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loc8tor
04-30-2008, 08:53 PM
OK, we are all feeling the crunch at the pump. So what is a good choice for a daily driver Studebaker that gets good mileage...., is the "gas economizer" the 6cyl, stude/chebby lark, or maybe a 259 Hawk, or ?????
Let me know what you guys think.....

hmmm, my girlfriend has 2 GT Hawks....and I feel left out, wheres my "R" model Daytona????

FlatheadGeo
04-30-2008, 08:55 PM
I prefer to use my flathead 6, 57 Champion.

1957 Studebaker Champion 2 door. Staten Island, New York.

62champ
04-30-2008, 09:29 PM
My '62 Lark with 259 & 3 sp/OD I drove for 10 years made 19 in town and up to 26 on the highway...I think if a person played around with jets, tuning and rear/tranny ratios, you could get a V8 to make 30 mpg or so.

railway
04-30-2008, 09:39 PM
62 Champ, what rear ratio in your lark?

Ebon...

62champ
04-30-2008, 09:43 PM
quote:Originally posted by railway

62 Champ, what rear ratio in your lark?

Ebon...





It had ratio of 3.31.

rockne10
04-30-2008, 09:45 PM
My '63 Cruiser 289 was built with a straight 3-speed. I don't remember what the rear ratio was but, after I installed the overdrive tranny it got 28mpg on the highway, and that was keeping up with traffic. If geared properly, there was very little difference between the sixes and the eights.

Thirty or so years ago there was an article in one of the car magazines about a fellow who went to extremes on his '53 Champion and managed to get 36mpg. It's a shame I didn't hang on to that article.
I suspect he had a 3-speed OD, 3.07 rear and did a lot of coasting.

lstude
04-30-2008, 09:46 PM
Studebaker published some gas mileage charts in 59. Most of the time the V8s got better gas mileage than the sixes.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/59SGasolinemileagechart.jpg
http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/59VGasolinemileagechart.jpg


Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/52Commander41108sm3.jpg

Gary1953
04-30-2008, 10:03 PM
I can tell you one not to use for a daily driver for gas milage, a 1953 Commander with automatic.

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l269/gsandes50/Picture008.jpg
Gary Sanders
Nixa, MO
President Toy Studebaker Collectors Club. Have an interest in Toy Studebakers? Contact me for details.

rockne10
04-30-2008, 10:23 PM
Back when my '53 Commander 232 w/automatic was my daily driver I was getting 22-23 on the highway.

Upon its resurrection it will have the 289 from my Cruiser, with a FOM pushing a 3.07 TT rear. Hopefully I can report the mileage sometime this year.

Lark289
04-30-2008, 10:37 PM
Leonard,

Thanks for posting the fuel mileage chart. You always post the best pictures. It is interesting that the mileage chart tops out at 60. Many highways now have 70 to 75 MPH speed limits.

Jeff




Ready for a trip to the beach!

http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u36/Lark289/StudeRamblerPic.jpg

studeclunker
05-01-2008, 12:44 AM
I get around twenty MPG with my '56 (see my sig. line). It has an overdrive tranny, however I am unable to engage the OD right now (howls like a banshee when I try). I average around 45 to 50 miles per hour and rarely travel on the freeway. By the way, that's mountain driving too.;)

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/december%2006/HPIM0234.jpg http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b18/Studeclunker/56%20Parkview%20Wagon/56wagonleftfrontclipped-1.jpg
Home of the famous Mr. Ed!
Lotsa Larks!
K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Studebaker!
Ron Smith
Where the heck is Lewiston, CA?

53k
05-02-2008, 07:40 PM
The '61 Cruiser I bought new, 259, automatic, a/c, averaged 18.65 miles per gallon for the entire 65,000 miles I had the car. Much of this was eastern suburban driving with some highway (23 mog on the hghway). Yes, I recorded every gasoline purchase in a log I kept (obsessive compulsive[:I]).


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine
1962 Gravely Model L (Studebaker-Packard serial plate)
1972 Gravely Model 430 (Studebaker name plate, Studebaker Onan engine)

bams50
05-02-2008, 08:54 PM
I've heard the sixes weren't any better than the 259s. Anybody done any real-life comparisons?



