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dean pearson
04-08-2009, 01:37 PM
I'm allmost afraid to ask this question but does anyone know of any other stude lover ever converting a 52 commander into a 50.
Meaning a 2-door hardtop bullet nose?
This is my first build and in my opinion there is nothing better to build than a studebaker.
I'm sure its been done and would appreciate any input I can get.
Thanks,
Dean.

BobPalma
04-08-2009, 01:47 PM
quote:Originally posted by dean pearson

I'm allmost afraid to ask this question but does anyone know of any other stude lover ever converting a 52 commander into a 50.
Meaning a 2-door hardtop bullet nose?
This is my first build and in my opinion there is nothing better to build than a studebaker.
I'm sure its been done and would appreciate any input I can get.
Thanks,
Dean.


:D Dean: Hopefully, "Aero Blue" from Avon IN will weigh in on this and encourage you to pull the plug on the idea before you expend much effort.

Aero bought a 1952 Champion Starlight coupe with an eye toward using the body to rebody his 1950 Starlight coupe in 1974-1975. The body mounts were so different and it was going to be so complicated that he sold the '52 as a complete car and sought a 1950 body.

They look similar, but the chassis mounts are so different it is not advisable. :DBP

wolfie
04-08-2009, 01:53 PM
Seems I read the clip wont work either.Someone with more knowledge should step in as I am relying on my memory about cars I have never fooled with but I think I read it on the forum here.Steve

Steve T
04-08-2009, 02:12 PM
I think I remember hearing that the 50 front clip wouldn't work at all, but a 51 would, with plenty of work...and you could install a 50-style bullet in the 51 nose of course. A bulletnose hardtop would be a really neat "phantom"...right up there with the C/K droptops seen on here occasionally (including Steve's gorgeous red one).

An easier conversion in the same vein: the 66 grille on a 64 HT...

S.

dean pearson
04-08-2009, 02:16 PM
Now I'm getting somewhere, I've heard these same concerns before but to clarify I have a 52 commander 2-door hard top it came complete with all the 52 front end parts and was really in a pretty good shape for a car thats ten years older than I am.
It also came with what I later found out was 51 champion front fenders and they are the same in length as the 52 fenders.
A 50 model center piece and a 50 model hood,Dash and tail lights.
I'm a welder by trade so I'm not afraid of doing a little modifying
But apart from the inner sheet metal on the front fenders all these parts seem at least that they will bolt on.
I still have all my 52 stuff so I can easily compare one year model to the other and it seems so simple I believe it has to have been done before.
Any help is greatly appreciated,
Thanks,
Dean.

studegary
04-08-2009, 02:22 PM
I thought that there was one pictured in Turning Wheels in the not too distant past.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

fargoguy
04-08-2009, 02:28 PM
Gary's right, within the last two years there was one on the cover of TW. I'm not at home right now, but it was a 51 front end on a 52 HT body. Car was Grey with Maroon roof, IIRC.

Evan Davis
Prairie Bulletin
Saskatchewan Chapter
Prince Albert, Sk
http://www.saskstudebaker.ca/Studebaker.html

Studeous
04-08-2009, 02:34 PM
Check out the October 2003 issue of turning wheels to see former Studebaker employee Paul Oliver's beautiful 52 with 51 front end. The consummate phantom(page 10). The former Studebaker employee pictured with the 51 on (page 13) is my Dad Thomas Burks.

Richard Burks Middle TN Chapter
53s
57 Transtar

52-fan
04-08-2009, 02:46 PM
The 51 front end will fit on a 52 fairly easily if you have all the 51 parts. The frames are the same. The 50 is a different car although it looks much like a 51. There was a 52 hardtop in Memphis a few years ago with the 51 front cap and 50 bullet. The only problem I had with it was that the owner was trying to tell people that it was a 50.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s186/52-fan/StudebakersofArkansas2-1.jpg
1952 Champion Starlight, 1962 Daytona, both w/overdrive.Searcy,Arkansas
"I may be lazy, but I'm not shiftless."

dean pearson
04-08-2009, 02:57 PM
I just went out and checked the fender to the body works, Fender to center piece works and as the fenders are the same length as the 52 fenders I can only ass/u/me that the hood works. the dash has an identical bolt pattern also so apart from all the wiring that should be fairly easy.
Another question I have is about chrome parts, I have allmost everything short of the rear view mirror that goes on the drivers door but was wondering if any cars in 50 had chrome pieces on top of the rear fenders and also if there is a reproduction chrome piece for the gas tank (filler door)?
Thanks,
Dean.

