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Ron Dame
01-08-2019, 05:17 PM
I'm finally ready to get the heads back on RS1034, and in reviewing the shop manual realized there should be hollow dowels (probably pipes?) in the block going into the head. I know someone was inside this engine before and made a mess, and those dowels were not in there when I took it apart.
since the head gasket seals the area, what is the function of them? Are they really needed? If I need them, to avoid another hurry up and wait by ordering a pair, anyone know offhand what is out in the hardware store that would work?
I WILL finish this SOB, but it sure is putting up a fight!

345 DeSoto
01-08-2019, 05:34 PM
The dowels (solid dowels) are there to properly align the head to the block, and head gaskets...

11SecAvanti
01-08-2019, 05:42 PM
Ron ,you can order the dowels from Studebaker International. They have to be tapped in carefully and centered straight. I use a special driver. Order some spares in case of oh s$$. Yes you need them to hold and align the gasket as well as the cylinder head. A setback for now but dowels are necessary.

jclary
01-08-2019, 05:46 PM
I would like to have an engine builder like Jack Vines post his input here. Yes, I think the dowels help keep the heads aligned, but once the head bolts are in place, it looks like the dowels are not needed for just that function anymore. As long as the head gasket is properly sealing, I'm not so sure what other functions the dowels serve. It could have been for factory assembly purposes, where the dowels helped hold the heads in place as a time saving and process function. I would like to know.

11SecAvanti
01-08-2019, 05:58 PM
Again, they align the headgasket so that the fire ring does not overhang into the cylinder bore. Then the head drops down also in perfect alignment with the block and gasket.

64V-K7
01-08-2019, 05:59 PM
The dowels are to allow the head to stay in pace and not slide off the block while you locate and insert the head bolts..... not rocket science...

jclary
01-08-2019, 07:06 PM
The dowels are to allow the head to stay in pace and not slide off the block while you locate and insert the head bolts..... not rocket science...

You are correct...it is not rocket science...and our toes are grateful;)

Mike Van Veghten
01-08-2019, 07:29 PM
1. As incorrectly mentioned above, these are "sleeves" NOT...solid dowels.

2. Because the heads will be under pressure, that is, can be lifted OFF of the block by the combustion process, the sleeves NEED to be in place...for ever. No desire to remove them after the head placement, even if one could.

3. They semi-precisely locate both the gasket and cylinder head onto the block. This IS a requirement for cylinder head location about the deck of the block. Otherwise, the port alignment of the intake manifold would be off. The intake manifold gaskets would NOT seal. The water passages (block to head) "may" leak.

4. The rear sleeve location has a hole in the block for oil return from the cylinder head to the oil pan. No hole in the front. "DO NOT" install a solid dowel in this rear location.

Mike

PackardV8
01-08-2019, 07:40 PM
Yes, agree with all the above. They align the heads and gaskets during assembly.

No, they're not dowels, which are solid. They're hollow steel sleeves.

jack vines

StudeRich
01-08-2019, 07:44 PM
Yes, that is JUST what you need Ron. :lol: The Oil returning from the Rocker Arms pouring INTO the Head Gasket, on the Block and on the Head without the Sleeves or overflowing the heads and running out of Oil with a Solid Pin installed. :( :rolleyes:

Ron Dame
01-08-2019, 07:48 PM
Gawd , someone fd this thing up.just another hurry up and wait.

Ron Dame
01-09-2019, 05:04 PM
I decided to clean shop today and get parts organized again, my shop is a very small space and goes to crap quickly. I found the missing head bolts still in a can of Berryman's, but no dowels/sleeves. I am 90% sure they were not in the block or heads when I tore it down.

My newest headache is that I've lost some photos! This is an R2 Avanti, and that is important. The brackets that hold the ignition shielding: which head bolts do they go under?
On the right side only (I think) two of the head bolts are, for better words, double sided, with a 1"+/- fine thread "bolt" on top. Again, which holes do these go in?

bezhawk
01-09-2019, 06:40 PM
Ron, the head bolts with the top studs are fr the supercharger bracket, and go on the passenger side front on top of the exhaust port.
78024Here is where the shielding brackets go. (R1) but the same location.

Ron Dame
01-10-2019, 07:01 AM
Thanks Brad!