Robert (Bob) Andrews Owner- Studebakeracres- on the IoMT (Island of Misfit Toys!)
Parish, central NY 13131

"Some people live for the rules, I live for exceptions"- 311

"With your Lark you're on your own, free as a bird, alive as a Lark. You've suddenly discovered that happiness is a thing called Larking!"

loc8tor
05-02-2008, 09:16 PM
Id like to know the diff between the 6, 259 and 289 in the same body also.....just so I have a better idea....

hmmm, my girlfriend has 2 GT Hawks....and I feel left out, wheres my "R" model Daytona????

hank63
05-03-2008, 10:05 AM
If I bought a car for fuel consumption reasons, I'd have a little 4 cyl asian egg beater. People ask me how much fuel my car uses, I always answer "full tank"
/H

JDP
05-03-2008, 10:16 AM
I'd bet a beer that you could not find a stock Studebaker that would deliver a true 23 MPG at the typical 70-75 MPH highway speed, not a prayer of getting 30 MPG unless you cruise at 30 MPH.

JDP/Maryland

blackhawk
05-03-2008, 03:43 PM
quote:Originally posted by 62champ

My '62 Lark with 259 & 3 sp/OD I drove for 10 years made 19 in town and up to 26 on the highway...I think if a person played around with jets, tuning and rear/tranny ratios, you could get a V8 to make 30 mpg or so.

<div align="left">1960 Lark VI</div id="left"> <div align="right">1962 7E7-122</div id="right">
[img=left]http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/62champ/car/8b0ac4c6.jpg[/img=left]
[img=right]http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/62champ/car/DSC02237.jpg[/img=right]

My experience is similar to yours. I used to have a '61 Lark station wagon with 259 V8, WCFB carb, 3 speed overdrive transmission and 3.54:1 R/A. I frequently got around 25 mpg on the open highway driving 70 mph. I think the 259 is more efficient than the 289. I know the WCFB seems to get a bad rap these days, but a good one that is not worn out is a wonderful carburetor in my opinion. They can be very efficient if set up properly and you don't romp on the throttle a lot. Even when you do, the secondaries are small compared to the AFB. I calculated mileage based on odometer readings so guess there is room for error but I alway checked mine against highway mile posts (you know, 1 minute to go a measured mile at 60 mph) and published distances between cities. I changed speedometer pinion gears as needed to get reasonably accurate speedometer readings for the tires I was running. So, I feel the mileage calculations that I made were fairly close to "true" but I will concede that I don't know for sure. Right now, all the engines I have are too run out (in need of overhaul) to go out and try to get data that might convince the skeptics. By the way, when I put that same drive train in a '63 Wagonaire, gas mileage and performance really dropped. The extra weight of the sliding roof and x-member frame was a killer, but no surprise there.

Personally, if I wanted a daily driver Studebaker capable of getting good gas mileage at todays highway speeds, I'd get or build a 2-door lark sedan (lightest body) equipped with 259 CID V8, 3 speed overdrive transmission and 3.54:1 rear axle and use the 2 barrel Stromberg or 4-barrel Carter WCFB carburetor.

Dale
Fairbanks, Alaska

HammondA100
05-07-2008, 10:22 AM
Well I am getting started on a 55 Commander K body resto and am planning for a fuel injection conversion oon the 259. I have my hands on just about everything except for a custom intake throttle body and air cleaner adapter.
Should be measurably more efficient. I am also seeking out the cost for a VW 1.9 diesel adapter to connect to a 3-speed overdrive. If I can get a good price this would allow folks to drive their studes more and experement with vegitable oil and other bio-fuels.
We'll see what I can come up with.

Ches in So.Dakota
55 Commander Coupe in parts.

jackb
05-07-2008, 02:29 PM
Ches: if you don't mind...roughly how much do you expect to pay for a complete, working system ?

HammondA100
05-09-2008, 11:40 AM
All together including the HEI distributer about $3200. But you can do it for a LOT less and more. That was for ported fuel injection where I would have to send in the heads and intake for work but you could also adapt a simple throttle body FI system taken from a 80's vehicle of similar CI. We did this on a Corvair using a renault from the 80's with a center mounted intake manifold. The corvair had 2-carbs so we (club members) just built a center mount system and it worked quite well after adjustments.
http://www.affordable-fuel-injection.com/


Here is the people who were willing to work with me on this. I would like to get a 2nd 259 to have this done while I drive the car though...