Roscomacaw
04-08-2009, 03:09 PM
Dean
The wheel well on '50 fenders is closer to the rear edge of the fenders than the 51's wheel well is. This is cause there was a difference in wheelbase between 50 and 51.

There WAS an optional chrome trim piece that mounted atop the rear fenders and there were optional ones for the front fenders too.

If with regards to the filler door, you're talking about the "guard" that mounted on the lower edge of the opening, yes, there was such a piece optional and there were after-market ones too.

1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1963 Cruiser
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe
1957 President two door

dean pearson
04-08-2009, 03:45 PM
Thanks for all the info. This forum is great!
Any Ideas on where to get these chrome parts both original and after market?
In response to Mr. 52fan I would never try to tell anyone that it is a true 50 model but cant wait to someday have my car in the local car show and have some crotchety old guy that knows more about studebakers than I ever will come along and tell me that my car was never actually made.
I want to have my car look as much as possible like a true 50 but I have a couple of ideas for my custom liscence plate that basically say that it's not.

rockne10
04-08-2009, 08:01 PM
quote:Any Ideas on where to get these chrome parts both original and after market?Have you looked in TURNING WHEELS ?

Brad Johnson
Pine Grove Mills, Pa.
http://s57.photobucket.com/albums/g233/rockne10/Rockne/th_Rocknegauges.jpg'33 Rockne 10, '51 Commander Starlight, '53 Commander Starlight

stude-sled
04-08-2009, 08:03 PM
The was one in Springfield MO. It was an orange custom, but I have not seen it in a couple of years.

mbstude
04-08-2009, 08:11 PM
I seen one almost 10 years ago at a meet in Memphis, TN. It was a highly modified '52 hardtop with a '50 (not 51) front end. I've no idea what it took to do that swap, but it looked good. It was bright yellow with scallops cut into the rear quarter panels.

I also have seen the one that Evan and Richard mentioned prevously. It's a 52 HT with a 51 front clip, with a 50 bullet. If I remember right, Stephen Cade and his gang built that car. And it's a real beauty. (BTW, Mr. Oliver sold it a couple years back to a gentleman in Clearwater).

BTW Dean, if you need any parts for your hardtop, I've got a pretty rusty one that loves to give up parts for others to live. :)

Matthew Burnette
Hazlehurst, GA

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/1959S2D/tiny.jpg

monomaniac
04-08-2009, 09:04 PM
Yes, guys, October 2003 front and back covers of Turning Wheels.

Exactly what you want and, contrary to Mr. Palma's observation, NO
cutting or welding required.

BobPalma
04-09-2009, 07:55 AM
quote:Originally posted by monomaniac

Yes, guys, October 2003 front and back covers of Turning Wheels.

Exactly what you want and, contrary to Mr. Palma's observation, NO
cutting or welding required.



:)Easy there, Art.

Re-read Page 11 of the October 2003 Turning Wheels. Paul Oliver describes how he built the 1951 bullet-nose hardtop incorporating the desired 1950 bullet. He used a 1951 front clip and modified the nose ever so slightly to accommodate a 1950 bullet: only the unique 1950 center bullet, not the whole 1950 front end!

It's easy to interchange 1951 and 1952 bodies and front clips. However, this thread's original poster, Dean Pearson, specifically asked about converting a 1952 Commander to a 1950. Not only is it difficult and inadvisable to try to build a 1950 Champion using a 1952 body, it would be even more difficult and more inadvisable to try to build a 1950 Commander from a 1952, in that the 1950 Commander's wheelbase was longer than the 1952's, not to mention the different chassis and body mount locations.

My original remarks stand. It is inadvisable to try to combine major 1950 Champion parts with a 1951 or 1952 body, much less try to combine 1950 Commander parts with a 1951 or 1952 body.