Ron Dame
01-17-2019, 05:25 PM
I got both the sleeves and time and got the heads back on. Today was kind of cold, so it seemed an ideal time to try for the fourth time to get the danged harmonic balancer back on the crank (Avanti, with rubber). I've tried but the threads in the crank are compromised but cleaned up, and the old bolt was trashed, though I have a new bolt (for $30!) So I want to keep forces to a minimum, and I am sure not going to hammer the thing on!

I checked both the crank and the balancer for nicks and scores and such. I did need to clean up the keyway in the balancer where the key would not pass.
I've been heating the balancer to about 275F before trying, but still am not having much success. How hot can I heat it and not degrade the rubber? Any other advice?

Studebakercenteroforegon
01-17-2019, 06:25 PM
Studebakerparts.com markets a pusher tool to install the crankshaft hub assembly. Much better to use rather than a selection of crank bolts and washers, wondering when you are going to damage the threads in the crankshaft.

sals54
01-17-2019, 11:59 PM
I bought an engine several years ago which was rebuilt. Major oil problems in the valve covers. Pulling the valve covers found dowels in the holes. Replaced with sleeves which I got from my local machine shop and still running the engine today. It WAS a decent rebuild after all. Just had someone not totally familiar with the nuances of Stude engineering.

sweetolbob
01-18-2019, 10:59 AM
Studebakerparts.com markets a pusher tool to install the crankshaft hub assembly. Much better to use rather than a selection of crank bolts and washers, wondering when you are going to damage the threads in the crankshaft.

I'd wouldn't heat the balancer any hotter than you have. The above advice is excellent if you are trying to use a bolt to pull on the balancer. Hopefully you are using one like was suggested above at Studebakerparts.

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/31cXQIZLP4L.jpg

Just commenting to be sure. Bob

Ron Dame
01-18-2019, 11:04 AM
Thanks all. I have been trying the bolt, and been afraid of ruing the threads even more than they have been. I'll stop and order the tool. Thanks!

5brown1
01-18-2019, 11:50 AM
Studebakerpartsonline, will rent the tool to you. I just used it and it made the job a snap. And fast shipping.

Ron Dame
01-18-2019, 01:22 PM
That's fabulous news 5Brown1! Thanks!

kxet
01-18-2019, 03:24 PM
If you still have trouble check key, sometimes they are too high in keyway. If it was together before with same parts you should be ok. Happens with new parts.

Ron Dame
01-18-2019, 05:02 PM
Same parts. Of course removing the key can move metal around, so any burs or high spots were levelled out. There was no crud in the crank keyway , the the hub was cleaned and checked my sliding the key through.
Studebaker parts.com lends the tool for a deposit of the price of a new one, and refund it all! So many great vendors out there, and I need to throw some business their way too!

Ron Dame
01-19-2019, 11:16 AM
A BIG shout out to Lanny Bertram! He lives under 10 miles from me and had this, so not only do I have the balancer on (with 0.004" end play) but a new Studebaker friend! He's got a gorgeous '63 factory R2 4 speed Lark. Watch out this summer, we don't have an official drag strip within 100 miles or more, but we have Reems Creek Road!

sweetolbob
01-19-2019, 11:29 AM
ixnay on the eemsray reekcay oadray. No need to publish exuberant driving locations. :woot: Good deal, Bob

Ron Dame
01-19-2019, 01:29 PM
Don't worry Bob, It's well patrolled, so only an inside joke@!

Ron Dame
01-19-2019, 01:37 PM
And for the latest installment of "Hurry Up and Wait!"
In today's episode, we find progress! Ron has successfully installed the damper and found crank end play to be in spec. As we move forward, Ron is starting to install the oil pan.

"WTF?!? I have only the rear cork, three side pan gaskets and no front cork!" And look! Four valve cover gaskets and.. WTF is this thing? It's not for a Studebaker, and it's all from a manufacturer's sealed package!"

Tune in tomorrow for a new episode of Hurry Up and Wait, where Ron asks if anyone has just the front cork for a Studie V8.

70Avanti2
01-19-2019, 01:46 PM
Maybe you can make it its just cork

Ron Dame
01-19-2019, 02:06 PM
Maybe you can make it its just corkall I have are wine corks. What kind and how many?
Seriously, if you know the size, I could probably do just that.

Lanny Bertram
01-19-2019, 03:48 PM
Ron, I replaced my pan gaskets this winter. I purchased an extra set. I have no use for them now. They are yours if you want to come get them.

Ron Dame
01-19-2019, 03:58 PM
So when and where will we have lunch? (on me of course)?