Take a look at the trucks at the bottom of this link - electric conversions. This site did have some gas to diesel conversions by the way but they are gone. http://www.canev.com/testimonials/testimonials%20index.htm


Ches in So.Dakota
55 Commander Coupe in parts.

willbhere4u
01-28-2014, 04:13 PM
I got 27mpg average on the hwy from Denver to Vegas and back 75-80mph in my 1957 Packard Clipper with 289 supercharger and auto trans. I attribute this all to the supercharger. As I could cruise at 80mph with my foot barley touching the gas pedal.

63t-cab
01-28-2014, 04:22 PM
Hard to imagine all that with a 3:07 ?.but if He did any coasting,I would dis-qualify Him :ohmy:

My '63 Cruiser 289 was built with a straight 3-speed. I don't remember what the rear ratio was but, after I installed the overdrive tranny it got 28mpg on the highway, and that was keeping up with traffic. If geared properly, there was very little difference between the sixes and the eights.

Thirty or so years ago there was an article in one of the car magazines about a fellow who went to extremes on his '53 Champion and managed to get 36mpg. It's a shame I didn't hang on to that article.
I suspect he had a 3-speed OD, 3.07 rear and did a lot of coasting.

rockinhawk
01-28-2014, 06:01 PM
Awhile back my son followed me on a 75 mile road trip. I was driving a 63 GT 289 4bbl auto P/S, P/B. James was driving a 51 Champion Starlight with OD. We kept our speed around 60-65. I got 18 mpg, James got 32!
I told him it was because he was drafting me.

StudeRich
01-28-2014, 06:23 PM
Always remember that the Mileage that Studebaker's testing got, what we got "in the day" and what we got before E10 Ethanol laced Fuel DO NOT COUNT! Today's Mileage is a lot different. :(


We would all be better for it as our Fuel gets worse and worse, if we could and would break the piggybank and install stays fresh and powerful forever, Propane Power. :!:

jclary
01-28-2014, 09:17 PM
I'd bet a beer that you could not find a stock Studebaker that would deliver a true 23 MPG at the typical 70-75 MPH highway speed, not a prayer of getting 30 MPG unless you cruise at 30 MPH.
JDP/Maryland

I know we love our Studes ...talk them up...try to promote them in the best possible way. I'm as guilty as any...but as much as I hate to...I'll have to agree with Mr. brutally blunt JDP. I think the best I ever got from one of my Studebakers is my '60 four door Lark with it's 259 two barrel and automatic tranny. My four speed 289 GT hawk running a four bbl wasn't bad, but even with the Lark...I kept reverting back to my younger years and couldn't help but play with the torque of my V8's. That always messes with the gas consumption.

I think I exceeded 20mpg on my Lark on a couple of highway trips. However, that was when it was perfectly tuned, aspirating well with a new air filter, dual exhaust, and not running the air conditioner. However, back when I was using that car on my sales calls, I had a difficult time restraining myself from taking the opportunity to blow away any modern cigar shaped car dawdling in my way...on a steep uphill grade.;)

My little '48 Business Coupe, with the overdrive, has checked out at 28mpg, but that was on a trip to the flat lands on the coast. The problem with the '48 is that, in my opinion, it is a bit fragile and too nicely restored to be a daily driver.

mbstude
01-28-2014, 09:28 PM
I think I checked the fuel consumption, once, in the 58 Commander I had just for grins. I think it was roughly in the high teens. I don't remember checking it in any other Stude I've owned.

If you're concerned with fuel economy, you're most certainly in the wrong hobby. It just seems silly to buy a 60 year old collector car and expect it to perform like a new Honda. Pay the price to enjoy your old car, or buy a new econobox.

Just my opinion, of course.

acolds
01-28-2014, 11:28 PM
The gas mileage for my Clipper with supercharger and my brothers 56 President classic are almost the same. When we went to Gettysburg driving route 30 in Pa we both filled up with gas at same time and the difference in gas added at each stop was minimal. Did not check mpg but the route we took was for enjoyment. When we go together the gas used is very close except I use hi test.
When I was in Army in 1965 my 61 hawk with 4 speed and 3.54 rear would get over 20 mpg on trips home from Ft Belvoir and the speed was up there being young and foolish at that time.