Bottom Line: All Paul did to get the more pronounced 1950 "bullet" on the October 2003 cover car was to use a 1950 bullet, not a whole 1950 front clip (or "doghouse" in some circles). :DBP

StudeMann
04-09-2009, 03:06 PM
I know the 50 is definately different from the 51 and 52 but I was under the impression that the front sheet metal from the firewall forward for a 51 is pretty much a bolt-on to a 52. Am I wrong?

Years ago, I looked at buying a 52 Commander starlight coupe with the idea of swapping over the front end from my 51 Champion starlight. I have seen cars like this for sale on Ebay but not in person so I don't know what it takes to make it happen.





"Ahh, a bear in his natural habitat...a Studebaker!"
Fozzie Bear in 'The Muppet Movie'

51 Land Cruiser (Elsie)
Jim Mann
Victoria, B.C.
Canada

BobPalma
04-09-2009, 03:48 PM
quote:Originally posted by StudeMann

I know the 50 is definately different from the 51 and 52 but I was under the impression that the front sheet metal from the firewall forward for a 51 is pretty much a bolt-on to a 52. Am I wrong?

Jim Mann


:) Nope, Jim; you aren't wrong. You can easily swap around 1951 and 1952 stuff; it's when you try to use big 1950 parts you run into trouble.

In the case we are discussing here, the confusion comes because the 1952 Commander hardtop on the October 2003 Turning Wheels has a 1950 bullet, but that's all; all the rest of the front-end sheet metal is 1951. He wanted to use the more prominent 1950 bullet, so he described how he trimmed around the bullet-hole to make the 1950 bullet fit in the 1951 front end.

Whew! :DBP

bams50
04-09-2009, 04:16 PM
Dean, if you do convert yours with a 51 front, do save the 52 parts- somebody will want them. Personally I prefer the 52 front over the bulletnose or even the 53 or 54.

I don't have the 10/03 TW... anyone got that issue's covers scanned? I'd like to see it[8D]

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

lstude
04-09-2009, 08:18 PM
Here it is...

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/TurningWheelsOct2003frontcoversm.jpg

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/TurningWheelsOct2003rearcoversm.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/MyStudebakernobackgroundsm.jpg

dean pearson
04-09-2009, 09:34 PM
Thanks for all the info. I definatly have been enlightened and feel a lot more comfortable about how this car will go together.
I dont have any plans to sell the 52 clip but I would be afraid to even guess what re plating all the grill parts would cost.
The pictures from the T.W are really nice, My bumpers are just plain,no backup lights, and I havent decided which headlights to use I have 50 and 52. On the tail lights I have 52 and I think 51 they look like the ones in this photo but mine have a small reflector at what I think is the bottom. Also My rock guards on the rear fenders are taller and one is really mangled.
Is a 50 bullrt piece different from a 51 in size? Also I have the front fender chrome (spears?) from my 52 fenders but the 51 fenders are not drilled for any chrome parts and I was considering adding them and wondered if these parts were the same on a 50? The ones I have the little plastic bullet tips that I'll need to replace.
Thanks again,
Dean.

3rdGenStude
04-09-2009, 10:42 PM
quote:Originally posted by lstude

Here it is...

Leonard,

Thanks, I don't have that issue either.

That car wouldn't be too bad, but that huge grill guard designed to go around the '52 grill looks kind'a funny with the bullet nose.

When I traded my '50 Land Cruiser, Boris, in on Natasha, the buyer intended to use the front clip on a '50 Commander Starlight he was working on. The LC front clip wouldn't even work on the '50 Commander! I didn't know any better myself, so I couldn't advise him otherwise.

Paul

In memory of Boris, the 1950 Land Cruiser project,
. . . he became a down payment for. . .
Natasha, the 1955 Speedster project
http://s138.photobucket.com/albums/q248/3rdGenStude/Avatars/55sidethumb-1.jpghttp://s138.photobucket.com/albums/q248/3rdGenStude/Avatars/55frontthumb-1.jpg

dean pearson
04-09-2009, 11:31 PM
Paul, Hows the speedster proj. coming along and how long have you been working on it? When I bought my car it came with a lot of parts that I dont need including a speedster grille tail lights and a hood. all the chrome is pitted of course and the center piece I have one with the three dimensional S and a plain one, Any interest?

Dean.