View Full Version : Common Courtesy

08-02-2008, 09:40 AM
I am going to vent a little here because it's getting to the point that I am not going to bother offering items here to people that post "I need this part, I'm desperate" etc...

Several times over the last few months, there have been "wanted" posts on this forum.. for people looking for very specific items. I have responded to several of these... and what do I get? NOTHING! No response at all...not even to say "no thanks, I've found one elsewhere..

Now, you may be thinking I'm obviously WAAAAYYYY too expensive in my pricing.
How about $4 (including shpg) for a specific 25+ year old Turning Wheels? Yeah... what a price-gouger I must be... The trip to the post office costs me more than that...

Or, less than $10 for a 50 year old Stude part that has been cleaned, bead-blasted, and freshly cad-plated (at least 1/2 hour labor, not counting the plating, etc)...realistically worth $20+

I'm not a vendor... and don't make a living selling parts. I'm not retired and sit in front of this computer all day doing nothing.... My time is valuable to me, but I don't mind spending it on my hobby.. If I spend 10 minutes looking up the correct part for you, finding it in my stash (no small task in itself), maybe checking several of mine over for the best one, taking a picture of it and sending it to you... the least you could do is take 30 seconds to respond.

I'm also getting pretty tired of that lame "I never got your e-mail" excuse... BS... admit it... you were just too darn lazy!!!

Well it's guys like that, that drive the vendors/privateers to eBay... and then they will ***** that they were beat out in the last second... (to 147 other bidders and $100 short).

I know I'm not the only one here that feels that way... and wish others would post of their frustrations also.


Specializing in Studebaker Restoration

08-02-2008, 10:07 AM
I read your frustration, If I truely needed a part I would pony up and buy it. Then again there's people out there looking for the best deal. Could be they were just testing the forum for a....I'll give it to you free offer....Just a thought.

Chop Stu

08-02-2008, 10:10 AM
I can see your point. I have some stuff, but hesitate to sell it simply because of the time it takes to remove, clean, pack, and ship things is prohibitive. Example: I have a 61 Lark rollover with no rust I decided to part out. I sold the fenders to a member for delivery to Lancaster. Luckily I still have time to pull them, but I'll have to set aside some hours to pull it apart. I'll get it done as promised, but I have to budget the time.

Another of our group here inquired about the trunk and rear panels (I haven't forgot you!). I told him I'd get back to him, but haven't figured out the time to pull it apart and cut it up, so I still haven't been able to come up with a good answer [}:)] But to put out the effort and not get the courtesy of a response is inexcusable.

Hopefully you won't sour completely on answering requests. There's got to be a way to help those who are legit, without investing too much effort into those who aren't. Good luck!

Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"It was the last chance for Studebaker to turn things around. The company was down to its last bullet, and this new small car was it. They called it the Lark"

Dick Steinkamp
08-02-2008, 10:16 AM
quote:Originally posted by Studeman

I'm also getting pretty tired of that lame "I never got your e-mail" excuse... BS... admit it... you were just too darn lazy!!!

Actually, that could be it, Ray. The Forum mail was "out of order" for quite some time...then worked intermittently. When it is working, a lot of email spam filters often put forum mail in the bulk mail or spam folder. If folks don't go through these, they are often deleted when the folder is emptied. I use Yahoo Mail, and some (not all) of mail to me via forum mail goes directly to my bulk mail folder.

If you sent your emails to the requester's regular email address then that's another story, of course.

Along the same line, often in the Tech Forum someone will post a problem and be offered solutions, but we never hear back from the OP if the problem was solved and what fixed it. I would suggest that it is also common courtesy for those requesting help to respond back with updates and a conclusion. Some do and it is appreciated. We all get to learn something that way.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA


08-02-2008, 10:21 AM
It is obvious that in every facet of life courtesy is a dying thing. Many people if contacted off forum by someone else would not respond to you if they found what they wanted. Another possibility is that they accidentally lost your response. I have done that at least once myself and could not locate the message.
Anyway, there are always users in any crowd who are playing others for what they can get. I have given parts to people who said they wanted to join our chapter only to have them sell the car as soon as they got the pieces installed. Overall I have found the forum folks, especially the regulars, to be a fine group.

1952 Champion Starlight, 1962 Daytona.Searcy,Arkansas
"I may be lazy, but I'm not shiftless."

Henry Votel
08-02-2008, 10:41 AM
Hi Ray,

Emails via the Forum site often are intercepted by ISP filters. Usually the recipients are not aware of their filter criteria so a high percentage just do not receive the Forum systems email. As it goes.

Anyway, i like you do offer parts to specific inquiries here and at the other Studebaker sites. My pain has been on other fronts about delays in committing to buy so here's my canned language that I put into any email where I offer a part:


"Price is $25.00 plus $6.50 shipping. Offer is open for you to purchase until June 15th.  I set a date for purchases being available because i have had people on this and other sites become irritated when they come back months later and expect I should still be holding items for them.  After June 15th the item may no longer be available for you at this price.
If interested in buying it let me know your intentions by return email.