Hallabutt
01-29-2014, 12:55 AM
Dad was a traveling man who had driven Champions since he gave up his Chevrolet in 1939. He owned a 1940, 1947, 1951 and a 1956, all two door cars. He loved his Champions for the gas mileage but I remember that he was a bit upset when he was unable to get a 3.73 gear ratio with od on his 1956. He kept exhaustive records which indicated a very consistent 24 mpg with 4.10 ratio and od. My uncle John, in Spokane, had a neibor who bought a new 1963 Lark Daytona htp which car my dad fell in love with. He told John that if the man ever wanted to sell the car that he would be interested. About a year later the man passed away and John called to ask dad if he really wanted the car or had he just been blowing smoke. Whatever his original intent dad must have felt obliged and bought the car. I could tell that he was having second thoughts as he got ready to take the 300 mile bus trip to get pick it up and I knew the driving differences and the anticipated lower gas mileage was playing on his mind. The new car had a 259 V8, ps and pb but had 3.07 cr, none of which he had ever had. One thing that I will always remember was the smile on his face when he home and found out that he was getting almost exactly the same mileage with the Daytona as he had been getting with his Champ. I still own the car "Malarkey," which became part of my collection upon my fathers passing in 1988. As my faithful companion it has taken me all over the western US and while I was able to verify 24 mpg early on today 19-20 is about all that I can expect.-Bill

Bob Andrews
01-29-2014, 05:23 AM
It's frustrating when somebody revives a thread from SIX years ago. The information and opinions usually don't match up with current times.

bezhawk
01-29-2014, 09:59 AM
It's frustrating when somebody revives a thread from SIX years ago. The information and opinions usually don't match up with current times.
Lots of things have changed. The gas is much worse, fuel injection is better and cheaper than it was, and mostly, fewer people actually drive Their Studebakers anymore for any distance. Even I don't drive one for daily transportation like I used to do.

Chartrain
11-21-2018, 11:20 PM
Granted i’m not the lightest foot in town but my 63 GT with 289 4 bbl & duals consistently yields 6 mpg with a new Edelbrock carb

StudeRich
11-22-2018, 02:12 AM
I always have to wonder HOW some of us even FIND these 10 Year Old Strings! :confused:

But what was true then is true today, and still no better with the Low Performance Fuel.
I even heard someone here say their State actually allows the sale of E85! :mad: :mad:

I thought Congress shot that down years ago, we don't allow that stuff West of the Rockies.

Ray, you must have gotten the 600 cfm Edelbrock by mistake and or, you have NO Overdrive and 3.54 or 3.73 Rear Gears!

chet445
11-22-2018, 09:21 AM
I own two Studebakers and have owned 5 others; used each as daily drivers. Never attained any more than 15 MPG often less. Either some are holding out on the secret for getting better mileage or I consistently owned cars that were never going to cut the mustard. Chet445

mike cenit
11-22-2018, 10:31 AM
They sell E 85 in Michigan, in the off chance some of it gets into the tank of my Ram pick up the check engine light goes on withing 20 miles. if you want to know way it's still sold come to the Midwest,
and see some of the production facilities, somebody is getting rich on the stuff.

Dick Steinkamp
11-22-2018, 11:17 AM
I even heard someone here say their State actually allows the sale of E85! :mad: :mad:

I thought Congress shot that down years ago, we don't allow that stuff West of the Rockies.



All states west of the Rockies (except Hawaii and Alaska) sell e85.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85_in_the_United_States

Congress is a big supporter of e85. It gets them farm state vote AND the environmentalist vote ;)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

Lots of opinions and politics on this subject, but as Jeff quotes...Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

:D

bensherb
11-22-2018, 12:36 PM
All states west of the Rockies (except Hawaii and Alaska) sell e85.

:D

That's what I thought when I read his statement last night. It's about all they seem to sell here. I was going to comment then but wanted to check my facts first, but fell asleep. Getin old sucks! :lol:

j.byrd
11-22-2018, 01:54 PM
E85 gas has been available in Honolulu since Oct 2010. https://www.cspdailynews.com/fuels/aloha-delivers-first-supply-e85-hawaii I suppose it is still in use, but I have real cars, so use real gas that is available at 5 or 6 stations and Costco here in Kailua-Kona. No lead, but sure does fine anyway.

StudeRich
11-22-2018, 02:09 PM
Dick, I don't think Mr. Wikipedia lives in Washington, or Hawaii! :rolleyes: They have it, and we don't.

TWChamp
11-22-2018, 02:43 PM
I know of 2 people who thought E-85 would save them money, but they learned the mileage was so much worse it wasn't worth it. To make matter s worse, both people had to replace the engines at about 65,000 miles, and this was on vehicles labeled as being made to run E-85.

The University of Minnesota is a liberal college, and I was surprised to see one of the professors on the news two years ago stating that ethanol is a mistake and is actually worse for the environment.

