued to use the mechanical pump, and turn on the electric when needed on the other Studes I've done. However, I think I may be overcomplicating the job, and I'd like some input from you.

    I've been splitting the line off the fuel tank. One branch's routing goes to a filter, then to a frame mounted electric fuel pump, then to a one way flow check valve, then to a brass tee.

    The other branch off the tank goes to another check valve, then to the other leg of the tee. The third leg of the tee connects to the steel fuel line that runs along the frame and up to the mechanical fuel pump. The reason for this complex sounding routing is this: In the event of an electric fuel pump failure that would not allow fuel flow through the electric pump, there must be another route for the mechanical filter to obtain gas. That's why we have the second branch off the tank with only the check valve. Fuel can be sucked thru that line by the mechanical pump.

    The check valves are in place so that the electric pump does not just pump fuel thru the tee and back into the tank. This complicated plumbing arrangement was suggested to me by a presumably knowledgeable parts store counter man some years back. I've done 3 or 4 systems this way, but I don't really want to do it again unless I'm convinced it's necessary. It's time consuming to install, and there's a real bird's nest of tubing and bracketry back by the tank, looping around amongst the tailpipes, etc. Pretty ugly, matter of fact.

    I'd rather opt for just a rubber line coming off the gas tank outlet, to a filter, then an electric pump, then to the chassis steel fuel line. Much cleaner and less complex. But that "knowledgeable" counter man said no.

    Maybe his thinking had something to do with the type of electric fuel pump I was getting at the time. I don't remember which kind it was .... rotary or vane or solenoid or this or that. Maybe that had an influence on his advice. Lately I've been using Airtex
    E 8012S electric fuel pumps, but I don't know what "type" they are. Are they of the kind that will let fuel continue to flow thru them in the event of their failure, or not? I don't know. So, I guess my quest for advice might hinge on a respondent's knowledge of what characteristics a failed fuel pump's flow would likely be. Any advise?

    Thanks,
    Larry

  • #2
    If you can blow through an electric fuel pump, fuel can be sucked through it. No need for the bird's nest.

    [img=left]http://www.alink.com/personal/tbredehoft/Avatar1.jpg[/img=left]
    Tom Bredehoft
    '53 Commander Coupe (since 1959)
    '55 President (6H Y6) State Sedan
    (Under Construction 608 hrs.)
    '05 Legacy Ltd Wagon
    All Indiana built cars

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    • #3
      Larry,

      I just installed the same kind of solenoid fuel pump on our '54 Commander. I cut the fuel line back near the rear axle, mounted the Airtex pump on the underside of the body (the frame rail already has the brake line and wiring harness running along it so there was nowhere to mount the pump) and plumbed it with rubber fuel line with the filter between the tank and pump. I have it wired to a toggle switch mounted where the overdrive handle would have been if our car didn't have an automatic transmission. I prime the mechanical fuel pump with the electric one and only use the electric when I suspect the car will starve for fuel due to vapor lock (even though I recently discovered that the vent on my gas cap is plugged allowing a vacuum to build up in the tank, which can also lead to fuel starvation).

      Kindest regards,

      Alan Mende
      Hummelstown, PA

      I'm not a mechanic; I don't even play one on TV.
      Kindest regards,

      Alan Mende
      Grantville, PA

      I'm not a mechanic; I don't even play one on TV.

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      • #4
        I've built a dozen "systems" to eliminate vapor lock here in AZ. Here's how: Remove the mechanical pump and blank off the opening.(The mechanical pump is not much more than a heat reservoir to preheat the fuel on it's way to the carb.) Instal a simple pusher type (any type) fuel pump back at the tank. Run a 3/16 brake tube from the front back to the tank. [u]Getting as close to the carb fuel inlet as is physically possible</u>, Install a filter with a Tee off its side(it will also have .040 orifice in the "branch" of the Tee). Attach the branch off the tee to the return tube to the tank.

        Now you've provided a continuous recirculating path from the tank to the filter, providing pre-cooled fuel to the filter at all times. Thus, the only place that vapor can possibly form is inside the carburetor itself.

        I drive these systems in PHX in 115 degree, sit at stop lights with the A/C on and no vapor lock under any conditions. Worst case: I got held at a railroad crossing for 1/2 hour at 113 degrees, A/C on full and my Cruiser did not overheat nor vapor lock.
        THIS SYSTEM WORKS!!!
        Regards
        Ken Michael

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        • #5
          quote:...I drive these systems in PHX in 115 degree,
          Remind me not to come to Phoenix!

          The electric fuel pump on my '54 LC with the '64 drivetrain has a very simple set up. The PO just cut the line as it came out of the tank, installed the electric pump in the "kick-up" over the axle and put a switch under the dash. No other gim-cracks. Works fine, tho I've never waited at a RR crossing in Phoenix in this car.[]

          I only use the electric pump to start the car.

          John

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          • #6
            If running a return line what's the best way to feed it back into the tank? I'm switching to a Carter electric pump, Carter claims it doesn't need a regulator or return line but since I already have a Holley adjustable regulator with a by-pass for a return line I might as well use it.

            Analog man in a digital world.

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            • #7
              A solenoid type doesn't need a return line. They "dead head" with no problems.
              The Carter (a few models) while being a vane pump, they also work well without a return line.
              Most Holleys and other higher pressure/volume pumps should have a return.

              As for using most any electric pump...it's a very good idea to run a regulator with a pressure gauge to VERIFY what pressure your system actually is running.
              I've seen 7psi pumps put out 9psi. That will cause all kinds of possible problems. It's good insurance.

              From a long past experence.

              Mike

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              • #8
                quote:Originally posted by Mike Van Veghten

                A solenoid type doesn't need a return line. They "dead head" with no problems.
                The Carter (a few models) while being a vane pump, they also work well without a return line.
                Most Holleys and other higher pressure/volume pumps should have a return.

                As for using most any electric pump...it's a very good idea to run a regulator with a pressure gauge to VERIFY what pressure your system actually is running.
                I've seen 7psi pumps put out 9psi. That will cause all kinds of possible problems. It's good insurance.

                From a long past experence.

                Mike
                Thanks Mike, I'm swapping front shocks today and while it's in the air I'm going to layout my pump and filter locations. I'm thinking of running a new 5/16" steel fuel line and if I do I'll go ahead and use the old line for my return if it's still good. I'm banking that it is because the underside of my car is fairly clean.If it isn't I'll try it without the return line. Checking other forums most people put a nipple in the filler neck but since I'm dropping the tank anyway I may add one to the top of the tank with a check valve. I also read of a couple people running Holley pumps that mounted the regulator near the fuel pump so they only had to run a short return line, if my old line is too crusty that may be an option if I need the return. All my rubber lines will be replaced with fuel injection hose, they already are in the engine compartment.

                UPDATE: Steel line is in good shape all the way, found a good place to mount the pump but may have to modify the bracekt if the pump can't be tilted 15 degrees from vertical. Didn't realize it was a steel line right out of the tank.

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