Henry Votel, Address. Forest Lake, MN 55025, Phone#, SDC Member#


If I do not hear from them i don't fret. Ball is in their court.

Hope this helps....

Henry Votel
Forest Lake, MN

08-02-2008, 10:56 AM
Ray, you had some great plated and properly painted items, but ebay bidders took those out of my range. You are always fair, though, and your site is always a constant help. For awhile the forum email was a problem for sure, too. Sorry, you have had problems but you are more than appreciated, believe me.


08-02-2008, 11:47 AM
quote: Originally posted by barnlark

Ray, you had some great plated and properly painted items, but ebay bidders took those out of my range.

All ya gotta do is ask... I only throw pieces on eBay to help pay for my hobby-stuff on ocassion. This last batch paid for the new floor and transom replacement in my 1969 Fabuglas Commodore. Fiberglass mat and Marine Epoxy is expensive..[:0]

I have told people I recognize, to stop bidding- if I have the same piece in-stock, and often sell it to them much cheaper than the final eBay price...


Specializing in Studebaker Restoration

08-02-2008, 11:53 AM
quote:Originally posted by 52-fan

It is obvious that in every facet of life courtesy is a dying thing.

[V] Tragically, that is the general truth...and equally so, that it affects our hobby. :DBP

08-02-2008, 12:01 PM
To me ......The # 1 thing is ......Do what You say You will !

1961 Hawk 4BC,4-SPEED,TT
Ken Byrd

08-02-2008, 12:08 PM
Yes, well... sadly this is the same complaint that Stephen Cade had (Stephan Allen's). Rudeness, selfish-cheapness, etc ad-nauseum, cost us all a very valuable supplier.

Nevertheless and however, I find the mail from this forum in my spam folder all the time. There is just no way to get Yahoo to deliver it normally. I've made numerous complaints and they just send me innane automated responses. There for a while they had tagged me as a spammer. It turned out that a friend had been sending me too many forwarded messages. So because of mail I didn't even send, Yahoo made it nearly impossible for me to send mail! But I degress...

My friend George has a huge stash of early Rover parts. He gets comments of what a gold-mine it is. Yet when it comes to ponying up the cash for it people regularly try to nickel and dime him. I've tried to sell several of my vehicles (studees) on the property here. Lord knows, I need the cash desparately. Yet, if I'm selling something no one seems to want it. Now if I'm willing to give it away... The excuse is always my location.

Yes, courtesy seems to have gone the way of the Dodo in our society. Still, we shouldn't give up. After all, if all of us give up, courtesy will become extinct.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/december%2006/HPIM0234.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Home of the famous Mr. Ed!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

08-02-2008, 12:30 PM
quote:Originally posted by blackhawk61

To me ......The # 1 thing is ......Do what You say You will !

Ken Byrd

Could not have said it any better myself Ken! [^]

'57 Transtar Deluxe
Vancouver Island

Are you planning to attend the NW Overdrive Tour in Parksville, BC
May 23 & 24, 2009?</h5>

08-02-2008, 02:10 PM
I too, am not a vendor. I try to provide information from what experience with Studebakers that I have and try to help people when they request particular things that I have.

In the past couple of years, I have not had good experiences in selling Studebakers. I have never put Studebaker parts on eBay. I have had 100% success in providing wanted items to regulars on this SDC Forum.

I try to keep my prices low. I provided a desired three decade old Turning Wheels for $3, including shipping. The large envelope & shipping was about $2. This left $1 for the Turning Wheels and nothing for my time and mileage to go to the Post Office. One part that I sold on this Forum, I sold for what I paid for it in the early '70s. I sold Hawk wheel opening mouldings on this Forum for $15 each plus $15 for shipping. Then I found out how expensive they are to ship, plus I had to make a box to safely ship them in.

I am not complaining or trying to toot my own horn. I am just giving a few of my own experiences in dealing with people on this Forum. I have other NOS and used things sitting around here. but I don't list them for sale. If someone posts someting that they are looking for, I will let them know if I have it. I guess that this says that if you need something, ask on the Forum.

Reiterating - I have had 100% success in dealing with people on this Forum. (I know that there are all kinds of people and that I will probably run into a problem here someday, like I have on eBay [non-paying bidder, complaint after two years, etc.].)

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

08-02-2008, 02:40 PM
Ray, you have helped me on many occations, it would be a honor to buy parts from you just to pay you back for some of the time you have spent steering me on track and in the right direction. Please don't let a fraction hurt it for the majority. You are extremely knowlegeable and alot of us need your help.:)

Studebakers forever!

Skip Lackie
08-02-2008, 03:31 PM
quote:Originally posted by Dick Steinkamp

Along the same line, often in the Tech Forum someone will post a problem and be offered solutions, but we never hear back from the OP if the problem was solved and what fixed it. I would suggest that it is also common courtesy for those requesting help to respond back with updates and a conclusion. Some do and it is appreciated. We all get to learn something that way.