Hallabutt
11-22-2018, 02:57 PM
What is verified is that the current administration has sot to, again, emphasize the use of higher alcohol content in fuel (E85). We also know that clean air is no longer the goal. We also have a glut of shale oil, the production of which has been slowed because of low oil prices. What is unsubstantiated, is that the increase in alcohol production is tied to the administration's efforts at lessening the effects of the tariffs on farmers, that have lost some of their overseas markets because of the tariffs. In other words imposing a tax on the rest of us. Everyone needs to decide for himself what he believes the motive might be.

Flashback
11-23-2018, 04:09 PM
My 53, with a 55 259, four barrel, 3 speed, with overdrive, got between 21 and 23 mixed driving, for about 2500 miles. this was with a 3:42 rear end. Tore it apart and put a 63 R1 in it, with a demon carb. Ran it 250 miles and checked it during this time. It go 15, mixed driving. Getting better. Now I am gonna switch the 3:42 for a 4:10 with hopes it will get even better. I am not concerned with what the political and over educated think. I do this for fun. My sport trac V8 gets about 19-21, and my wife's yukon gets 15-21. When I was diving a M-5 for my daily driver, it got super gas mileage. Course it had a Ford 4 cylinder. No more than I have been able to drive my 53, for the last three years, I suppose the mileage doesn't matter.. LOL

Jerry Forrester
11-23-2018, 05:15 PM
Hello Tex, long time no see, hear, read, whatever.
Studebaker mileage should be measured in smiles per mile, not miles per gallon.


My 53, with a 55 259, four barrel, 3 speed, with overdrive, got between 21 and 23 mixed driving, for about 2500 miles. this was with a 3:42 rear end. Tore it apart and put a 63 R1 in it, with a demon carb. Ran it 250 miles and checked it during this time. It go 15, mixed driving. Getting better. Now I am gonna switch the 3:42 for a 4:10 with hopes it will get even better. I am not concerned with what the political and over educated think. I do this for fun. My sport trac V8 gets about 19-21, and my wife's yukon gets 15-21. When I was diving a M-5 for my daily driver, it got super gas mileage. Course it had a Ford 4 cylinder. No more than I have been able to drive my 53, for the last three years, I suppose the mileage doesn't matter.. LOL

edpjr
11-23-2018, 07:43 PM
I typically measure the gas usage of my Avanti in gallons per mile of 110 octane leaded fuel... The car will fly, but you can literally see the gas gauge going down as you speed along.

Dan White
11-23-2018, 08:06 PM
I am not sure I am getting this correctly Flashback. You are planning to change out the rear from 3:42 to 4:10 and hope to get better mileage?

StudeRich
11-23-2018, 08:30 PM
I have to wonder what Brand of Rear End Flashback has!

They are not Studebaker/Dana Model 44's with those ratios.
They are: 3.07, 3.31, 3.54, 3.73, 4.09, 4.27 and 4.55

With a 259 and Overdrive and a Model 44, the Best mileage and highest Ratio to use without lugging it, stressing the Clutch, not being able to pull the Car in High Overdrive on slight grades etc. would be 3.54, if you are really looking for penny pinching and NO Fun, MAYBE a 3.31.

Jerry Forrester
11-24-2018, 09:20 AM
I have to wonder what Brand of Rear End Flashback has!

They are not Studebaker/Dana Model 44's with those ratios.
They are: 3.07, 3.31, 3.54, 3.73, 4.09, 4.27 and 4.55

With a 259 and Overdrive and a Model 44, the Best mileage and highest Ratio to use without lugging it, stressing the Clutch, not being able to pull the Car in High Overdrive on slight grades etc. would be 3.54, if you are really looking for penny pinching and NO Fun, MAYBE a 3.31.

Flashback's '53 has an S-10 Chevy rear axle assy.

Flashback
11-24-2018, 10:09 AM
I am not sure I am getting this correctly Flashback. You are planning to change out the rear from 3:42 to 4:10 and hope to get better mileage?

This was a joke Dan. Everything I have done has led to worse gas mileage. I was just saying , I was getting better mileage backwards. LOL

Flashback
11-24-2018, 10:13 AM
Hello Tex, long time no see, hear, read, whatever.
Studebaker mileage should be measured in smiles per mile, not miles per gallon.

Completely agree, Jerry. However , in the last 3 years, I have had very few miles to smile. LOL Hoping to get back on my car soon. Maybe spring, I can catch up with you somewhere and jaw a little.