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

Dick has hit on one of my pet peeves. Although I only rarely am expert or knowledgeable enough to respond to requests for advice, I am often struck by how often expert assistance goes unacknowledged. Even if no research is required, just typing out an answer takes a few minutes of time -- looking up part numbers in a parts book and/or verifying procedures in a shop manual can easily amount to an hour or more.

Many of us old timers gained our Stude knowledge "the hard way" in the pre-Internet age. While most of us are glad to share what we know with others, it would be nice to get at least a simple thank you for taking the time to respond.

Skip Lackie
Washington DC

08-02-2008, 04:58 PM
Well, to add some courtesy here (smile) may I thank all those who offer their advice and parts/skills to help the rest of us learn more/repair our vehicles.

John Clements
Avantilover, your South Australian Studebaker lover!!!
Secretary Studebaker Car Club of SA (as of 3/19/08)
Lockleys South Australia

08-02-2008, 05:58 PM
As to Dick's and Skip's complaints about not receiving followups on tech information, I am guilty as charged--see Steeltech Adapters on Tech forum. Sorry.


08-02-2008, 08:57 PM
OK-MY 2 cents...I agree what Ray posted,AND I ADMIT I am sometimes too darn slow in responding,but I do get it done. What whizzes me off is if I send someone a part and they never send the payment,offer a email explaining why,or if they DID NOT get whatever I sent,they do not say so either!
I do not make a living selling Stude parts,but whatever I do get supplements my meager income for fixing up Studebakers.I ain't gonna beg,but you bet I ain't gonna help ya out anymore either.
And in the next breath,let me publicly say THANK YOU to everyone who HAS been kind enough to help ME out with parts and advise.And I also publicly say I am sorry if I have been slow in responding to anyone here.

08-02-2008, 09:32 PM
Well, I kinda have a knowledge of where Ray is coming from.

I do not sell parts for a living. I just clear out accumulation from past projects. I once had a guy who asked for a SPECIFIC Part # Lark part. I had one so I sold it to him at a cheap price because I was tired of looking at it in my garage. Two weeks later I get a nasty email saying the part didn't fit. I couldn't understand what it wouldn't work - as it was exactly the specific part the guy asked for! Turns out he was asking for the totally wrong year part for his car and blamed me for his own ignorance. How can I know if it will work or not when he dosen't tell me what the intented usage is and asks only for a specific part #!

08-02-2008, 10:29 PM
I've thanked them privately already, but I'd like to extend a public "thank you" to Biggs, StudeRich, Bams and Kent for parts, and to all of the above and all the others - Dave Gahlbeck, Glen, Jeff Rice, Dick Steinkamp, Leonard, and MANY more - who've offered public and private help, advice and encouragement.

I would probably not be involved in this hobby if it weren't for all of you guys and the support I've received on this forum.



Clark in San Diego
'63 F2/Lark Standard

08-02-2008, 10:38 PM
As most know, this forum was never intended to be a place for buying and selling parts/services. Please, let's not repeat all the arguments in favor of a classified service here as that's not what I'm getting to.

This forum's internal email system is a poor way to conduct transactions. Why?

First, I'm not so confident of its reliability. As others have noted, such emails are often seen as spam and lay dormant in some folder. Plus, it is true that we've had problems with the internal email system in the past and while it appears to be working now, I am somewhat skeptical as to how good it is. Therefore, I'd NOT use the internal system for communications of great importance.

Second, when you use the internal email system you won't have a copy of your message to refer to later. Lack of a paper trail is not good for buyers or sellers methinks.

I suggest this: Anyone who posts a wanted or for sale item on the forum should include their off-forum contact information in the post. Or, if you have the item wanted, simply post "I have what you need...email me off-forum at (email address)". To avoid automated email "harvesters" write out your email address as, mynameATmyisp.com or some other coding you prefer. This will allow the buyer/seller to contact you directly and, in my opinion, more reliably.

60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

08-03-2008, 01:54 AM
Webmaster, Good call on all counts.


08-03-2008, 06:17 AM
:) What Sal said. [8D]BP

08-04-2008, 01:48 PM

Mea culpa! I had enquired about one of your throttle bellcranks, and you responded to me quickly by e-mail. Yes, I had every intention of contacting you again, but in the meantime, I got to working every spare minute that I could getting our car ready for shows here in PA. I do apologize and regret that I am part of the problem.

Kindest regards,

Alan Mende
Hummelstown, PA

I'm not a mechanic; I don't even play one on TV.

08-04-2008, 02:04 PM
I feel your pain Ray, I've felt the same way. I've thought about getting out of the upholstery because of a few, very vocal complaints about pricing. I'm getting it from both sides, my factory is not nuts about my 20 percent mark up affecting their other dealers full list pricing at 50 points, while others feels I should sell under cost.
As to replying to wanted requests, I'll give up since I too seldom get a reply after digging through my stash and replying. It's far easier to just plop them on ebay then try and help here.

"I'm a great believer in luck and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it."
Thomas Jefferson